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Accurate 1911's for Regular People?

8K views 87 replies 48 participants last post by  1911crazy 
#1 ·
I'll probably regret asking, but what's a good, accurate 1911 for someone who wants to shoot well at up to 25 yards?

I have an SW1911 and a Colt "ELCEN" .38 Super. I find them both accurate, as in most shots go into 1.5" at 7 yards offhand, but I've started to think I would like to feel really good about my pistol's accuracy so I will learn more about what I'm doing wrong.

I just shoot in my backyard. I don't plan to compete, and I'm not so desperate for accuracy that I want to buy a weird-looking competition gun.

I don't know if I'm ready to blow $3K on one hobby pistol. I see that the Gold Cup Trophy is not too expensive, and it's supposedly better than run-of-the-mill guns.

Also, if I want to improve my existing guns, will new barrel bushings make a big difference?
 
#2 ·
I'll probably regret asking, but what's a good, accurate 1911 for someone who wants to shoot well at up to 25 yards?

I have an SW1911 and a Colt "ELCEN" .38 Super. I find them both accurate, as in most shots go into 1.5" at 7 yards offhand, but I've started to think I would like to feel really good about my pistol's accuracy so I will learn more about what I'm doing wrong.
...
*My* SW1911PC is about as accurate as anything, though only commander-sized. A DW gov't-sized is in the works; for which I have have high expectations. But my first thought is to improve technique: that very short stroke, plunger m1911 trigger has lots of potential; but takes some learning coming from swinging triggers.

Maybe have your S&W trigger examined for whether it would benefit from lightening and/smoothing. An m1911 whose maker has "Wesson" in the name oughta be GtG for approaching your limits as a shooter.

HtH
 
#4 ·
Any high-end one will outshoot the user. Baer and Alchemy are two in particular.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Most midrange ones will outshoot most users, on super high end one with optics it becomes crazy apparent how much user error is involved. You should be able to get no more than .5 inch (near same hole) groups at 10 yards standing before you will start to outpace lower end guns abilities

As for mag capacity do what makes you comfortable but timers don't lie so make sure to time first shot speed, accuracy, and overall performance before writing off the 1911
 
#10 ·
I totally forgot where I was when I said I wouldn't carry an 8-shot gun for protection. I guess I'm in for it now.

If it helps, I love the 1911, whereas the frumpy Glock I carry is just a tool, like a toilet brush.

I would be afraid to carry a 1911 all day because it might get scratched.
 
#11 ·
most shots go into 1.5" at 7 yards offhand,
That is not a gun limitation unless you are hampered by recoil.

In order of what I think will seem of least to most interest to you:
Technique; train, study, practice.
Ammo; do you buy or load good quality ammunition? If not, do so.
Accurize; a fitted bushing might do, perhaps barrel, sights, and trigger on the Colt.
Smallbore; a good .22 will return more accuracy for the buck than about anything else.
Secondary market; sales of nicer guns are soft, you could probably find a second hand Baer for a lot less than new, maybe less than mass produced.
 
#12 · (Edited)
WC offers a 1" guarantee at 25y on their full size 1911's (off a rest). Believe me, it is a real spec, I shot 2" 5R groups (freehand) with several of my 5" Wilson's regularly when I frequent indoor ranges some years ago (now I shoot outside at small steel plates)...There are other major custom guns like Bear also who offer a guarantee even out to 50 yards. NH can likely do an inch at 25, but I don't know if they have a guarantee...

But to put this in perspective, the Walther PPQ-Q5 5" in 9mm has printed 1" groups in several gun mags over the last few years as well as been reported by gun owners. And it is a lot less expensive that a custom 1911.

That would be slow shooting...I Guess you have to define "what shooting well at 25y means" to you Sarg'?
 
#13 ·
The Performance Center 1911 is giving me bad thoughts, but I see some people are claiming these guns aren't what they were a few years ago.

I guess you can't send Smith & Wesson an email and ask if their current pistols stink and expect a realistic answer.
 
#15 ·
I'm seeing a lot of false assumptions in this thread. First, the assumption that anyone short of a champion bullseye pistol shooter will ever be able to discern the difference in mechanical accuracy between a quality mid-range 1911 and a top-end one. Second, the idea that a nine-shot (not 8-shot) pistol is insufficient for personal defense. And third, the notion that speed of the draw and your first shot has anything whatsoever to do with the realities of using lethal force in the real world.
 
#38 ·
Agree w/ all this. I reframed from commenting on these off-topic tidbits as we know what would happen if all the "experts" pipe-in.
 
