9mm used on Bear - Page 2 - 1911Forum
1911Forum
Advertise Here
Forum   Reviews   Rules   Legal   Site Supporters & Donations   Advertise


Go Back   1911Forum > >

Notices


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #26  
Old 10-26-2018, 06:03 AM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 6,547
Ok, so, the 'safe queen ' Python 357 is tucked away at home, God forbid, it gets scratched.
The front sight filed down on my 9mm....( besides it has a shorter barrel)..).
The can of spam is expired, the bear threw it back at me...
I'm not gonna shoot my son in the knee cap...

So, which 9mm bullet/ round would be better (hypothetically )?

A hollow point SD round (less penetrating) vs a heavier 147gr round ( more penetrating).?
Considering the thickness and density of a bears skin , muscle and bone.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-26-2018, 08:48 AM
Mike Chapman's Avatar
Mike Chapman Mike Chapman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Mobile Al
Posts: 2,474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plantar5 View Post
Ok, so, the 'safe queen ' Python 357 is tucked away at home, God forbid, it gets scratched.
The front sight filed down on my 9mm....( besides it has a shorter barrel)..).
The can of spam is expired, the bear threw it back at me...
I'm not gonna shoot my son in the knee cap...

So, which 9mm bullet/ round would be better (hypothetically )?

A hollow point SD round (less penetrating) vs a heavier 147gr round ( more penetrating).?
Considering the thickness and density of a bears skin , muscle and bone.


I have thought heavily on which round I would use. As a proponent of the heaviest round in the heaviest caliber you can control for the situation needed. Man i would use my 45 acp with 200gr critical defense. With Black Bear i have found out by hunting them and how they responded to my shots, I have come down to using 325 grain ftx by hornady for my 45-70 and with my 12 guage Browning Abolt i use Hornady SST 300 grain Slugs. On Brown Bear/Grizzlies I hope that my same ammunition would suffice in a close encounter. I know that one shot will get their attention if it doesn’t kill them right off then the second will tell them exactly where you are. Adrenaline will keep aware what’s happening all the time and I haven’t had to shoot more than twice. I did get queasy when my last Black Bear made to the bottom of my stand. Bears know what pain is and they know to go after what ever made the pain. I have never taken less than a 44 mag as my side arm. I am now thinking of a 10mm because of being semiautomatic and the number of follow up shots. 14 rounds vs 6 rounds does entice me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Death may stalk me but it will never take me alive. USMC 68-72
NRA Instructor Pistol, Metallic Cartridge Reloading
God is not on the side of the big battalions.
God is on the side of the best shots.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 10-26-2018, 12:47 PM
Randall M Randall M is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: SE Wash State
Posts: 2,793
9mm Luger load for bear?

Normal carry rd if I carry a 9x19

147 gr. +P Hornady XTP @ 1,100 FPS
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 10-27-2018, 06:35 AM
bmur66 bmur66 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Olean, NY
Age: 53
Posts: 224
Geez. Didn't anyone watch The Revenant?

I like the can of spam idea
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-27-2018, 07:35 AM
jeepranch jeepranch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 461
I've seen black bear dropped with a single 22 shot. I personally witnessed a momma grizzly take 5 257 Roberts, 5 270 and 3 30-06 at essentially point blank range before she gave up trying to kill us. What makes anyone think the two have anything in common? Same difference between a wiener dog and bull mastiff........

If you are by yourself multiple shots are probably unlikely

What does it take to stop a grizzly? Disassembly
__________________
"Originally Posted by gunslingergirl
"It is very simple. The model 80 is complete and total garbage only good for melting down to make steel core bullets. The model 70 was handed down from God to JMB in a devine inspiration of gunmaking genius. So take your choice"
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 10-27-2018, 07:59 AM
steviesterno steviesterno is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,897
Quote:
Originally Posted by combat auto View Post
Good and interesting point...I am somewhat surprised about all the alleged misses with 357M. Even in full power trim it isn't hard to control with practice. And that perhaps is another key point besides finding one's sweet-spot btwn power and controllability/speed, - practice and train no matter what one shoots (obvious of course)!...I personally wouldn't use a 9mm, but I had a 44mag and realized with full-power loads, it would also be less than optimal for speed and so downgraded to 357M, where even with full-power loads I shoot well. And it does bring a lot of "benefit's" to the table, like a power factor greater than 45 duty ammo and energy levels which are enough to matter. Very similar to 10mm ballistics..

