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View Poll Results: Is the .380Auto reliable?
Yes, it's a reliable little gun. 116 91.34%
Nope, garbage and I wouldn't trust it. 11 8.66%
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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  #151  
Old 06-10-2019, 10:25 PM
Badd72 Badd72 is offline
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If it's a size thing there are plenty of 9mm pocket guns that are basically the same size. Ruger lc9 Beretta nano......
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  #152  
Old 06-11-2019, 01:36 AM
Austin_TX Austin_TX is offline
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Originally Posted by Badd72 View Post
If it's a size thing there are plenty of 9mm pocket guns that are basically the same size. Ruger lc9 Beretta nano......
This has already been covered at least a billion times on a hundred forums (and in this very thread, I think), but no, there aren’t. Aside from a Rohrbaugh, the slim, single-stack 9mm pistols are all substantially larger than the .380 pocket pistols.
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  #153  
Old 06-11-2019, 06:35 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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So, not large enough to be of any value then..
Hey, we are almost at 10%!
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  #154  
Old 06-11-2019, 06:57 AM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
This has already been covered at least a billion times on a hundred forums (and in this very thread, I think), but no, there arenít. Aside from a Rohrbaugh, the slim, single-stack 9mm pistols are all substantially larger than the .380 pocket pistols.
DB9, it's smaller than a lot of the .380s though it will punish your hand like crazy.
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  #155  
Old 06-11-2019, 07:11 AM
earlwb earlwb is offline
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One thought is that usually we only hear from those who have problems with their gun. Those who's gun works fine, no problems, usually never tell anyone about it. But if there is a problem, everyone gets to hear about it. So what we see, or hear or read out a particular gun is skewed heavily towards those who have problems with it.
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  #156  
Old 06-11-2019, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
This has already been covered at least a billion times on a hundred forums (and in this very thread, I think), but no, there arenít. Aside from a Rohrbaugh, the slim, single-stack 9mm pistols are all substantially larger than the .380 pocket pistols.
Sig and SA both have 9mm guns that are basically the same size as their .380s; 238/938 for Sig and the 911s for SA.
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  #157  
Old 06-12-2019, 08:40 AM
Thumper88 Thumper88 is offline
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I had an LCP. Awful trigger but it went bang every time. I think some of the mistrust in 380 came from the fact that a lot of small Saturday night specials were loaded in 380. Cheap guns that would have reliability issues with any cartridge, but the public tends to judge on the majority of what they see, and they saw a lot of little 380s that wouldn’t run. I would trust most modern 380s once I had ran 500 rounds through them, which is my standard for any carry gun
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  #158  
Old 06-12-2019, 09:49 AM
OttoLoader OttoLoader is offline
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I have an original design LCP (manf 2011) that has always worked no problems.
SIG P238 (manf 2017) also always worked.
As with any new gun be sure to rest it out.
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  #159  
Old 06-12-2019, 10:56 AM
Austin_TX Austin_TX is offline
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Originally Posted by TominMO View Post
Sig and SA both have 9mm guns that are basically the same size as their .380s; 238/938 for Sig and the 911s for SA.
They're not "basically" the same size at all when it comes to evaluating their suitability for pocket carry. As with other manufacturers' pairs of small 9mm and .380 pistols, they don't look that different on a spec sheet, but those fractions of an inch in different dimensions (to say nothing of the increased weight of the 9mm versions) make all the difference for the ease of pocket carry.

The .380 version of those guns will go in almost any pocket not belonging to a pair of hipster skinny jeans. Not so with the 9mm versions.

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  #160  
Old 06-12-2019, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
They're not "basically" the same size at all when it comes to evaluating their suitability for pocket carry. As with other manufacturers' pairs of small 9mm and .380 pistols, they don't look that different on a spec sheet, but those fractions of an inch in different dimensions (to say nothing of the increased weight of the 9mm versions) make all the difference for the ease of pocket carry.

The .380 version of those guns will go in almost any pocket not belonging to a pair of hipster skinny jeans. Not so with the 9mm versions.
Did a little comparison of these guns, using specs from the manufacturers' websites.

.................911 .380.....911 9mm.......238...........938

Weight......12.6 oz.......15.3 oz..........15.2 oz.....16.0 oz

Height.......3.9" for all four (except Sig Legion versions w/extended magwell, 4.3")

Length......5.5" for both .380s, 5.9" for both 9mms (2.7" barrels vs 3.0")

Width........not listed for SAs..............1.1" for both Sigs; likely the 911s are identical (I have handled all four guns)

Sooooo....basically the same for all four guns.

The difference in weight from low to high is probably less than the weight of one .380 round. I doubt anyone could tell which caliber gun was in his pocket, by weight or size, loaded with its ammo. I put seven rounds of .380 in one hand and seven of 9mm in the other; they are pretty close in perceived weight.