#17 ·
I'm neither an 'operator', nor a gun-game imperial, master poobah - or a tattooed, youtube gun-guru, for that matter - but I have been shooting for a long time - and have been helping folks improve their shooting for a good portion of that time. From my experience, most people cannot fully wring out the best performance possible out of just about any production pistol without lots and lots of time and effort behind the trigger. In other words, focusing on equipment that guarantees 1" or 1.5" at 25yds, is energy misdirected if you cannot print 'one-ragged-hole' groups at 7yds or 10yds on command - and frankly, most production guns can do that with little to no coaxing.

One of the techniques I've used with folks in search of consistent accuracy is to have them shoot a target at 3yds until they can make those one-hole groups consistently. After that, push to 5yds and repeat. Then 7yds, then 10yds, etc. One of the benefits of this is that it builds confidence, both in the gun and in the shooter's improving skill/mastery. Mistakes in form are clearly identifiable because feedback is immediate and clearly visible early on. Starting very close also helps to identify a gun not capable of such performance - something not very common at all. Lemons do exist, certainly, but they are fewer and farther apart than the interweb would have you believe. This regimen does require patience and commitment, but it has paid dividends in the end.

So, all this to say, by all means, get the expensive pistol if you like it and want it, but, don't spend the money solely on the belief that all of a sudden it's going to make you a better shot. Only quality practice can achieve that - lots of it.

Just my 2-cents!! :) :) :)
 
#18 ·
I'm regular people, I don't like paying over 1k for a gun, but I'm grateful to have a few.
I've done a Trigger-Job on all my 1911s and polished the insides. I've got some 5-$600 guns that stay on target at 25 yards, and even some short barrels that are impressive.
For me, I've found a smooth trigger around 4lbs to be vital for accuracy.
I think I paid $40 for the sear jig, and a few hours each on the jobs.
 
#19 ·
I'm not totally feeble; I just have the idea that I can do better if I shoot more often, make the ammo myself, and make sure the gun isn't contributing any error.

I had to dig to find an example of my shooting. Found an old SW1911 target. I believe this is 50 rounds, so it opened up a bit. The distance is 7 yards. It would be neat to shrink the hole by 50%.

 

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#22 ·
Were those shots in close succession? If so, then that many rounds will cause fatigue to factor in as well, no doubt. What can the pistol do rested? Have you tried that? I always test a new gun rested to eliminate the 'me' factor as much as possible in assessing its capability before going unsupported. Following that exercise, I can no longer blame the gun for any 'crappy performance' I may deliver. This is why I know that most production guns are capable of very good accuracy - we are 'variable' affecting that!! :)
 
#20 ·
OP.

The Colt GCT will be a fine shooter. You should have no trouble shooting decent groups at 25 yds....it's a great choice.

And if you wanted to throw an EGW bushing at it, that's an inexpensive accuracy upgrade that never hurts.
 
#21 ·
dsk-------- I agree with your post except your last line.

Because the speed of your draw & your 1st shot have a TON to do with defense.

If you watch the real-life security footage shown on Active Self Protection, you will see that the first guy to get shots on target usually wins.

And John, the show's host, says that exact thing many, many times.

Not that this matters to the OP anyhow. He's not using his 1911 as a defense tool. Just a fun shooter.

Btw, I don't really see a need for a super-accurate gun for that purpose. It's throwing money away. A Laser-Lyte system is cheap & will improve your accuracy more than a better gun.

A quality gun just goes, more precisely, into the wrong direction that you are pointing it in.
 
#27 ·
dsk-------- I agree with your post except your last line.

Because the speed of your draw & your 1st shot have a TON to do with defense.


If you watch the real-life security footage shown on Active Self Protection, you will see that the first guy to get shots on target usually wins.

And John, the show's host, says that exact thing many, many times.

Not that this matters to the OP anyhow. He's not using his 1911 as a defense tool. Just a fun shooter.

Btw, I don't really see a need for a super-accurate gun for that purpose. It's throwing money away. A Laser-Lyte system is cheap & will improve your accuracy more than a better gun.

A quality gun just goes, more precisely, into the wrong direction that you are pointing it in.
I'm pretty sure he was referring to that as being the third false assumption (that it is a false assumption to not address that as an important aspect).
 
#23 ·
In my experience most stock production guns can outshoot 90% of the people who buy them. The last Springfield Mil spec I bought was bolted into a Ransom Rest and would place an entire magazine into a ragged 1 inch hole at 17 yards. Straight out of the box with no work done to it. I did a trigger job on it and it is now my wife's gun and she has won quite a few matches with it. I LOVE watching her beat all the guys with that gun......
 
