Problem with Winchester white box 9mm range ammo running on nighthawk custom 1911 !!! - Page 3 - 1911Forum
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  #51  
Old 08-17-2019, 08:48 PM
Lsingh Lsingh is offline
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The extractor was an issue ... I havenít tried it back with the Winchester ammo more likely itís Iíll work since the gun has been serviced with the new fitted extractor . Thou my choice of range ammo is Winchester . I religiously buy three to four boxes of ammo every month regardless I make a range trip or not so always have quite a bit stock in hand .. itís cheap and have never given me any trouble other than with this gun with faulty extractor ...


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  #52  
Old 08-18-2019, 09:36 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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FWIW, I had my chrony set up for some 357 loads I was messing with and one of my friends was at the range shooting his .40. He too had a couple boxes of WWB and decided to run a mag through it. We couldnít believe how crappy the result was. Handloaded beefed up 357 and I had an extreme deviation of 18 FPS. The White Box had 100! Ridiculous.....
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  #53  
Old 08-18-2019, 11:57 AM
mdell49 mdell49 is offline
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Originally Posted by Rifter View Post
My handloaded practice ammo (.45 ACP) is better than most of the factory ammo, even the premium LEO stuff. My good stuff is well beyond even the premium. Don't even load much of it anymore cuz I've got many, many boxes of it sitting on the shelf.
The only time I use factory ammo is when I attend a training class that will only allow factory ammo. Then I usually go with Blazer Brass because it uses small pistol primers so I don't give a second thought about leaving it where it falls. Most classes I've attended don't allow time to pick up your brass. When you handload you are the QC. I can load 500 rounds for half the cost of factory ammo and produce a higher quality product. No Comparison
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  #54  
Old 08-19-2019, 07:00 AM
SuperMan SuperMan is offline
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I have run several cases of WWB through a S&W 6906, G19, Colt Commander and probably several others with no issues.... I have seen several dozen people run this ammo through their guns with no issues...

Bob
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  #55  
Old 08-19-2019, 07:13 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Originally Posted by SuperMan View Post
I have run several cases of WWB through a S&W 6906, G19, Colt Commander and probably several others with no issues.... I have seen several dozen people run this ammo through their guns with no issues...

Bob
ďNo issuesĒ.....sure, bang bang bang....
Awful accuracy. The brass is nice though.
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  #56  
Old 08-19-2019, 07:15 AM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
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Haven’t bought any in 3+ years. My son had some i wanted to use up, and or ran through my new guncrafter commander without any issues. My complaint with the stuff is how dirty it shoots compared to other brands, no FTEs.
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  #57  
Old 08-19-2019, 09:46 AM
tjpaxton tjpaxton is offline
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We are anxiously awaiting your second range report. And would enjoy some photos also.
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  #58  
Old 08-21-2019, 07:21 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Iíll point out the flyers if we get some target pics!
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  #59  
Old 10-07-2019, 03:16 PM
eharri3 eharri3 is offline
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The Winchester White Box gave me nothing but problems with my old Colt govt model 9mm. Couldn't get through a mag without at least a couple mallfunctions. Same as original poster. Multiple failures to extract. A number of times failing to fully return to battery. It was my first mag full after picking up a couple hundred rounds of the stuff. Thank God I didn't bother buying any more than that. After clearing several malfunctions I field stripped and eye balled it trying to figure out what was wrong with the gun and seeing nothing. After I ate up the rest of the box of that stuff I bought with me to the range I went back to the register and got a box of Fiocchi and everything was fine again.

I am working my way through whatever boxes of that WWB garbage I have left and replacing them with Fiocchi. THe Fiocchi is dirt cheap and goes bang every single time in both my .45 and my .9. 10 or 11 bucks for a box of 9 and 15 for a box of 45 around me. If I see Federal or Blazer at a good price I will pick some of that up too but I could easily see the day coming when I open my cans and see nothing but Fiocchi boxes.

Last edited by eharri3; 10-07-2019 at 03:56 PM.
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  #60  
Old 10-07-2019, 05:04 PM
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Rifter Rifter is offline
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Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
ďNo issuesĒ.....sure, bang bang bang....
Awful accuracy. The brass is nice though.



