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  #1  
Old 05-19-2020, 04:39 PM
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Johnny handgun Johnny handgun is online now
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Is it a pig?

I have heard repeatedly that the Taurus Judge and other various models based of it are lacking in performance. While I like the lightweight version I just canít see buying one if itís a bad concept/execution.

Smith makes their Governor based on the same basic principle that having a pistol that shoots .410 and 45 Colt is a good idea. Instead of having a 5 shot cylinder, like the Judge, it holds 6 rounds. It also fires the 45acp cartridge and the Judge doesn't. It comes in both light and heavy versions and so does the Judge.

So, are they both good concepts with bad results? Is the smith no better than the judge?
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  #2  
Old 05-19-2020, 06:12 PM
Autonomous Autonomous is offline
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Just an opinion but it seems gimmicky.
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  #3  
Old 05-19-2020, 07:34 PM
Deyomatic Deyomatic is offline
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When I found out that you could shoot .45 ACP in the Governor also, with moon clips, I figured it was 3 guns in one. I ALMOST bought one on another forum but didn't. There are tons of YouTube videos about both models.
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  #4  
Old 05-20-2020, 12:26 AM
Razorback22 Razorback22 is offline
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I would tend to agree with the "gimmicky" assessment, however the Ellifritz study rates the Judge and Governor to be extremely effective close-range PDW with buckshot loads. The .410 is not known as a "powerhouse" round, but let's look a bit closer. The slender shell is ideal for 000 buck pellets loaded one in front of the other. There are now specialty .410 loads that can deliver 4 or 5 000 buck pellets. That's only three pellets less than a 12 gauge! Okay, so the barrels are short and velocity of the initial "shot cup" is low....around 750 fps which does seem anemic until we consider this: Each buck pellet weights 80 grains and at 750 fps is basically equal to a .36 caliber black powder revolver shot. FIVE pellets being ejected at once is equal to five .36 caliber revolvers being fired into someone at the same time! That tends to put the idea of firing 000 buck .410 from a revolver in a different perspective. Five buck pellets deliver around 500 lb-ft of kinetic energy across five impact points, which is more energy than a single .45 Colt 255 grain slug, and five holes. Loaded with five rounds, the Judge is capable of delivering 25, .36 caliber holes and 2,500 lb-ft of energy in less than two seconds. That's more lethal than a single 12 gauge blast, in a package far smaller and more compact, and the "odds are" that if one ever has to shoot at all, a single "blast" from a Judge or Governor will resolve the issue with great effect.
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  #5  
Old 05-20-2020, 07:31 AM
M-Peltier M-Peltier is offline
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I don't know if Gimicky is the word I would use. Both the .410 and 45 colt are formidable defense rounds. Both would be a step up in power from a 9mm. Lol

We sell a lot of them, and have had a few used ones. Never a complaint from the owners. Other than being a bit on the big side. The ones with a few rounds thru them are always a little looser than the Smiths we get in. Not to the point of being unsafe, but that's more a result of the difference in quality materials and craftsmanship reflected in the price difference between the two brands.
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  #6  
Old 05-20-2020, 09:44 AM
earlwb earlwb is offline
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I like the one I bought over a year ago. I got the small compact polymer framed version. it uses the 2.5 inch 410 shells. But that works for me as they only make the self defense handgun 410 shells in 2.5 inch anyway. When I first fired it at the range, it was somewhat stiff and ejecting the 410 shells was difficult. But it loosened up or smoothed up some since then and it much better now. The recoil is quite stiff with 410 shells or .45 Colt rounds. I was kind of surprised by it at first. But no big deal now. You won't be speed loading it anyway. I think it is great as a in the middle of the night house gun when I don't have my glasses on. It would make a great anti-car jacker gun too. If I wear cargo or painter pants with the big pockets I can carry it in a pocket using a pocket holster too, it just fits inside without being visible. Those .410 rounds are still very potent, especially the ones designed for self defense handgun purposes.

Last edited by earlwb; 05-20-2020 at 09:47 AM. Reason: add more info
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  #7  
Old 05-20-2020, 04:31 PM
TRSOtto TRSOtto is offline
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Originally Posted by M-Peltier View Post
I don't know if Gimicky is the word I would use. Both the .410 and 45 colt are formidable defense rounds. Both would be a step up in power from a 9mm. Lol

We sell a lot of them, and have had a few used ones. Never a complaint from the owners. Other than being a bit on the big side. The ones with a few rounds thru them are always a little looser than the Smiths we get in. Not to the point of being unsafe, but that's more a result of the difference in quality materials and craftsmanship reflected in the price difference between the two brands.
Ditto. We could sell every Judge or Governor we could get our hands on. Folks are certainly attracted to them. I've shot them with .410 loads. Effective as all get out. But recoil sucks and follow up shots (if needed) aren't exactly quick.

