The dang 8 round clip and jhps - 1911Forum
1911Forum
Advertise Here
Forum   Reviews   Rules   Legal   Site Supporters & Donations   Advertise


Go Back   1911Forum > >

Notices


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-10-2010, 11:20 AM
bbach bbach is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bismarck, ND
Posts: 282
The dang 8 round clip and jhps

This has been discussed before I know. I've run a few hundred rounds of fmjs and jhps through my Kobra. Things work without a hitch with the ed brown 7 round clips. The fmjs feed great no matter what clip I use. The jhps hang up with the ed brown eight round clip but only the first round. You really have to be agressive with the slide to get the first round in without hanging up. I'm wondering why I think I need eight rounds? If I can't stop an attack with seven shots I'm probably not going to get the job done at all. I've been using Gold Dots for the jhps. I'm going to try a couple hundred Hornady jhps to see if they feed a little better. I'm beginning to really dislike the eight round clip.
  #2  
Old 05-10-2010, 11:23 AM
Ticeman Ticeman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Midwest
Age: 54
Posts: 2,255
That would be "Mags" noob.
  #3  
Old 05-10-2010, 11:24 AM
69charger 69charger is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Tacoma Wa.
Posts: 8,055
I load all my mags with 7. 7 or 8 round mags get the same from me. It is a tight squeeze with 8 rounds. JMHO.
Dave
__________________
Its not what you have, or where you have it,
Its who you are, that counts
Colt-Glock17
SEMPER FI
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old 05-10-2010, 11:28 AM
BillD BillD is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Age: 65
Posts: 27,705
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbach View Post
This has been discussed before I know. I've run a few hundred rounds of fmjs and jhps through my Kobra. Things work without a hitch with the ed brown 7 round clips. The fmjs feed great no matter what clip I use. The jhps hang up with the ed brown eight round clip but only the first round. You really have to be agressive with the slide to get the first round in without hanging up. I'm wondering why I think I need eight rounds? If I can't stop an attack with seven shots I'm probably not going to get the job done at all. I've been using Gold Dots for the jhps. I'm going to try a couple hundred Hornady jhps to see if they feed a little better. I'm beginning to really dislike the eight round clip.

That would come as a real big surprise to all the hundreds of competitors who shoot CDP/SS and use 8 round mags. Literally tens of thousands of trouble free rounds go down range every weekend out of 8 rd mags.

What do you mean by "You really have to be agressive with the slide to get the first round in without hanging up" ?

Pulling it all the way back, beating it into submission, what?

If you have yourself down to 7, you can probably rationalize yourself down to 6 and then you into a revolver.
__________________
You can make excuses or you can make ready.
USPSA TY41889
NRA Life Member
  #5  
Old 05-10-2010, 12:29 PM
Johnny Numbers Johnny Numbers is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Houston,TX.
Posts: 1,255
My guns use mags. Where do you find these so called "clips?" LOL.
__________________
COTEP....CBOB0300
1911's: Ed Brown ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑβΕ, Dan Wesson CBOB, Colt 1991 Government, Springfield GI
  #6  
Old 05-10-2010, 12:48 PM
Greyson Greyson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ticeman View Post
That would be "Mags" noob.


Ok Bbach,

I personally run 8 round magazines in all my Browns. I won't run or carry a 7 rounder.

Ok...lets cover the bases.

1. Are you riding the slide home or pulling it all the way back and letting it slam? Or are you using the slide-stop to load it? Hint: pull it all the way back and let it fly.

2. I use ACT and CMC mags. All 8 rounders. I suggest you try CMC mags for a flush-fit in your carry Brown.

3. Personally I recommend Federal Hydra-Shok SD rounds. They have an extensive track record in SD shootings.


Regards,
Greyson
  #7  
Old 05-10-2010, 01:00 PM
crazy k38 crazy k38 is offline
Suspended
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Columbus, Ga
Posts: 491
greyson gives sage advice, after all he is 'the greyson' lol, but I also agree that slingshoting the slide will help out, and I like the ACT mags too. Don't mind the guys busting your chops about the clip thing, they are called mags, but some people love to drill the point home
  #8  
Old 05-10-2010, 02:49 PM
ENH ENH is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 120
I too have experienced the same problem with the 8 pack mags. It was solved with replacing the recoil spring and and a whole bunch of shooting.

