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  #1  
Old 02-12-2020, 02:09 PM
Steve in Allentown Steve in Allentown is offline
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Custom deflection gauges by HS-Custom

It's time to retire my homemade deflection gauge.

Dustin Housel (HS-Custom), one of the professional 'smiths who posts here, made some .45 extractor deflection gauges for me.

He made one each in the following diameters: .460", .462". .464", .466", .468". and .470". This allows me to accurately measure and interpolate the existing deflection of any .45 extractor within this range as well as setting the deflection of any new extractor.

I know that he's made these gauges for use in other calibers as well.

I've measured each one to verify their diameters and I've got say it's a joy to have such perfectly made tools to work with.

Here are a couple of pics of mine. I asked him to drill a hole through them so I could run a string or retaining pin through them to keep them all together.



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  #2  
Old 02-12-2020, 03:18 PM
Jolly Rogers Jolly Rogers is offline
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Dustin is a good guy and fills needs others don’t see.
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  #3  
Old 02-12-2020, 04:57 PM
aprilian aprilian is offline
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Very nice!

Steve in a different thread you mentioned;
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve in Allentown View Post
And there's the challenge with using a round gauge to measure the distance between the left guide block and the extractor's tensioning wall. Glad you pointed this out.
which was in response to
Quote:
Originally Posted by megafiddle View Post
During both feeding and extraction, the case center sits below the firing pin hole.

I do all my checking with the case in this position. The case can be easily located there by sliding the barrel into the slide and onto the case with the barrel about 1/8" forward of being in battery (1/8" gap between barrel hood and breechface).

For checking deflection with a round gauge (a case rim), the case center should be aligned with the extractor tunnel center.

-
did Dustin mark the gauges to help with finding the spot that aligns with the extractor tunnel?

Last edited by aprilian; 02-12-2020 at 05:00 PM.
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  #4  
Old 02-12-2020, 06:28 PM
Steve in Allentown Steve in Allentown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megafiddle
For checking deflection with a round gauge (a case rim), the case center should be aligned with the extractor tunnel center.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aprilian View Post
Did Dustin mark the gauges to help with finding the spot that aligns with the extractor tunnel?
No, Dustin didn't. It's not necessary. Since the tensioning wall is a relatively long flat area all you need to do is visually verify that the middle of the round gauge is on the tensioning wall and on the left guide block which also has a relatively long flat area. Getting the exact center of the gauge precisely lined up with the center of the tunnel is overkill.
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  #5  
Old 02-12-2020, 08:26 PM
megafiddle megafiddle is offline
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Nice little gauges!

I need to make a set from brass cases. Much easier to use than my original method of using a cut off case rim from the ammo I intended to use, and measuring deflection with calipers.

That's mainly why I referred to needing alignment between the two axes. Different method of measurement.

For a gauge set, it's only necessary that the gauge passes completely through the breechface passage way.

-
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  #6  
Old 02-13-2020, 06:24 AM
JamieC JamieC is offline
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I think I know how they are used, could you fully explain?
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  #7  
Old 02-13-2020, 07:40 AM
passx passx is offline
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Any idea of the cost of these ?
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  #8  
Old 02-13-2020, 08:40 AM
Steve in Allentown Steve in Allentown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieC View Post
I think I know how they are used, could you fully explain?
It's the same idea as the flat homemade gauges that I show in the extractor fitting sticky. The business end of the round one is the end of the greatest diameter. There's a short shaft with a hole in it that extends from the business end. All you do is:
  • grab the shaft
  • place the wide end against the lower edge of the breechface
  • push the gauge solidly against the left guide block as you slide the gauge up the breechface
  • if the gauge just kisses the extractor's tensioning wall as you slide the gauge up the breechface then the deflection is the width of the business end
  • if the gauge doesn't touch the tensioning wall then the deflection is less than the business end
  • if the gauge comes into solid contact with the tensioning wall and cannot be easily pushed past it then the deflection is greater than the business end
As with any manual fitting, it takes a little practice to get the feel of it.