And just over 3/8" in length difference is of no importance for pocket carry. The pocket holster for the 911 .380 has an inch more room than necessary to handle the length of the 9mm barrel/slide.

EDIT: Just got back from the LGS. The 938 fits perfectly into the 911 .380 pocket holster.

Last edited by TominMO; 06-12-2019 at 03:56 PM.
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  #161  
Old 06-12-2019, 03:43 PM
EB_KC9 EB_KC9 is offline
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I have a Glock 42 with a HYVE +2 mag extension that has functioned flawlessly.its not a mouse gun though I wouldn't say. Underwood XTP+p is what it has in the magazine. the knock on 380 is typically penetration and these, according to shooting the bull, penetrate and still expand (not as widely as some) through denim and bare gel.

Last edited by EB_KC9; 06-12-2019 at 08:30 PM.
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  #162  
Old 06-12-2019, 04:38 PM
Tenagain Tenagain is offline
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There's nothing inherently unreliable with .380. If there are failures across platforms in your classes.it's most likely that a lot of students have a new pistol and a box of ammo that was never proven in said weapon. Smaller guns in particular will be more picky about defense ammo.

That said, I feed my little Kahr Underwood +p ammo in a magazine that has an extra round via MagGuts and haven't had any failures in 4-500 rounds so far. It's always in my pocket and I have no doubt that .380 would get the job done if I ever needed it. I carry other guns most days too because I like to but the .380 even flies solo some times.
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  #163  
Old 06-12-2019, 08:32 PM
Rastoff Rastoff is offline
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Originally Posted by Tenagain View Post
...it's most likely that a lot of students have a new pistol and a box of ammo that was never proven in said weapon.
A lot of people have said this. However, I know exactly what the condition of the guns is/was when the failures happened.

Some were in exactly the condition you mention, but many were well used and shot by experienced shooters. Some were probably because the gun was so neglected it was the dirt build up. Still, I've had several students claim their gun had never failed before. The reality doesn't lie.
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  #164  
Old 06-13-2019, 03:58 PM
Tenagain Tenagain is offline
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Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
A lot of people have said this. However, I know exactly what the condition of the guns is/was when the failures happened.

Some were in exactly the condition you mention, but many were well used and shot by experienced shooters. Some were probably because the gun was so neglected it was the dirt build up. Still, I've had several students claim their gun had never failed before. The reality doesn't lie.
All I can say is there MUST be a logical explanation for such illogical occurrences. The veracity of students would be one of the first things to question.
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  #165  
Old 06-13-2019, 04:23 PM
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New gun, owner new to shooting, goes from gun store straight to the range--without cleaning/oiling of course. Add to that people who don't know how to hold a gun properly, so too much flip. Result: gun gets traded in for jamming too much.

Happens all the time. A large percentage of people can't be bothered to educate themselves about the care and feeding of their new purchase. Given all the good instructional vids on Youtube, there is no excuse really.
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  #166  
Old 06-13-2019, 04:41 PM
Jim Watson Jim Watson is online now
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My Colt Gov't .380 is a fine IDPA BUG but am not confident in it for carry.

My CZ83 is reliable but so big that I can just as easily have a 9mm or even a .45 on my belt.

Friends' dwarf .380s from Ruger are functional but No Fun At All to shoot. The least Glock 42 reportedly more comfortable, I know my G43 9mm is not too bad.

Older designs like Colt and Walther seem to be more dependable in their original .32 than .380.
I foolishly sold my Remington 51 which was a native .380 because it would not feed JHPs. Fine with ball.
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  #167  
Old 06-13-2019, 05:37 PM
GONRA GONRA is offline
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In Math World - GONRA sez - Question Is Ill Posed!!!
Functioning of WIDELY PRODUCED .380 ACP ammo & pistols can vary ALL OVER THE MAP!

Can prove any point ya wanna make by selecting appropriate ammo / pistol...
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  #168  
Old 06-14-2019, 09:55 AM
imjb1911 imjb1911 is offline
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I couldn't vote because it's a flawed poll. Some .380s are reliable, some aren't.
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  #169  
Old 06-14-2019, 12:35 PM
Rastoff Rastoff is offline
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Originally Posted by Tenagain View Post
All I can say is there MUST be a logical explanation for such illogical occurrences. The veracity of students would be one of the first things to question.
Obviously the human element cannot be ignored. However, the situation I've described is not illogical. Logic really has nothing to do with this at all. I've simply reported what I've seen.
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  #170  
Old 06-14-2019, 01:25 PM
Tenagain Tenagain is offline
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Originally Posted by Rastoff View Post
Obviously the human element cannot be ignored. However, the situation I've described is not illogical. Logic really has nothing to do with this at all. I've simply reported what I've seen.
So.....it's a fact that .380 is inherently flawed? I'll have to tell my little Kahr that it needs to start failing. Sorry if I'm not picking up what you're putting down but what you are observing just doesn't seem to fit with the reality of the .380 round. To me that equals illogical. An awful lot of people use .380 in a huge variety of pistols without a greater occurrence of malfunctions than any other round. Now if you were seeing problems with .22 or .32 it would be more believable.