By the way, if I remember right, John Browning in describing the 1911 used both magazine and clip at times. Websters definition of "clip" still reads - "a device to hold cartridges for charging the magazines of some rifles; also : a magazine from which ammunition is fed into the chamber of a firearm." both are correct, however, magazine seems to be the modern and accepted term for the clip.
  #9  
Old 05-10-2010, 03:02 PM
RickB's Avatar
RickB RickB is offline
1911 Aficionado
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Not Seattle, WA, USA
Posts: 21,642
In competition, nobody uses 7-round mags. Nobody uses a gun that doesn't work. So, it's not the mags, per se. Not all mags are created equal, and I've mostly retired all of my 8-rounds-in-a-7-round-tube, first-generation 8-rounders. I never really had any real trouble with the older style (Chip McCormick, in my case), but it's obvious that the newer, extended-tube 8-rounders are an improvement.
Everyone knows that "clip" means magazine in this context, but we (this forum) do strive for precise usage, for the benefit of both those asking, as well as those answering. In general, as noted, a clip is used to load a magazine.
__________________
If you're not shooting you should be moving. If you're not moving you should be reloading. If you're not shooting, moving, or reloading, you should be taping or picking brass. - Z.C.
  #10  
Old 05-10-2010, 07:55 PM
jbar1tex jbar1tex is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,278
I too have experienced what I believe the OP is seeing. In fact had a 45 min conversation with another member this morning.

Equipment Under test:
- EB EC
- ACT Mags - 8 rnd
- Speer GD 230 gr JHP & Federal HS 230 gr JHP

Problem statement:
When using the ACT Mags (new) with either SD ammo, fully loaded with qty 8 rounds, when inserted into the EC, I too cannot get the first round to chamber - using any method. Pull way back and let-r-rip either. This problem occurs with any of the qty 7 ACT mags just purchased. I do see the bullet trying to make its way up the feed ramp, but the slide will not go into battery.

Test performed thus far & early findings:
- Note I have NOT been to the range yet to truly try how these perform.

1) I tried the above with my 47D mags and found no issues - the mag would feed the round and hand cycle through each time - no hang ups. Multiple mags, multiple times.

2) I decreased the round count inserted into the mag and found that with qty 7 rounds, it would load and go into battery "some of the time". I decreased the round count to qty 6 and it would feed and go into battery on every single attempt. So the break point was established, and again, initially qty 8 would never feed the first round or go into battery.

3) I kept trying and trying and trying... I filled up each ACT mag with qty 8 and kept loading and hoping it would feed the first round and hand cycled through all 8. What I found out is after 60 minutes of this - each ACT mag will now load the first round and hand-cycle all the way through, like itís supposed to. Hence the mags need break-in thought
3a) I then loaded 8+1 and did the same above - approx 20 times, again no issues. All seems to work like supposed to

Raw conclusion and observation:
- Perhaps the mags need to be broken in? My buddy and I debated this for a while, but now I am asking you folks?
- I left last nightís hand cycling exercise feeling confident this is working like it's supposed to with both the ACT and 47D's. I had no issues after repeated use or "break-in". But I still need to get to the range.
- I never had any issues with the 47D's at all - feeding cycling, etc...
- I did notice that the ACT mags appear to not seat as well as the 47D's do into my EC. Hard to explain, but there seems to be room or some play left when inserting the mag into the handgun. The 47D's seem to seat tighter. I'd swear itís the base pads of the ACT's hitting the MSH or frame, or it looks like there is 1/16 of inch play left to push upwards? Again hard to explain and maybe nothing to it - just an observation.

Soooooo I too have seen what I think the Op was asking, not sure how to explain it, but just repeated playing with it, it seems that the ACT mags now are accepting the SD ammo, and are atleast hand-cycling just like one would expect. But I too experienced the first round would not feed and the slide would not go into battery.

Any thoughts fellas? My buddy & I both agree this is odd, but seeing this post made me want to ask too.
  #11  
Old 05-10-2010, 10:36 PM
bbach bbach is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bismarck, ND
Posts: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazy k38 View Post
Don't mind the guys busting your chops about the clip thing, they are called mags, but some people love to drill the point home
Oh I'm not concerned about it. I am able to have conversations with only those who can figure out what I'm talking about. That eliminates quite a few people.

I definately have tried to pull er back and let er fly as Greyson suggests. That is my normal method. Good success with that, but not 100% with the 8 rounder. Possibly trying some of the suggested brands might help.
  #12  
Old 05-11-2010, 09:37 AM
shoot 1911 shoot 1911 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: SW Louisiana
Posts: 89
Same Problem

Ditto - You may notice from some of my previous posts that I have had the same experience with 2 of the 4 Ed Brown 8-Packs that I own.

