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  #1  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:46 AM
CLASSIC12 CLASSIC12 is offline
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Rifle shooting at 300 meters

Our local club reopened last Saturday with some Covid-19 related restrictions, 1/2 of the firing lines open due to distancing, max 45 minutes per shooter with reservation. Still felt great to be back at it

I took my two Swiss ordnance rifles, the Stgw 57 & 90









Military ammo



The GP11 (7.5 X 55 mm) is a great cartridge; it launches a .306 projectile weighting 174 gr at 2560 ft/s. The GP 90 is the Swiss version of the 5.56 X 45 mm NATO with a 63 gr projectile at 2989 ft/s






Hereís my shooting buddy trying out the Stgw 90





I shot 30 rounds in 10 shot strings with each weapon, best score of the day with each one



I am more of a handgun guy, but I intend to shoot more rifles this year and improve if I can get enough trigger time
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  #2  
Old 05-20-2020, 09:16 AM
psp6785 psp6785 is offline
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As much as I love this country and our freedom, there is no reason I shouldn't be out there with my M16A2 I was issued in the Marine Corps, next to a 70 something Vietnam vet shooting his M14.
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Old 05-20-2020, 10:04 AM
USMM guy USMM guy is online now
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I will assume that you are using iron sights by choice.

Or is there another reason why you have not put glass on those rifles?
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  #4  
Old 05-20-2020, 12:09 PM
havanajim havanajim is offline
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Beautiful rifles, and a great looking range too!!
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  #5  
Old 05-20-2020, 12:32 PM
CLASSIC12 CLASSIC12 is offline
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Originally Posted by USMM guy View Post
Or is there another reason why you have not put glass on those rifles?

Military style shooting and competitions are open sights only with ordnance weapons, a long tradition of Swiss marksmanship and militia army
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Old 05-20-2020, 12:34 PM
CLASSIC12 CLASSIC12 is offline
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Originally Posted by psp6785 View Post
As much as I love this country and our freedom, there is no reason I shouldn't be out there with my M16A2 I was issued in the Marine Corps, next to a 70 something Vietnam vet shooting his M14.

I feel for you. Here Iím shooting my XM 177 E2 in full auto

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Old 05-20-2020, 01:15 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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Originally Posted by CLASSIC12 View Post
Military style shooting and competitions are open sights only with ordnance weapons, a long tradition of Swiss marksmanship and militia army
I agree that a true marksman should be able to shoot using traditional iron sights and not rely on an optic all the time. Unfortunately I don't have anywhere that I can shoot past 100 yards so I have no clue how well I could shoot at longer distances. Given that my eyeballs aren't what they used to be, probably not too well.
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Old 05-20-2020, 01:25 PM
hub1home hub1home is offline
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OP: Thank You for the pictures and information! I found it very interesting!
Your range looks fantastic.
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  #9  
Old 05-20-2020, 01:41 PM
havanajim havanajim is offline
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Originally Posted by CLASSIC12 View Post
Military style shooting and competitions are open sights only with ordnance weapons, a long tradition of Swiss marksmanship and militia army
Unfortunately for us, it seems we've drifted too far away from marksmanship and too deep into dependence on optics of some sort. I know folks who've never used irons.... on any rifle! For me, I can't bring myself to put glass on a battle rifle. Perhaps one day I'll have to, but until then, I prefer the classic lines and the balance.
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  #10  
Old 05-20-2020, 02:10 PM
USMM guy USMM guy is online now
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For me it all depends on the sights/rifle I am shooting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dsk View Post
I agree that a true marksman should be able to shoot using traditional iron sights and not rely on an optic all the time. Unfortunately I don't have anywhere that I can shoot past 100 yards so I have no clue how well I could shoot at longer distances. Given that my eyeballs aren't what they used to be, probably not too well.
At 62 my eyes are not what they once were either. I can still do pretty good with my military rifles, Garands, M-1 carbines and such. I have the hardest time with my handguns.
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Old 05-20-2020, 03:35 PM
hecklerundkoch hecklerundkoch is offline
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Beautiful, picturesque range. Glad you're enjoying your days well.

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  #12  
Old 05-20-2020, 04:46 PM
7.62Kolectr 7.62Kolectr is offline
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Man, so many things to envy in your post.
Not sure if it’s the range or the guns I am jealous of?
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  #13  
Old 05-20-2020, 04:54 PM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
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Looks like a fun time.
How are you seeing your hits? Are you seeing your hits between shots?
I can and have shot 200 yds with irons but your shooting hits (ie, a steel plate) not necessarily groups.

Btw, Iíll take my optics...much more fun...

