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  #1  
Old 04-17-2017, 08:32 PM
Baltimoreed11754 Baltimoreed11754 is offline
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Wild Bunch 1911 issues

This weekend was the 4th WB match that I've attended at a small club an hours drive away. Nice clean range, friendly guys, easy scenarios and close targets. They shoot for the fun and if your rifle craps out will even give you a reshoot though technically once you fire the first round you own the stage. But it totally amazes me that guys bring very nice 1911s to the shoot and cant get them to fire one 5 rd magazine let alone 3 without the gun becoming a jamomatic. Every stage is a struggle. These matches are a month apart which should be enough time to get the bugs out of your gun, mags or ammo. I believe that most of their problems are failures to feed though they also have ejection issues. I'm not trying to diagnose the other shooters problems but am curious why they keep having them. Buy quality magazines, springs that are correct power to the ammunition and ammo that will feed and chamber without problems with a gun that is not overly messed with. I've put 3 1911s together over the years and they all run fine. 1911s can have a lot of potential problems but are not that hard to troubleshoot if you change one thing at a time.
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Last edited by Baltimoreed11754; 04-17-2017 at 08:34 PM. Reason: Clarification
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  #2  
Old 04-18-2017, 09:20 AM
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Tom Freeman Tom Freeman is offline
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Reloads or factory ammo?
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Old 04-18-2017, 11:12 AM
Brian Dover Brian Dover is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Freeman View Post
Reloads or factory ammo?
Keep in mind I've been away from the sport since before these Wild Bunch shoots started. But in general, most Cowboy Action Shooters reload, because the rules have always required lead bullets, since virtually every target is steel. And of course it's still way cheaper to roll your own than use factory.

Having said the above, this sport has brought back a lot of old school factory ammo loadings from the companies who support the game. But velocities are mild and lead is always used.
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  #4  
Old 04-18-2017, 12:15 PM
Jim Watson Jim Watson is online now
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Beats me. I shot CAS before the Wild Bunch division came along, but I noticed the same thing in all guns, revolver, rifle, or shotgun. Setting up guns and loading good ammo is not a high priority for a lot of the attendees.
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Old 04-18-2017, 12:17 PM
Brian Dover Brian Dover is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Watson View Post
Beats me. I shot CAS before the Wild Bunch division came along, but I noticed the same thing in all guns, revolver, rifle, or shotgun. Setting up guns and loading good ammo is not a high priority for a lot of the attendees.
That's a good point too, and quite frankly something I'd forgotten about.
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  #6  
Old 04-18-2017, 04:57 PM
havanajim havanajim is online now
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Over the course of many years of competition, I have found that, overwhelmingly, problems with competition firearms (and firearms in general) reside with the user and not with the gun. Either sloppy or defective hand-loaded ammo, or guns that have been messed with by people who should have left well-enough alone. Once started down the path of 'changing this', 'tweaking that', without a good grasp of what you're doing or why, then all you're really doing is inviting trouble. I see that end result often at matches.
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Old 04-18-2017, 11:20 PM
mark2734 mark2734 is offline
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Originally Posted by havanajim View Post
Over the course of many years of competition, I have found that, overwhelmingly, problems with competition firearms (and firearms in general) reside with the user and not with the gun. Either sloppy or defective hand-loaded ammo, or guns that have been messed with by people who should have left well-enough alone. Once started down the path of 'changing this', 'tweaking that', without a good grasp of what you're doing or why, then all you're really doing is inviting trouble. I see that end result often at matches.
I'll second this. I may not have the most tricked out gun, or ammo that's right at the edge but my stuff goes bang every time. Some guys spend way more time messing around to get things "just right" instead of working right.
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  #8  
Old 04-19-2017, 05:52 AM
Rwehavinfunyet Rwehavinfunyet is offline
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Gun issues....