And I also tried the same advice given by our ultra experienced forum contributors....EXCEPT buying mags from a different vendor.

After contacting EB I was able to send my mags in for full replacements. In about 3 weeks I will be able to get back out on the range and continue to do more gun/mag reliability testing. My objective is to continue working with EB until I have all of the 5 EB mags tested into a fully reliable state of dependability. I will give EB the opportunity to provide me with a reliable mag until they refuse to replace any faulty ones.

Then or perhaps prior to then, I will add to my mag collection with the Tripp Cobra and some ACT products. I also prefer to have the opportunity to have 8 rounds +1 loaded for SD, no telling what my actual accuracy may become if I were to ever come under fire. I also plan to add a couple of 10 rounders to the mag collection.
__________________
Ed Brown Kobra - Sig P239 .40 S&W - Glock 17 - Ruger SRH .454 Casull - Ruger MK III - Colt SAA 44-40 - Ruger GP100 .357 Mag - SAKO .300 Wby - SAKO .270 Win - SAKO .243 Win - SAKO Mountain Eagle Rifle .223 - REM 700 .25-06 - CZ 453 Varmint .17 HMR - H&R Model 1871 .45-70 - Ruger 10/22 - Marlin Model 39A .22LR - Winchester Model 1892 .32WCF
  #13  
Old 05-12-2010, 09:33 AM
bbach bbach is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bismarck, ND
Posts: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by shoot 1911 View Post
Ditto - You may notice from some of my previous posts that I have had the same experience with 2 of the 4 Ed Brown 8-Packs that I own.

And I also tried the same advice given by our ultra experienced forum contributors....EXCEPT buying mags from a different vendor.

After contacting EB I was able to send my mags in for full replacements. In about 3 weeks I will be able to get back out on the range and continue to do more gun/mag reliability testing. My objective is to continue working with EB until I have all of the 5 EB mags tested into a fully reliable state of dependability. I will give EB the opportunity to provide me with a reliable mag until they refuse to replace any faulty ones.

Then or perhaps prior to then, I will add to my mag collection with the Tripp Cobra and some ACT products. I also prefer to have the opportunity to have 8 rounds +1 loaded for SD, no telling what my actual accuracy may become if I were to ever come under fire. I also plan to add a couple of 10 rounders to the mag collection.
Interesting Shoot. I have not thought about contacting EB about the clips that I should call mags. I'm going to further test this 8 round mag and see if it is operator error or mag error. I'm going to try some other ammo as well. Then I may have to contact Ed Brown.
  #14  
Old 05-12-2010, 10:35 AM
GunBugBit GunBugBit is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Arizona
Age: 60
Posts: 5,463
Certain Gold Dots are bad feeders.
__________________
USPSA, SCSA
  #15  
Old 05-12-2010, 01:55 PM
bbach bbach is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bismarck, ND
Posts: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by GunBugBit View Post
Certain Gold Dots are bad feeders.
I just got in an order of Hornady hp, 230 grain. I'm going to see how they load for me.
  #16  
Old 05-12-2010, 02:05 PM
bbbean bbbean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Peach Orchard, MO
Posts: 872
Stolen from an FBI agent

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbach View Post
the ed brown 7 round clips... I'm beginning to really dislike the eight round clip.
See the attached illustration:
Attached Thumbnails
Magazine_vs_Clip.jpg  
  #17  
Old 05-12-2010, 02:28 PM
bbach bbach is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bismarck, ND
Posts: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbean View Post
See the attached illustration:
Well here it is in a nutshell. I'm going to say clip most of the time. Mag is ok but magazine is too long. So if you can't figure out that I'm not speaking of a paper clip, then I don't know how to help you.
  #18  
Old 05-12-2010, 06:58 PM
Jim V Jim V is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Michigan
Age: 77
Posts: 9,204
Closed because things are getting childish.
__________________
TFL #296 -- MOLON LABE Leonidas c 480 BC -- FFF
If it ain't metal, single stack, and single action, it ain't a 1911 no matter what it looks like!!
Do Not Irk The Forum Curmudgeon
Harold V. B: 03/28/11 D: 11/23/07 Dad, I'll miss you.
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:30 AM.


NOTICE TO USERS OF THIS SITE: By continuing to use this site, you certify that you have read and agree to abide by the Legal Terms of Use. All information, data, text or other materials ("Content") posted to this site by any users are the sole responsibility of those users. 1911Forum does not guarantee the accuracy, integrity, or quality of such Content.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 2015 1911Forum.com, LLC. All Rights Reserved