Last edited by Plantar5; 05-20-2020 at 05:03 PM.
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  #14  
Old 05-20-2020, 04:56 PM
7.62Kolectr 7.62Kolectr is offline
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Originally Posted by Plantar5 View Post
Looks like a fun time.
How are you seeing your hits? Are you seeing your hits between shots?
I can and have shot 200 yds with irons but your shooting hits (ie, a steel plate) not necessarily groups.
From his previous posts I believe his range has an electronic scoring system that displays them on a screen next to the shooter.
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  #15  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:09 PM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
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Originally Posted by 7.62Kolectr View Post
From his previous posts I believe his range has an electronic scoring system that displays them on a screen next to the shooter.
I saw that but didnít know for sure. So, Just to clarify, hits are viewed via a Ďmagnifiedí electronic screen.
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  #16  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:43 PM
CLASSIC12 CLASSIC12 is offline
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Rifle shooting at 300 meters

Correct, here is the screen next to the shooter



Now shooting with scopes is a lot of fun, and I also made a post about that

https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=1010794

But hitting a four inch circle at 328 yards with open sights is quite a challenge. And the best shooters around here achieve that consistently



I still have a long way to go

Last edited by CLASSIC12; 05-20-2020 at 05:46 PM.
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  #17  
Old 05-20-2020, 05:55 PM
CLASSIC12 CLASSIC12 is offline
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Rifle shooting at 300 meters

Here is Ianís video on the Stgw 57

https://youtu.be/Y73Zcg9icJc

Last edited by CLASSIC12; 05-21-2020 at 06:02 AM.
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  #18  
Old 05-20-2020, 06:20 PM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
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Thanks for the clarification Classic12. I’ve been wanting to get Target vision setup for longer range shooting at my club. Makes life easier.
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  #19  
Old 05-20-2020, 06:44 PM
Hawkeye fan Hawkeye fan is offline
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Very nice.
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  #20  
Old 05-21-2020, 12:14 AM
Piexcel Piexcel is offline
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Originally Posted by CLASSIC12 View Post
I am more of a handgun guy, but I intend to shoot more rifles this year and improve if I can get enough trigger time
I'm also looking to get more time on rifles this year since I've moved to an area with access to a rifle range with targets up to 2000 yards. I haven't shot further than 300 yards with my bolt guns, but I plan to take some instruction and learn to shoot further distances. Recently, I wanted to get away from the static shooting in a stall and have been taking gunfighting classes using handguns. The training is good with a lot of emphasis on drawing from concealment and shooting multiple targets while moving and reloading.
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  #21  
Old 05-21-2020, 06:29 AM
M-Peltier M-Peltier is offline
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Originally Posted by havanajim View Post
Unfortunately for us, it seems we've drifted too far away from marksmanship and too deep into dependence on optics of some sort. I know folks who've never used irons.... on any rifle! For me, I can't bring myself to put glass on a battle rifle. Perhaps one day I'll have to, but until then, I prefer the classic lines and the balance.
I hear ya. Although I can no longer shoot a rifle with irons very well do too my aging eye sight, I am extremely appreciative of the quality of current optics. Im still good with a handgun with irons thankfully.

Interestingly our military still teaches iron sight use in basic, and all soldiers do not necessarily get an aim point or ACOG. In my sons unit the limited Aimpoints and ACOGS they are issued go to the better shooters. He was issued an ACOG, as he is probably the top shot in his unit. He loves it.
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  #22  
Old 05-21-2020, 06:32 AM
M-Peltier M-Peltier is offline
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Classic12
Whats the chain I see in the photos for? To limit rifle movement? A shell deflector? or something else?
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  #23  
Old 05-21-2020, 09:40 AM
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Tom Freeman Tom Freeman is offline
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These are the target screens that we train with at the Olympic Training Center. The target itself is just black rubber with no scoring rings. The microphones and computer plot its impact point/score. The highest you can get is 10.9 which means you were within 0.5 mm of perfectly centered. In this case the final shot was a 10.7 which was 1.9mm wide and 1.1mm low. The dots are not the actual size of the bullet. Only the current shot shows the whole bullet diameter. The latest software upgrade changed that and made all shots fired show full bullet diameter.

The paper target is the old fashioned version. They were a pain. I dont miss those days.



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  #24  
Old 05-21-2020, 10:09 AM
TRSOtto TRSOtto is offline
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I used to squirrel hunt with irons.

Now I need a 25x 30mm tube just to see a damn squirrel.
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  #25  
Old 05-21-2020, 11:09 AM
USMM guy USMM guy is online now
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Tom you really should not have used the target that I shot at that least match.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Freeman View Post
These are the target screens that we train with at the Olympic Training Center. The target itself is just black rubber with no scoring rings. The microphones and computer plot its impact point/score. The highest you can get is 10.9 which means you were within 0.5 mm of perfectly centered. In this case the final shot was a 10.7 which was 1.9mm wide and 1.1mm low. The dots are not the actual size of the bullet. Only the current shot shows the whole bullet diameter. The latest software upgrade changed that and made all shots fired show full bullet diameter.

The paper target is the old fashioned version. They were a pain. I dont miss those days.



Next time use one of your own.
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