I still think it's more likely that a student, even one who is an otherwise experienced shooter, might not want to look bad by admitting they didn't prove their ammo choice before heading off to take classes. Either that or you just happened on an anomalous group that just happened to have unreliable .380 weapons.

I could be wrong but not much else makes sense to me in my experience. I only have 3 .380s but all have been flawless once I weeded out the ammo that my P3AT didn't like.
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  #171  
Old 06-14-2019, 07:58 PM
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I've tried out probably ten or more different ammos in my SA 911 .380. FMJ ball, FMJ flat nose, different brands of HPs, all work fine, Only Fiocchi FMJ had a feeding issue, when the feed ramp got dirty. (Fiocchi has a crimp in the casing, for some reason.) Cleaned the ramp, then even the Fiocchi fed fine.

Note that I had polished my feed ramp and chamber before ever firing a shot with this gun. I have no doubt that this greatly helped its non-finicky performance towards ammo.

I would hazard a guess that over 90% of feed issues are owner created, either by not polishing the feed ramp, keeping the gun clean and lubed, limp-wristing, poor grip method, etc.

I have had exactly two feed issues with my 911, plus a few in one mag full of the Fiocchi--but that was an ammo-specific situation, and quickly rectified by cleaning the feed ramp. The other two issues might also have been dirty-ramp related. One occurred at about 40 rounds into the break-in period.

Last edited by TominMO; 06-14-2019 at 08:01 PM.
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  #172  
Old 06-15-2019, 12:12 AM
Rastoff Rastoff is offline
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Originally Posted by Tenagain View Post
So.....it's a fact that .380 is inherently flawed?
I didn't say that, but my observations seem to imply it.

Even to me, which is why I brought this up in the first place, the observations seem hard to believe. It's like watching someone flip a coin and getting heads 99% of the time; it just doesn't follow general convention or belief.

I'm sure some of the issues are shooter induced. I'm sure some have been due to ammo. I know for a fact that some were due to improper maintenance. Even so, if I had kept a chart of all the malfunctions, regardless of cause, the .380Auto would make up about 80%. That's a high enough ratio to cause me to say hmmm.

Honestly, I'm really glad to hear that so many people have guns that work without malfunctions. I just haven't witnessed it myself and I've seen a lot of guns, more than most. Even so, I'm not trying to convince anyone here. This is just what I've seen. Anyone is welcome to come to the range with me and demonstrate how their .380Auto works perfectly. So far, I don't remember seeing a single one make it 35 rounds without a malfunction.
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  #173  
Old 06-15-2019, 07:41 AM
undy undy is offline
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I "proofed" my new Colt Mustang Pocketlite yesterday at the range. I ran 50 rounds of standard ball ammo through it without a hiccup and then ran 12 rounds of my pocket carry ammo, Buffalo Bore 95gr +P JHPs though it. I must say the +Ps have a louder crack and quite a bit more gun kick. I like 'em!!

All in all I feel the gun is 100% reliable.
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  #174  
Old 06-15-2019, 07:42 AM
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I would think that new gun owners are the main purchasers of .380s; hence all the problems with that caliber. Many .380s are small and also inexpensive, so people new to shooting think this will do, at least for now. They don't know how to hold them (especially problematic for smaller guns) and how to maintain them. And many don't really care to learn. Our range also offers a cleaning service for guns, and some newbies actually pay us to do that for them.

Shooting my 911 long distance has been quite the challenge due to it being so tiny, but has really refined my grip and sighting.

The massive vote in this poll for their being as reliable as other calibers is from people on here who are experienced shooters, so they are not experiencing the issues, or not nearly as much.
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  #175  
Old 06-15-2019, 08:56 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Originally Posted by GONRA View Post
In Math World - GONRA sez - Question Is Ill Posed!!!
Functioning of WIDELY PRODUCED .380 ACP ammo & pistols can vary ALL OVER THE MAP!

Can prove any point ya wanna make by selecting appropriate ammo / pistol...
so true!
When you are dealing with only 2 grains of powder, itís pretty easy for the mass production junk ammo to be all over the place. They canít even get loads that deal with 6 grains consistent.
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