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  #76  
Old 02-13-2020, 01:34 PM
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Kevin Rohrer Kevin Rohrer is offline
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It is easy to tell who is a trained 1911 operator, and who has no clue.
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Last edited by Kevin Rohrer; 02-13-2020 at 05:07 PM.
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  #77  
Old 02-13-2020, 01:43 PM
drail drail is offline
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I do not understand the original question at all. It's like asking if you prefer the steering wheel or the brake pedal.
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  #78  
Old 02-13-2020, 04:02 PM
wccountryboy wccountryboy is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IZNTHESKY View Post
Great...I am not alone.
I am neither a fan of safeties. If the need ever arises that you grab your gun to protect yourself or a loved one......I donít want anything to interfere with my drawing and firing the pistol. A grip or trigger safety is fine as they do not involve any additional gross motor skills to manipulate.

Some may argue.....but imagine:
an attacker or multiple attackers that are already striking, pushing and wrestling with you.....
Can you protect yourself for the few precious seconds with one arm....while drawing and firing with the other ?

Will your mind and hand be able to manipulate that safety switch while you are focused on protecting yourself from attack.
A 1911 type thumb safety has no impact on the above scenario . Deactivating it is intuitive and can happen early in the draw stroke. It doesn't take a "well trained" or "professional" individual to sort this out.
If you're really concerned about this, the 1911 isn't the pistol for you...
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  #79  
Old 02-13-2020, 04:29 PM
Austin_TX Austin_TX is offline
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Originally Posted by jtq View Post
I asked a couple of members earlier in this thread who commented they don't like safeties on their guns, and folks seem to keep popping up saying the same, but this is a 1911 Forum. All 1911's (OK, nearly all) have a thumb safety and a grip safety, and folks are here complaining about the presences of such devices on a gun they probably have, or at least I'd think they have or they wouldn't be here posting on a 1911 forum.
Well, that wasn't my comment. This was:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
I donít care for either one on any pistol filling a self-defense role.
And this was (part of) my response to your post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
LOL, not exactly. I love 1911s. I just donít rely on them in any SD capacity. Theyíre either collectibles or range toys for me ó nothing else.
Again, there are many people who love 1911s but who choose something else when it comes to home defense or carry. The other active 1911 site is full of people with six-figure 1911 collections who have something other than 1911s in their holsters and on their nightstands.

I don't mind safeties at all on guns that I buy as collectibles or that I intend only to use at the range.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtq View Post
I always wonder, over at GlockTalk or wherever folks like to hang out and post about their polymer, striker fired, no manual safety equipped pistols, are there a bunch of guys posting in threads comments like...

- "I'll never carry a gun without a manual safety as you'll shoot yourself"
- "Striker triggers are terrible and completely unusable"
- "Polymer guns are incredibly inaccurate and don't work at all"

My guess is no.
None of those caricatured comments are very much analogous to stating a preference for the absence of grip and thumb safeties on pistols employed in self-defense roles. But, since you ask, there is indeed a very active "General Firearms Forum" at Glocktalk (which could alternatively be named "General Gun Discussion") with a large number of people who don't use Glocks for self-defense roles -- and a not insignificant number of people who don't care for Glocks at all. There you will find plenty of people who prefer manual safeties on their carry weapons.
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  #80  
Old 02-13-2020, 04:50 PM
SG29736 SG29736 is offline
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The number one reason I sometimes carry or have something else available for self defense other then my 1911s is capacity. I love 1911s but I do like my CZ 75b single actions with 16 to 19 rounds good. The thumb safety isn't a negative to me. I also have no issue with my S & W mp with no thumb safety's
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  #81  
Old 02-13-2020, 04:51 PM
Austin_TX Austin_TX is offline
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Originally Posted by FNHipowerluv View Post
Your only option for a single action auto without a safety is a Tokarev
Or a Polish Radom wz. VIS 35 -- and the later Radom P.35(p) produced by slave labor under the Nazis -- if you want SAO with only a grip safety. (Nope, neither lever on the left side of gun is a manual safety.)



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  #82  
Old 02-13-2020, 05:07 PM
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Kevin Rohrer Kevin Rohrer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drail View Post
I do not understand the original question at all. It's like asking if you prefer the steering wheel or the brake pedal.
Pretty much.

See my post directly above yours.
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  #83  
Old 02-13-2020, 08:06 PM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IZNTHESKY View Post
Great...I am not alone.
I am neither a fan of safeties. If the need ever arises that you grab your gun to protect yourself or a loved one......I donít want anything to interfere with my drawing and firing the pistol. A grip or trigger safety is fine as they do not involve any additional gross motor skills to manipulate.

Some may argue.....but imagine:
an attacker or multiple attackers that are already striking, pushing and wrestling with you.....
Can you protect yourself for the few precious seconds with one arm....while drawing and firing with the other ?

