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  #1  
Old 09-08-2013, 06:51 PM
rhinocaster rhinocaster is offline
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Iowa allows gun permits to the blind...

Interesting, I've never thought of this...

http://news.yahoo.com/iowa-grants-gu...174507640.html
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  #2  
Old 09-08-2013, 06:55 PM
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  #3  
Old 09-08-2013, 07:20 PM
The Earl o Sammich The Earl o Sammich is offline
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Well, ...I would be the last to deny anyone from being able to exercise the rights guaranteed by the Constitution, but some things, you just got to accept are never going to happen.

Kind of like me being able to compete in the Miss America Pageant.

We kind of have this running joke at deer camp. When we see someone that's trying to horn in on our area we always say to them "didn't see anything but had a couple of good sound shots".

Last edited by The Earl o Sammich; 09-08-2013 at 07:26 PM.
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  #4  
Old 09-08-2013, 07:51 PM
DANCESWITHGUNS DANCESWITHGUNS is offline
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As pro gun as I am I have to think about this one...

NO, you cannot deny any right-only privileges as a driving license would be. The person being blind would be responsible for every missed shot on an aggressor just as you or me.

Next time you visit an indoor range take a look at the walls, floor and ceiling-If having sight makes it that only we should have a permit it would be discrimination.

An elderly person with degrees of failing vision is still an American with unalienable rights.

Call me crazy.
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:01 PM
rhinocaster rhinocaster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DANCESWITHGUNS View Post
As pro gun as I am I have to think about this one...

NO, you cannot deny any right-only privileges as a driving license would be. The person being blind would be responsible for every missed shot on an aggressor just as you or me.

Next time you visit an indoor range take a look at the walls, floor and ceiling-If having sight makes it that only we should have a permit it would be discrimination.

An elderly person with degrees of failing vision is still an American with unalienable rights.

Call me crazy.
I just find it to be a very awkward situation....I think the reality of the blind actually using the firearm is a problem but there is the question if their rights...like I said, I've never considered this.
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:05 PM
NegativeXero NegativeXero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DANCESWITHGUNS View Post
As pro gun as I am I have to think about this one...

NO, you cannot deny any right-only privileges as a driving license would be. The person being blind would be responsible for every missed shot on an aggressor just as you or me.

Next time you visit an indoor range take a look at the walls, floor and ceiling-If having sight makes it that only we should have a permit it would be discrimination.

An elderly person with degrees of failing vision is still an American with unalienable rights.

Call me crazy.
You are crazy then. You said to call you it.

Just because they would be held responsible does not change the fact that an innocent person was just shot by someone who cannot hit what they are aiming at.

If I could not see properly (regardless of what the law says) I am not going to take a shot or drive or do anything that could endanger the life of someone else or myself. If you cannot properly do something that has the potential to endanger others than you should not do it.

On this topic; unless under supervision and controllable circumstances I do not think someone who cannot see properly should be able to carry or shoot a firearm. Don't take what I say out of context and try to throw in someone who wears glasses should not be able to shoot because you know what I mean.
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:06 PM
neorebel neorebel is offline
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Okay, I see!

The way I've seen some shoot at our publick range, the blind could probably shoot better....no kidding.
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:23 PM
turkey1911 turkey1911 is offline
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I'm going to have to disagree with this. There are plenty of people with good vision (including corrected vision) who can barely keep the rounds on paper at 7 yards. I don't think a person who can't see his target should be carrying.
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  #9  
Old 09-08-2013, 08:28 PM
DANCESWITHGUNS DANCESWITHGUNS is offline
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Originally Posted by NegativeXero View Post
You are crazy then. You said to call you it.

Just because they would be held responsible does not change the fact that an innocent person was just shot by someone who cannot hit what they are aiming at.

If I could not see properly (regardless of what the law says) I am not going to take a shot or drive or do anything that could endanger the life of someone else or myself. If you cannot properly do something that has the potential to endanger others than you should not do it.

On this topic; unless under supervision and controllable circumstances I do not think someone who cannot see properly should be able to carry or shoot a firearm. Don't take what I say out of context and try to throw in someone who wears glasses should not be able to shoot because you know what I mean.
How do you deny a right to an American? I understand what you mean but a right is a right. I would also add that when we shoot in a low light scenario we are partially blind as well unless we use a light. Some of the people in the article were partially blind not completely blind. I guess it just doesn't sit well with me that a right should be questioned over a physical impairment.

Another angle is that maybe a person with a visual impairment just wants a weapon in the house for his family members to be able to protect him (like that little girl with her dads AR).
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:30 PM
PolymerMan PolymerMan is online now
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That's why they make the Colt New Agent with no sights!
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  #11  
Old 09-08-2013, 08:30 PM
blksn955.o blksn955.o is offline
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Are these people flat out Ray Charles blind or just from a "legal" sense like to operate a car?

I had a few college classes with a guy who saw and could recognize you based on your fuzzy shape/outline and features and had a laptop to read his work and do his work and I kid you not about 2-3 letters about filled the screen of his laptop with glasses. I feel he should have his right to defend himself as I bet if someone was hunting him out to rob he would come off as an easy target. Just like say a elderly man who with glasses cant drive.

Now if they are Ray Charles blind as in total lights out...worried for everyone in that situation and it is probably safest to be the criminal in that case.
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  #12  
Old 09-08-2013, 08:45 PM
1911Jeeper 1911Jeeper is offline
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We let stupid people vote, and look how dangerous the outcome of that has become.