I was shooting my 5" (extremely reliable) 9mm STI Eagle in an IDPA match a few weeks ago, and started having jams/issues during the first two stages of the match.....when it happened on the second stage, I took the empty gun to the safe area, and removed the slide.....the first thing I noticed, the long extended ejector had broken off so I withdrew from the match. Since I have shot about 80 thousand rounds through the gun, I accept the fact that some parts may break.....I'm OK with that for "gun games".....not for a carry gun....!
I replaced the long extended ejector, and the gun is now back to its old reliable self.....
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  #9  
Old 04-19-2017, 07:32 AM
Baltimoreed11754 Baltimoreed11754 is offline
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Thanks for the responses guys. We shoot reloads in cas, only factory loads are for the shotgun but I reload them too. I think that one of the problems is that the shooters are trying to run target velocity ammo through a gun thats probably set up for factory/defense loads. Dumb thing is that there IS a power factor for WB. Simple fix, get a lighter recoil spring. The one shooter said that he was using Trailboss powder. I tried some but didn't like it and went back to the Dot powders. All the shooters shot with both hands as opposed to duelist so I wouldn't think they are limp wristing the gun. I was the only duelist that match.
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  #10  
Old 04-19-2017, 07:26 PM
Andyk Andyk is offline
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I shoot SASS and use nothing but Trailboss at the very minimum for the bullet weight. Same barge in both rifle and pistols. Works great. Literally no recoil in the rifle.

I think most failures are self induced as some have said.
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  #11  
Old 04-19-2017, 10:49 PM
havanajim havanajim is online now
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Originally Posted by Baltimoreed11754 View Post
... I was the only duelist that match.
Duelist here as well. That's the only correct way to fire a single action revolver, anyway!!!!! We're right, they're wrong - I tell them that at every match, but they don't seem to listen..
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  #12  
Old 04-20-2017, 06:03 PM
Snapdragon Snapdragon is online now
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Shooting lead reloads out of 1911 pistols in Wild Bunch was a real problem for quite a few people when my club started shooting Wild Bunch. The main problem seemed to be that people were not very familiar with how to load lead bullets so they work well in a 1911. Many participants experienced numerous failures that were ammo related. Things got a lot better as people learned the simple tricks to use when reloading lead 45 Auto ammo. We rarely see many malfunctions these days.

Learning how to get a proper bell and a proper crimp and seating and crimping in separate steps cured lots of the problems.
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  #13  
Old 04-20-2017, 06:40 PM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rwehavinfunyet View Post
I was shooting my 5" (extremely reliable) 9mm STI Eagle in an IDPA match a few weeks ago, and started having jams/issues during the first two stages of the match.....when it happened on the second stage, I took the empty gun to the safe area, and removed the slide.....the first thing I noticed, the long extended ejector had broken off so I withdrew from the match. Since I have shot about 80 thousand rounds through the gun, I accept the fact that some parts may break.....I'm OK with that for "gun games".....not for a carry gun....!
I replaced the long extended ejector, and the gun is now back to its old reliable self.....
I would call that gun reliable though lol!
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  #14  
Old 04-20-2017, 10:37 PM
Snapdragon Snapdragon is online now
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Wild Bunch is not really just regular Cowboy Shooting with a 1911. There are somewhat different firearm requirements including power factor and caliber requirements. Local matches will probably not be too strict, but the rifles must be 40 caliber or above, if I remember correctly, with a minimum power factor. The 1911 should be 45 Auto with full power loads and has some accessory limitations. Bunny burp loads out of my 32/20 would not be appropriate, and 38 Special rifles with loads that shoot very light bullets at the speed of smell are out of place.

A 1911 that is reliable with ball ammo or regular defensive loads should be able to run with well made lead ammo suitable for Wild Bunch shooting. Most of the failures I have witnessed have been ammo related.
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  #15  
Old 04-21-2017, 12:57 PM
Baltimoreed11754 Baltimoreed11754 is offline
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The one shooter who has consistent match to match issues stated that he thought that his slide wasn't cycling fast enough to work the gun but I also heard shooters complain of arthritis in their hands. You can't have it both ways, either live with loads that will work a legit 1911 or set yourself up a bullseye gun for local WB matches and be prepared for the ribbing.
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  #16  
Old 05-22-2017, 09:14 AM
AZ Snake AZ Snake is offline
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I've been shooting Wild Bunch twice a month for eight years.
Almost ALL problems I have seen have been ammo related.
Rounds loaded to long and/or not enough crimp seem to be the primary problems.
Power factor is 150 minimum. Most run about 165.
A 14 pound recoil spring works good if everything else is setup ok.
Both my wife and I shoot Traditional, which is one handed, and I can't even remember the last fail to feed.
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