Nah, even the brass sucks. Rim thickness is not consistent, the extractor cut is not consistent, and rim diameter is often enough out of spec that it doesn't fit a standard shell holder correctly. What irritates me even more than the steaming pile of crap ammo, is people that are apologists for it just because it has a famous name on it. Seems like just because they haven't had any problems with, the rest of us are lying to them or something when we say its crap ammo.
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  #61  
Old 10-07-2019, 06:55 PM
shakyshoot shakyshoot is offline
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Originally Posted by Rifter View Post
Seems like just because they haven't had any problems with, the rest of us are lying to them or something when we say its crap ammo.
Obviously no one is saying anyone is lying. Just as I'm not lying when I say I've shot several cases of WWB in several calibers with no problems. We can only report on our own experience. As far as accuracy vs other factory ammo--at 10 to 25 yard pistol shooting, how many of us can really tell the difference?
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  #62  
Old 10-07-2019, 08:43 PM
Big Pete10 Big Pete10 is offline
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WWB, Blazer Aluminum, American Eagle, cheap Remington, has all worked for me in 5 different 9 mm guns, IDPA style shooting so nothing over 20 yards. At 50 yards it would prolly be a different story. I did see a HP style gun(not Browning) during CCH class that didn't work with WWB, this about 20 years ago. Nephew had a small semi that wouldn't work with anything except Aluminum Blazer. All new guns don't work as well as they should, I've sent several back to the mother ship for repair, repaired others myself.
It ain't usually bad factory loaded ammo.
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  #63  
Old 10-08-2019, 07:51 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Originally Posted by shakyshoot View Post
Obviously no one is saying anyone is lying. Just as I'm not lying when I say I've shot several cases of WWB in several calibers with no problems. We can only report on our own experience. As far as accuracy vs other factory ammo--at 10 to 25 yard pistol shooting, how many of us can really tell the difference?
Gotcha there my friend. Pick me, Pick me!!
All day long I can show definitive proof on paper comparing WB to, letís say PMC or Gold Medal Match. Itís that terrible. A lazy morning shoot at paint cans in the sand pit is not what Iím talking about. Try it...sand bag from the bench, take your time. PMC will kick itís arse....provided you are half ways proficient. ďNo ProblemsĒ many times refers to the ammo going bang, the gun cycles and goes bang again. Shoot that junk through a chrony, you will think itís broken!!
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  #64  
Old 10-09-2019, 12:53 AM
1MoreFord 1MoreFord is offline
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I skimmed through most of this thread so if it's been mentioned before I apologize for the repeat.

I've seen it mentioned before that there is a serious difference between the 50 round boxes of WWB and the bulk round boxes. This is my experience too. I've had good luck with the 50 count boxes and FTExtract with the bulk boxes.
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  #65  
Old 10-09-2019, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Gotcha there my friend. Pick me, Pick me!!
All day long I can show definitive proof on paper comparing WB to, letís say PMC or Gold Medal Match. Itís that terrible. A lazy morning shoot at paint cans in the sand pit is not what Iím talking about. Try it...sand bag from the bench, take your time. PMC will kick itís arse....provided you are half ways proficient. ďNo ProblemsĒ many times refers to the ammo going bang, the gun cycles and goes bang again. Shoot that junk through a chrony, you will think itís broken!!



I haven't tried PMC in a long time, but I've never heard anybody bad mouthing it either. But I sure can agree with you on the WWB. Same on the Federal version and the Remington version as well. Absolute crap ammo. I've still got a partial box of Federal that I ran over the chrony. 230 gr. ball, with velocity swings of 200+ fps. One of these days I'll get around to pulling the bullets to reuse.
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  #66  
Old 10-09-2019, 07:25 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Youch! 200 is what I would expect from UMC. I thought 100 from the small sample of WB was bad. I imagine if we sat and shot the entire box through it, that it would get worse. Sometimes at the range you donít even need to run it through a chrony. You hear (from someone a couple lanes over) ďBang, Bang, Pop, Dammit, WTH.......I donít even need to look to know what they are shooting.
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  #67  
Old 10-10-2019, 09:20 PM
Rock185 Rock185 is offline
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I guess I've been lucky with the thousands of rounds of 9MM WWB I've used over the years. At one time or another, I think I've used it in all my 9MM pistols, revolvers and carbines. I don't have any Nighthawk 1911s, but have used it in a factory STI, Dan Wesson and Kimber 9MM 1911s, along with a custom Springfield. All without incident. But I can see how a new, and precisely fitted, 1911 could have an issue and might initially need ammo loaded a bit warmer.....

I can only recall having one bad round of 115 grain WWB. During manufacture, it appears that the the case mouth caught on the seating die. This damaged both bullet and case and would have prevented the round chambering. It was not difficult to spot as I loaded a magazine.
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  #68  
Old 10-11-2019, 07:47 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Again, the lack of ďproblemsĒ does not equate to consistency and accuracy. Even the crappiest of the crap goes bang bang.
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  #69  
Old 10-11-2019, 11:37 AM
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It is a little disheartening that a hawk flew out of its nest with an extractor problem. That price point should come with better testing. Wouldnít sway me from a purchase though.