What I took away from this is power doesn't matter without accuracy. I think a lot of people think of a more powerful round as the be all and end all. realistically a 22 makes a crazy loud noise and can (eventually) do enough damage to do it's job. scaring off a bear counts as a win. I would be (and have been) comfy hiking in the lower 48 with everything between a 380, 9mm, 45, 38, 357, depending on the likelyhood of snakes. I have never been alone in grizz country, as that would likely change my mind. But currently I would carry a 1911 in 45 or an M&P 2.0c in 9mm. both with good ammo. I can shoot either fast and accurately, and put enough lead down range to either scare it off or eventually do enough work.

you are more likely to be killed by a cow in America statistically than a bear. so let's not worry about it.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 10-27-2018, 08:24 AM
Descartian Descartian is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 1,841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plantar5 View Post
So, which 9mm bullet/ round would be better (hypothetically )?

A hollow point SD round (less penetrating) vs a heavier 147gr round ( more penetrating).?
Considering the thickness and density of a bears skin , muscle and bone.
You want penetration not expansion. You're trying to go through mountains of muscle, fat, gristle, and super string bones. I would go with hard cast or a solid copper projectile at the highest velocity possible.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 10-27-2018, 09:43 AM
CDMCKY CDMCKY is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 74
If I'm out "in the woods" I'm carrying my Taurus .454 Casull
with 300 gr XTP JHP's (1675/2000)


[IMG]via Imgflip GIF Maker[/IMG]
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 10-27-2018, 10:01 AM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 6,547
Quote:
Originally Posted by Descartian View Post
You want penetration not expansion. You're trying to go through mountains of muscle, fat, gristle, and super string bones. I would go with hard cast or a solid copper projectile at the highest velocity possible.
That was my rational, question and point I thought might be correct based on the OP.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 10-27-2018, 10:25 AM
hardluk1 hardluk1 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,370
This tread started out about a guy that lives in southern lower alllabama black bear country but took a left turn along the way and ended up in grizzle ,brown and still waiting on the polar bear .
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 10-27-2018, 10:47 AM
John Joseph John Joseph is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,725
9mm?
It's not what I would choose.
I would choose not to get in a fight with a bear.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 10-27-2018, 11:00 AM
Sock Sock is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,516
I do have a 9mm that would probably do the trick. 30 round mag in under two seconds...
__________________
I support the only reasonable restriction of the Second Amendment. After all, who really needs a nuclear weapon?
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 10-27-2018, 11:05 AM
ambidextrous1 ambidextrous1 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: El Paso, Texas
Age: 88
Posts: 1,689
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Joseph View Post
9mm?
It's not what I would choose.
I would choose not to get in a fight with a bear.
Yeah, sure, but maybe the bear will choose differently...
__________________
Rich (in name only)
Member, Fort Bliss Rod & Gun Club
Benefactor Member, NRA
Well, yes, I have a few guns...
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 10-27-2018, 11:53 AM
Sock Sock is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,516
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambidextrous1 View Post
Yeah, sure, but maybe the bear will choose differently...
Possible.
Attached Thumbnails
7EA7322A-0286-492E-98B8-1084ABA49240.jpeg  
__________________
I support the only reasonable restriction of the Second Amendment. After all, who really needs a nuclear weapon?
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 10-27-2018, 12:05 PM
Taco Picasso Taco Picasso is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Jefferson City, MO
Posts: 558
I read an article a while back about defense against vicious dogs. I only recall the last suggestion, "Offer him your weak arm." Somehow that just didn't seem like a viable strategy.
__________________
"A superior man, when resting in safety, forgets not that peril is ever present. When in a state of security, he forgets not that ruin is only a breath away. When all is orderly, he forgets not that chaos ever hovers over him. Thus, his state and clans are preserved." ************************************************** ******************** Confucius
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 10-27-2018, 12:52 PM
Grizz12 Grizz12 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Alaska
Posts: 784
Quote:
Originally Posted by magazineman View Post
I read an article on how to survive a bear attack in an outdoor magazine.

Step #1 was:

"Don't Panic"

That's the funniest thing I've ever seen in print.
Quote:
Originally Posted by magazineman View Post
So I have a 800 pound, 9 foot tall, 3" fanged bear coming at me at 40 MPH.

And I'm supposed to be chill?
When face to face with a bear, yes, chill or die. But I dont expect a kalifornian to understand that

Quote:
Originally Posted by drail View Post
It's not about what caliber you hit them with - it all about where you hit them. If you can't put it in the brainpan or brainstem you're only going to enrage them more. An old guide once told me to never go into bear country alone. If a bear starts chasing you shoot your partner in the leg and keep running.
A friend shot a charging grizz with a 300wm, the bullet entered just above the snout and the bear went down right there. They shook off their jitters and walked over to examine the bear when it started moving again, at which time they unloaded everything they had.