I had the bright idea of pushing a threaded rod of the correct diameter through the hole in the gauge and holding it in place with a nut on either side of the shaft to act as a handle. Maybe I'll drop into Home Depot today to see if they have anything like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by passx View Post
Any idea of the cost of these ?
Since Dustin doesn't maintain a stock these and just makes them as requested, I imagine the cost will depend on demand and his 'smithing back log. If he gets enough requests for these, he may list these as a stocked item and assign a price for them.
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  #9  
Old 02-13-2020, 09:18 AM
drail drail is offline
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At this point all of the guys who favor spring loaded pivoting extrctors are having a good laugh at us with our silly little guages........ (I am NOT one of those guys - this is a great tool to have on your bench). Thank you Dustin!
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  #10  
Old 02-13-2020, 09:51 AM
seagiant seagiant is offline
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Hi
On my present Commander build I wanted to get more into the how and whys of the 1911 internal extractor.

Read all of Steve's info and got an education, and even made a .466 gauge out of an old 1911 leaf spring.

Admittedly, not pretty, but worked very well and has it's place in my tool box.

I could not help but notice that JMB used an external extractor in the 1903 Browning/Colt, but used the internal, on the 1911?

Does anyone know why???

Oh yea, using Steve's info on my extractor/ejector fitting...

My Commander build, has run 300 rds. for break in, before Gunkoting...

With not one FTF or FTE!
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  #11  
Old 02-13-2020, 01:50 PM
drail drail is offline
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Follow John Browning's original print to his specs and the gun WILL run.
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  #12  
Old 02-13-2020, 03:41 PM
Bob Rockefeller Bob Rockefeller is online now
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  #13  
Old 02-13-2020, 10:26 PM
NoExpert NoExpert is offline
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"I could not help but notice that JMB used an external extractor in the 1903 Browning/Colt, but used the internal, on the 1911?"

Ask Kimber. They can tell you all about external extractors on 1911s!

Sent from my SM-G930R4 using Tapatalk
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  #14  
Old 02-13-2020, 10:41 PM
megafiddle megafiddle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seagiant View Post
...
I could not help but notice that JMB used an external extractor in the 1903 Browning/Colt, but used the internal, on the 1911?

Does anyone know why???
...
From Browning's 1911 patent:

"In order to simplify the extractor and its attachment to the breech-bolt, the extractor z*and its spring are made integral, and it is seated in a hole bored lengthwise entirely through the breech-bolt from the rear to the front, parallel to the axis of the same, at the right side of and slightly below the seat of the firing-pin, see Figs. 3, 4 and 8. The rear portion of this hole is increased in size, and the rear portion of the extractor z, is cylindrical and fits in this part of the seat, the shoulder formed by the enlargement of the extractor and of the seat serving as a positive stop in forward direction for the extractor in the breech-bolt. As shown in Fig.*8, forward of this shoulder the extractor*forms a strong curved spring, the tension of which presses its hook at the forward end inward toward the center of the breech-bolt, the elastic portion of the extractor bearing on the inner side of the seat*at*the point where it projects from the face of the breech-bolt, and on the outer side*of the seat at a place nearer to the enlarged rear portion. At the rear end a segment is*removed from the inner side of the extractor to conform to the slot in the breech-bolt for the hammer in the down position, and forward of this a vertical recess is cut in the inner side of the extractor in*which the plate p fits. By this means the plate p not only locks the firing-pin in the breech-bolt, but it also secures the extractor in the breech-bolt, and on the removal of the plate p the extractor may be placed in its position or removed without the aid of any tools."

-

Last edited by megafiddle; 02-13-2020 at 10:47 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-14-2020, 11:16 AM
stevemaury stevemaury is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoExpert View Post
"I could not help but notice that JMB used an external extractor in the 1903 Browning/Colt, but used the internal, on the 1911?"

Ask Kimber. They can tell you all about external extractors on 1911s!

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Or SIG or S&W.
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  #16  
Old 03-01-2020, 02:44 PM
Steve in Allentown Steve in Allentown is offline
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I was poking around at the hardware store the other day and ran across a giant diaper pin that I thought would work to keep all of these gauges together. I don't know what Ace calls them but they cost around $2 each. I only needed the one.

It's a perfect size to hold six of these nifty gauges. You can see that Dustin marked each one with the last digit of the diameter of each. "6" = .466", "8" = .468", etc. If the #6 gauge doesn't touch the extractor but the #8 gauge fits tightly then the existing extractor deflection is between them and I assume it's .467". With these six gauges I can measure existing deflection to the closest .001" from .460" to .470"



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