That's one of the reasons I have a somewhat dim view of most of the so called premium priced guns. Having had a full on custom build to my specs the biggest problem I've seen with the big name guns is that they are built too tight, and the price gets run up with expensive gegaws that don't help functioning one bit. I worked at the shop that built mine, and the smith and I both competed in combat pistol matches. He listened to me and what I wanted on the gun, and built it accordingly. Over the course of better than a decade and 250k rds the only malfunction I ever had was a broken extractor hook. I've seen so many of the Ed Brown, Wilson, and other top name efforts that cost three times what I paid for my custom, fail repeatedly until 500 to 1000 rds were fired, that it left a bad taste in my mouth for such guns. My $650 Ruger SR1911 has clean lines, every feature I want for a combat gun, and is utterly reliable. I have to chuckle every time I read some post about a $2000-3000 custom and the guy is having trouble with it working right. The day my smith finished mine I took it out and shot a combat pistol match with it, came in 2nd place. I could've done the same thing with the SR1911, right out of the box. I'd buy a dozen more of them before even considering any of the so-called premium guns.
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  #70  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:37 PM
Rock185 Rock185 is offline
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Rifter, I've wondered too about some of the reliability issues reported with high end/premium priced guns, especially if chambered in 9MM. Many are certainly beautifully fitted and finished. It would seem reliability would be paramount though. Especially with names that imply the guns would be up to the task of carry/LE/military use,e.g., "Carry", "Tactical", "Professional", "Combat","Recon", "Enforcer", "Agent", etc. I've owned a few of those premium priced guns, some closely/tightly fitted, and have experienced excellent reliability. But strictly from a reliability standpoint, most of my more pedestrian pistols have demonstrated equal reliability. I've owned several commonplace 9MM 1911 pistols, STI, Dan Wesson and Kimber for instance, that demonstrate that "boring reliability" often spoken of, with any and all of the many kinds of 9MM ammo I've used. Pistols that cost 3-4 times what production pistols cost should certainly be expected to perform with that same boring reliability IMHO.....YMMV
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  #71  
Old 10-13-2019, 08:52 PM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is offline
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Rifter, I've wondered too about some of the reliability issues reported with high end/premium priced guns, especially if chambered in 9MM. Many are certainly beautifully fitted and finished. It would seem reliability would be paramount though. Especially with names that imply the guns would be up to the task of carry/LE/military use,e.g., "Carry", "Tactical", "Professional", "Combat","Recon", "Enforcer", "Agent", etc. I've owned a few of those premium priced guns, some closely/tightly fitted, and have experienced excellent reliability. But strictly from a reliability standpoint, most of my more pedestrian pistols have demonstrated equal reliability. I've owned several commonplace 9MM 1911 pistols, STI, Dan Wesson and Kimber for instance, that demonstrate that "boring reliability" often spoken of, with any and all of the many kinds of 9MM ammo I've used. Pistols that cost 3-4 times what production pistols cost should certainly be expected to perform with that same boring reliability IMHO.....YMMV
I'll tell you right now from NHC themselves as I was standing in their building that they do NOT build their guns the same as WC or Brown and they do not expect or intend them to run more than 300 rounds without at least lube added and 500 is when they say they should be cleaned.

I personally have never had an issue with my WC guns and I have RUN the absolute hell out of them on crap ammo and mags to the point they are most my reliable guns since they simply do not care while I can get others to fail if I pick really bad mags and ammo and limp wrist them left handed.

The trade off is the guns from WC do not feel as tight or "glass on glass" as NHC and lack certain qualities that people have gotten used to un super high end guns. A WC has play you can feel in the slide intentionally, so they run.
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  #72  
Old 10-14-2019, 07:27 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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I wonder if anyone has a Stan Chen that was chronically problematic? There are also a ton of inexpensive rattletrap guns that just run because they are so loose. I canít help but think the more expensive class $2K-3K are just better built and do need a bit of ďbreak inĒ. The accuracy is much better than the conveyor belt variety.
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  #73  
Old 10-14-2019, 09:33 AM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is offline
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I wonder if anyone has a Stan Chen that was chronically problematic? There are also a ton of inexpensive rattletrap guns that just run because they are so loose. I can’t help but think the more expensive class $2K-3K are just better built and do need a bit of “break in”. The accuracy is much better than the conveyor belt variety.
I don't know man, my high ends all worked 100% no issue from the store shelf into a 1000 round burn or they didn't and never were correctable.
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  #74  
Old 10-15-2019, 07:39 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Yes sir, but I was not classifying your WC as a rattletrap. Wilson, Nighthawk, Brown, Wesson......all better than an R1 for example (no disrespect intended at all).
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  #75  
Old 10-15-2019, 08:56 AM
wlhawk wlhawk is offline
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WWB has functioned in all of my pistols, but was not as clean and accurate as better brands or my reloads. I haven't purchased WWB or UMC in several years. I can't justify using inferior ammunition in a high end pistol.
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