If blind people can pass the necessary requirements/testing for a carry permit, give them one.
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:50 PM
Hobzz Hobzz is offline
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_golf#Blind_golf
I reckon they can hit targets they can't see if they're trained and practice.
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Old 09-08-2013, 08:54 PM
clt_capt clt_capt is offline
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Stupidity doesn't prevent someone from becoming a politician. Why should blindness remove someone's fundamental right to protect themselves?
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:15 PM
rhinocaster rhinocaster is offline
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Isn't one of the primary tenets of shooting to know your target and what's behind your target?

If someone will never be capable of this, how can they be responsible with a firearm?

I don't have an answer with this one but I can't believe that if I lose my sight that I would feel that I should be allowed to carry a firearm. Nor would I feel comfortable discharging a weapon without knowing exactly where my target was and what was around my target.
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:18 PM
rhinocaster rhinocaster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobzz View Post
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_golf#Blind_golf
I reckon they can hit targets they can't see if they're trained and practice.
With golf for the blind, each player has a coach that tells them where the target is and how far away it is. This has nothing at all to do with the reality of the blind using a firearm for self defense.
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:34 AM
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Have you seen Ray Charles new house? Neither has he...
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:44 AM
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Federal Regulations Require State Laws Comply

Quote:
Originally Posted by turkey1911 View Post
I'm going to have to disagree with this. There are plenty of people with good vision (including corrected vision) who can barely keep the rounds on paper at 7 yards. I don't think a person who can't see his target should be carrying.
The verbiage actually reads that a person with disabilities cannot be refused a carry permit.

There are several layers to this. Liberal media outlets jumped on the "blind" thing as a way to read it and that's where we went.

Legally blind can be as simple as peripheral vision preventing a person from having a CDL or professional pilot license but the person can still see in front of them. Legal blindness has many levels.

The media jumped on this because they KNEW the general population would ASSUME that a completely blind (sightless) person could be authorized to carry.

While I can think of an instance or two where a completely blind person might be trusted to carry (some of you might think of one or two yourself)...the reality is that likely there are either single digits or NO completely blind people carrying.

The POSSIBILITY is made into a point of contention to help weaken the argument for concealed carry IN ANY STATE because the statute has to pass Federal Law which provides for equal treatment under the law.

The actual law itself does not say: BLIND PEOPLE CAN CARRY...but the law itself falls under state law and it is therefore regulated by Federal Law...and on we go.
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:45 AM
220swiftfn 220swiftfn is offline
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As someone else mentioned, there is the question of "legally blind" vs. totally blind. I can definately see the MSM taking a bunch of permit holders that are "legally blind" and drumming up "they hand out permits to BLIND PEOPLE for chrissake!!!!!"

Which isn't even the point. Deaf and mute still have the right of free speach, no?? I'd imagine that a TOTALLY blind individual would be just as "responsible" as you or I would be. I'm thinking that they'd be able to tell when they are being attacked, and at that point you don't need to be able to see to put a gun in someone's gut and pull a trigger, do you???


Dan
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:01 AM
gtbigup01 gtbigup01 is offline
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It's starange that common sense even lacks in the outside world, and here I was thinking that's it was just in the Army that common sense has faded.

3 people that can't legally drive, can't read the application to fill out correctly, but granted a permit because of their rights. Lets just give them licences as well they have a 50/50 shot of staying on the road without causing injuries to themselves or others. Then again is a drivers licence a right or privilege?

Eh Stevie Wonder drove, so someone can take the blind to the range and give verbal instructions, but why the carry permit?
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:20 AM
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There is a simple answer. Use the same vision test to obtain a CCW as they do for a driver's license. No see, no pass. No discrimination. The fallacy that the Second Amendment allows for uncontrolled concealed carry is silly. I challenge anyone to show me that section in the short paragraph. Until we get nationwide constitutional carry (which will never happen) concealed weapons are a privilege granted by the state, not the Constitution. Iowa just screwed up.
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Old 09-09-2013, 03:18 AM
SKIandSKY SKIandSKY is offline
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A red herring. Most attacks occur at "reach out and touch me" distance so eagle eyesight is hardly needed.

I know a guy that is legally blind but I guarantee you, he could drop any attacker out to about 30 yards if needed with whatever gun he had.

Once in a pistol match I realized I had driven down without my glasses. I aimed for the center of the blurr and won a trophy. Yes there were more than 20 shooters.
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Old 09-09-2013, 03:30 AM
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I have no problem with a blind person being able to lay down a field of fire in his own home when the door comes busting in. But when you say it's OK to provide concealed carry permits for someone who doesn't know the difference between a telephone pole and a bad guy you are simply wrong. Iowa is a small population state. Tell me what is going to happen when a blind person that they gave permission to carry a deadly weapon shoots in a general direction and kills a child? A good lawyer will bankrupt the whole state of innocent people.
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Old 09-09-2013, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by AZ Husker View Post
There is a simple answer. Use the same vision test to obtain a CCW as they do for a driver's license. No see, no pass. No discrimination. The fallacy that the Second Amendment allows for uncontrolled concealed carry is silly. I challenge anyone to show me that section in the short paragraph. Until we get nationwide constitutional carry (which will never happen) concealed weapons are a privilege granted by the state, not the Constitution. Iowa just screwed up.
It is a slippery slope you are on. Who will define "uncontrolled"? Politicians? A vision test - maybe. Having to fire a certain score on the range - maybe.
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Old 09-09-2013, 07:52 AM
BBossman BBossman is offline
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A blind person couldn't do any worse than the NYPD. Wasn't it just a year ago they hit 9 bystanders in the shooting at the Empire State Building?
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