#29 ·
Someone once said "Only accurate guns are interesting". I have grown to appreciate this sentiment. Fortunately the typical 1911's I have owned have been interesting. In many cases more interesting than the previous owner.....

I have also come to realize that even a mediocre shooter will benefit from an accurate firearm. For me I do not accept mediocre accuracy from a firearm, Its far easier to teach a person to shoot accurately than the gun......

15yds supported, my maximum accuracy standard is 2.5". If a handgun won't do at least that good, and many haven't, they are eventually traded off. I have several that are capable of less than half that. Those indeed are my most interesting firearms, and favorite to shoot.

Offhand accuracy is not as much a reflection of what your pistol can do, but what you can do. Your pistol is most assuredly much more accurate than 1.5" at 7yds.
 
#31 · (Edited)
IMO any repeat any 1911 will outshoot an average user, even inexpensive ones like Tisas or Rock Island. Let a really good shooter shoot a cheap 1911, and he will outshoot the average shooter who is using the good shooter's $3000 1911. Assuming good ammo for both guns. I would like to see the Sarge work on his skills for a while, say with a 22LR target gun, and buy good (consistent) ammunition for his 1911. Since the stated purpose is essentially a range toy, forget about an expensive 1911 unless you really have the money to blow on one, and also want a barbecue gun. Nothing at all wrong with that, just trying to inform the OP's choices.

BTW I have one Glock and one toilet brush, and I live in fear of confusing them during a home invasion.
 
#32 ·
Let a really good shooter shoot a cheap 1911, and he will outshoot the average shooter who is using the good shooter's $3000 1911.
This is so true on many levels, I know that Eric Clapton could use some el cheapo crap guitar and amp, and still blow me away with me using my nice gear.
Oh, I do agree with a previous poster who advised a 1911 with the name Wesson in it,, stock, out of the box, hard to beat for the price.
 
#37 ·
The simple truth is that most off the shelf CNC cut production guns will shoot quite accurately. I would think it would be extremely hard not to find one that couldn't do 2" at 25 yards rested. Not all of them will shoot hardball that well, but if you're shooting a 200 grain lead semi wadcutter in a .45... You shouldn't have any problem finding a gun that will shoot that well.

It has been recommended on the Bullseye side of things that a good starter gun for Bullseye, is a Springfield Range Officer. The idea that you build skill with the gun, and when you can out shoot it, have it rebarreled with a real national match barrel.

The gun and shooter are only part of the equation. You need good sights, and a good load. Target loads will be easier to get if you are a reloader.
 
#39 ·
I had to go back to the OP to reread what you were asking. First, your current pistols should be more than accurate enough for what you describe. Most pistols will shoot better than their owners all day long.

If you are asking where you should spend your money, I would suggest taking the cost of a good quality 1911, and invest in a week at Gunsite. The training, and practice, you will receive will be far more valuable than any new gun you might acquire.

For just advice on training, (besides Gunsite) acquire a .22 conversion kit, and practice trigger control. The use of a conversion kit allows you to use the same trigger for a lot less money. Personally, I think trigger control is the most important, because I can draw diagrams, show photos, etcetera, of sight picture, but can not find a way to show you the intricacies of trigger control, it just takes practice. A former coworker, who teaches at Gunsite now, gives the advice of, "Front sight, press," when asked about how to shoot better. A simple explanation of the two most important parts of shooting accurately, acquisition of the front sight, and proper trigger control.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
 
#40 ·
Here's a boost for G. I. 1911s and 1911A1s. So many tales of grossly inaccurate G. I. 1911s abound. The utterly worn out clunk of a World War Colt Model 1911 I have will shoot a magazine-full inside the bottom of a 1 lb. coffee can (remember those?) at 25 yards if I'm in a shooting humor. To me that ain't bad. Groups are nice and round and the pistol shoots to point-of-aim. It's actually kind of gratifying to shoot the old thing.

The Remington Rand 1911A1 I have groups about as well as a late 1970s Colt Gold Cup I have and that outstanding. The various commercial Colt Government Models here all shoot usefully pleasing tight groups and they're stock.
 
#41 ·
I have a 1943 Colt M1911A1 that I used to shoot before values went through the roof and it became a safe queen. It happens to be one of my most accurate 1911s. The stories of inaccurate .45s came from guys who were not properly trained in handgun usage and also had to qualify with no eye or ear protection. It also came from vets who had fired at enemy soldiers in a panic and naturally were unable to hit anything. And lastly there were those later on who were issued worn-out clunkers with shot-out barrels, which truly were inaccurate.
 
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