I think they're big bulky pigs, but there's plenty of others who think they're a silk purse.
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  #8  
Old 05-21-2020, 01:47 AM
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Originally Posted by earlwb View Post
I like the one I bought over a year ago. I got the small compact polymer framed version. it uses the 2.5 inch 410 shells. But that works for me as they only make the self defense handgun 410 shells in 2.5 inch anyway. When I first fired it at the range, it was somewhat stiff and ejecting the 410 shells was difficult. But it loosened up or smoothed up some since then and it much better now. The recoil is quite stiff with 410 shells or .45 Colt rounds. I was kind of surprised by it at first. But no big deal now. You won't be speed loading it anyway. I think it is great as a in the middle of the night house gun when I don't have my glasses on. It would make a great anti-car jacker gun too. If I wear cargo or painter pants with the big pockets I can carry it in a pocket using a pocket holster too, it just fits inside without being visible. Those .410 rounds are still very potent, especially the ones designed for self defense handgun purposes.
So I take it that you bought the Taurus Public Defender?
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  #9  
Old 05-21-2020, 04:09 PM
earlwb earlwb is offline
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So I take it that you bought the Taurus Public Defender?
Yup the small one.
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  #10  
Old 05-21-2020, 11:34 PM
Rumblur Rumblur is offline
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Watch Paul Harrell's video on the Judge, then decide for yourself.

Personally, I'd feel better armed with almost anything else.
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  #11  
Old 05-23-2020, 11:28 PM
bmcgilvray bmcgilvray is online now
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A proper .45 Colt is more to the point. Don't need a clumsy revolver with an oversized cylinder that isn't any more effective than .45 Colt.

The .45/.410 tribe seems like a novelty item to me.
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  #12  
Old 05-23-2020, 11:39 PM
pat_jones pat_jones is offline
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45 Colt has more muzzle energy than a 410 slug. Shot patterns poorly out of a rifled barrel. Unless you need a short range snake gun, I fail to see the appeal of the 410 revolvers.

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  #13  
Old 05-24-2020, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Rumblur View Post
Watch Paul Harrell's video on the Judge, then decide for yourself.

Personally, I'd feel better armed with almost anything else.
I thought I wanted one, until I watched Paul Harrel's video. Then I decided I didn't. The 45 GAP round was the most accurate round on the S&W testing, but if I want 6 rds, I will carry my G 39.
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  #14  
Old 05-24-2020, 07:15 AM
VF-1 VF-1 is offline
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The Judge or Governor is a clumsy Frankenstein gimmick. I carry a lot of wheel guns, preferably K- Frames. Iíve never felt under guned with a S&W Model 66 or model 19. ymmv.

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  #15  
Old 05-24-2020, 09:43 AM
TRSOtto TRSOtto is offline
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Originally Posted by VF-1 View Post
The Judge or Governor is a clumsy Frankenstein gimmick. I carry a lot of wheel guns, preferably K- Frames. Iíve never felt under guned with a S&W Model 66 or model 19. ymmv.

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Those are beautiful little guns. Love those round butt snubbies.
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  #16  
Old 05-24-2020, 11:20 AM
VF-1 VF-1 is offline
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Those are beautiful little guns. Love those round butt snubbies.
Thank you for the kind words, Sir!
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  #17  
Old 05-24-2020, 02:38 PM
TRSOtto TRSOtto is offline
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Thank you for the kind words, Sir!
In fact.......your picture just makes me want to go shopping for a pair like that.
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  #18  
Old 05-24-2020, 09:08 PM
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In fact.......your picture just makes me want to go shopping for a pair like that.
I agree, problem is my wife steals every revolver I bring home
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  #19  
Old 05-25-2020, 06:31 AM
VF-1 VF-1 is offline
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In fact.......your picture just makes me want to go shopping for a pair like that.
That old, worn M19 has spent a lot of time on my hip. Sheís not the prettiest gal at the dance, but the double action trigger pull is smooth as glass.
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  #20  
Old 05-25-2020, 09:39 AM
LEO918 LEO918 is offline
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I see a lot of the .410 revolvers selling to old folks as a home defense gun. They seem to think they can't miss with a .410.
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  #21  
Old 05-25-2020, 12:53 PM
mkk41 mkk41 is offline
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I see a lot of the .410 revolvers selling to old folks as a home defense gun. They seem to think they can't miss with a .410.

I find it odd that some internet and gunshop 'experts' will recommend a .410 revolver using 2 1/2in loads as a suitable home defense weapon , but a 12 or 20ga pump shotgun using light loads or fine shot is insufficient?
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  #22  
Old 05-25-2020, 03:20 PM
HarryO45 HarryO45 is offline
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Pig? I guess it depends what your expectations are. I bought a Judge for my kayak and wading in gator water. I am also in Wild Pig country. My thoughts are for this purpose it is pretty good. I am usually focused on fishing ang killing a snake is not very likely, in that, if I see a snake they are either no threat, or it is too late, but I like the idea of being able to kill one if need be. I don’t kill snakes for fun. Gator or pigs are fair game always. For me, They are not like a game animal, they need to be killed. I have had mine for almost a year a have been religious carrying it when I am out. Two years ago I would have killed several critters with it by now. But this year I have had no chance contact. One thing I can tell you, a .410 is very effective against a snake (it is nothing like rat shot from any revolver). The .45 LC is effective against anything I will run into. Mine is the polymer short barrel and Is uglier than a Glock, but I think there is a practical niche for a SE outdoorsman wanting something light and powerful. It is not an heirloom or a high round count gun... it is a crude tool that has a purpose.
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  #23  
Old 05-26-2020, 10:06 AM
earlwb earlwb is offline
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Originally Posted by mkk41 View Post
I find it odd that some internet and gunshop 'experts' will recommend a .410 revolver using 2 1/2in loads as a suitable home defense weapon , but a 12 or 20ga pump shotgun using light loads or fine shot is insufficient?
yes, a 12 gauge shotgun is always number one on the list for home defense guns. But many people find them somewhat unwieldy though.
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