Autopsy showed the first round to the snout followed the bone up and around the skull, exiting the other side. The 1st bullet only knocked him out for a few seconds.

Lesson learned;
- bullet placement was perfect
- energy from the round was more than enough to do the job
- bullet design was terrible for a charging bear! A flat nose bullet would have penetrated the skull
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 10-27-2018, 01:20 PM
grendelbane grendelbane is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 805
Colt used to advertise the .38 Super as good medicine for protection from wild animals.

The .38 Super ballistics allowed for deep penetration, probably the deepest penetration available from an American handgun in the early 1930s.

Today, there are many more choices available. But a 9mm well placed can do the trick. Russians have even used both 7.62 x 25 Tokarev, and the Nagant revolver cartridge.

With luck, I will never have to put that theory to the test.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 10-27-2018, 08:05 PM
DG1 DG1 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 675
A 'manly man' would just roll up his sleeves and fistfight the darn thing...

Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 10-27-2018, 09:02 PM
scubadad scubadad is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 3,314
the bear necessities the simple bear necessities is all you need
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 10-27-2018, 09:05 PM
passx passx is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: NW Indiana
Posts: 1,273
Anyone know what the actual ballistics for a .45 black powder ball & cap Kentucky rifle is ?
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 10-27-2018, 09:17 PM
John Joseph John Joseph is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,725
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambidextrous1 View Post
Yeah, sure, but maybe the bear will choose differently...
If provoked, sure.
However Grizzlies Brownies & Polar Bears don't need provoking.
And I doubt if they'd find a 9mm very intimidating.
There is a reason the term "Loaded for bear" came into parlance.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 10-27-2018, 09:28 PM
John Joseph John Joseph is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,725
Quote:
Originally Posted by grendelbane View Post
Colt used to advertise the .38 Super as good medicine for protection from wild animals.

The .38 Super ballistics allowed for deep penetration, probably the deepest penetration available from an American handgun in the early 1930s.

Today, there are many more choices available. But a 9mm well placed can do the trick. Russians have even used both 7.62 x 25 Tokarev, and the Nagant revolver cartridge.

With luck, I will never have to put that theory to the test.
The Russians in SE Alaska also hunted brownies to extinction on some islands using black powder rifles.
In the 19th century California Grizzlies were exterminated using black powder rifles.
And big lead slugs.
Of course we never hear of those old timey hunters who became a meal for Mr. Bear.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 10-27-2018, 09:32 PM
Imissedagain's Avatar
Imissedagain Imissedagain is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 784
No “9” so please advise!
Trying to get a grip on this bear issue.
Thanks.
Attached Thumbnails
CAD26D03-F4EE-4ED5-8B1F-1A150FDC4FD3.jpeg  
__________________
Luck & Blessings: a product of design
http://sergeantviolin.com/
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 10-28-2018, 04:47 AM
Rwehavinfunyet Rwehavinfunyet is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 7,834
When in bear country.....

I used to hunt mule deer along the Utah/Colorado border which was mountainous terrain. I carried my Weatherby Vanguard 300 Win Mag, and also carried a Ruger Blackhawk .44 mag holstered on my side. I kept three rounds loaded in the rifle, and had six rounds in the Ruger in case of an emergency Fortunately for me, I never had a problem with a bear.....

If I intended to strictly hunt for bear, I would have rather carried a .338 Winchester magnum with 250gr. flat point bullets...... I just don't have any faith in a handgun round stopping a charging bear and living to tell about it......a 9mm caliber handgun would not be my choice, and I would never carry a small caliber handgun in bear country.....whether just hiking, or hunting!
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 10-28-2018, 05:28 PM
Butthead's Avatar
Butthead Butthead is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: New Jersey (ugh!)
Posts: 1,909
Quote:
Originally Posted by passx View Post
Anyone know what the actual ballistics for a .45 black powder ball & cap Kentucky rifle is ?
I bet the Old Army I have does a honest 1k FPS with a full Triple Seven loading and a .457" round ball.

Still wouldn't want to meet any Bear toting just that though.
__________________
"When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty."
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:54 AM.


NOTICE TO USERS OF THIS SITE: By continuing to use this site, you certify that you have read and agree to abide by the Legal Terms of Use. All information, data, text or other materials ("Content") posted to this site by any users are the sole responsibility of those users. 1911Forum does not guarantee the accuracy, integrity, or quality of such Content.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 2015 1911Forum.com, LLC. All Rights Reserved