Will your mind and hand be able to manipulate that safety switch while you are focused on protecting yourself from attack.
Yes. No question at all plus my other hand will be holding my knife and hopefully placing it along their arm and neck. You clearly don't know how to use it if you are still thinking of the manual safety as a swtich to flip.
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  #84  
Old 02-13-2020, 08:09 PM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IZNTHESKY View Post
Your an amateur. Life does not always happen they way that you would like to imagine it
1. Yes...if if your behind the curve and the attack is underway...can you save yourself ? How often do you or have you actually trained yourself for this scenario. This is a reality....your a fool to imagine that this cannot happen.

2. Your correct we should always strive to be aware of our surroundings...
But your foolish to think that you cannot be caught off guard.

3. I am not insinuating that safeties are bad or that they take time to disengage.
I am only saying that.....in the worst conditions of fighting for your life....
Your gross motor skills will work.....hopefully the way you have trained.....
And your FINE motor skills (ie; manipulating safety switch) will deteriorate.
Pulling a trigger is a finer motor skill by far than resting your hand on a gun.

Who wants to see a 1.3 second 3x5 7 yard headshot with a "hard to use and slow" manual safety 1911 from concealment on video? I can do it all the time cold with really powerful ammo on timer any time you want. It's the user not the gun
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Last edited by Striker2237; 02-13-2020 at 08:12 PM.
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  #85  
Old 02-13-2020, 08:40 PM
wccountryboy wccountryboy is online now
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While from a purely physiological perspective, anything involving the hands and fingers is a 'fine' motor skill, perhaps we need to break it on down a bit more.
Simple vs complex fine motor skills... pressing a trigger or pushing a thumb safely (assuming its large enough and ergonomically placed) are simple. Thread I a needle is complex- it involved 2 difference senses. Tying your shoes is complex- it involves a series of motions that must be done correctly, in sequence, to be correct. Yet when you do it enough, it becomes a natural action, you don't think about it, you just execute the task.
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  #86  
Old 02-14-2020, 03:02 AM
IZNTHESKY IZNTHESKY is offline
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JTQ....Senior member wrote...
.Trigger manipulation and thumb safety manipulation are pretty much the same. As is operating the mag release and the slide stop/slide release. Gross or fine motor skill, you take your pick. If you can work the trigger, you can work the thumb safety, and the mag release, and the slide stop/slide release. Trigger manipulation and thumb safety manipulation are pretty much the same. As is operating the mag release and the slide stop/slide release. Gross or fine motor skill, you take your pick. If you can work the trigger, you can work the thumb safety, and the mag release, and the slide stop/slide release.

I asked a couple of members earlier in this thread who commented they don't like safeties on their guns, and folks seem to keep popping up saying the same, but this is a 1911 Forum. All 1911's (OK, nearly all) have a thumb safety and a grip safety, and folks are here complaining about the presences of such devices on a gun they probably have, or at least I'd think they have or they wouldn't be here posting on a 1911 forum.

I always wonder, over at GlockTalk or wherever folks like to hang out and post about their polymer, striker fired, no manual safety equipped pistols, are there a bunch of guys posting in threads comments like...

- "I'll never carry a gun without a manual safety as you'll shoot yourself"
- "Striker triggers are terrible and completely unusable"
- "Polymer guns are incredibly inaccurate and don't work at all"

My guess is no. If you shoot a Glock, or revolver, or 1911, or ray-gun, you understand how the system works and have come to grips with strengths and weakness of each gun.

JTQ WROTE: My point is, if you don't like the manual of arms on a 1911, and perhaps lack the ability or confidence in your ability to operate the 1911, don't project your shortfalls on others who may have the ability to operate the 1911 properly.


Go back and READ or have some one read to you...my post. I never wrote....what you are implying above. You are projecting your shortfall of reading comprehension on what I wrote.



JTQ WROTE: If you don't like a manual safety, for whatever reason, that's fine, but don't tell other folks they shouldn't have one because they can't work them and a safety will get them killed on the streets. You don't know their skill set.

Again...re-read.... I did not write what you are implying above. I wonder what your motive is here? If you feel personally offended...get over it. This is a forum to express thoughts, it is open to everyone....those of us who have, use and love the 1911...it’s better for us.
If your taking it personal...grow up.

JTQ WROTE: I don't want folks who hate pistols with manual safeties to leave the forum, please stay and learn about the 1911, but I think it would be helpful to avoid commenting about how the gun should be employed if you don't have a desire, or skillset, to employ the gun yourself.

REALLY ? ?.....You think...it would be helpful to avoid commenting about how a gun should be employed ? You have missed the whole point of these forums. These forums are exactly for expressing ideas and sharing thoughts. Not everyone will share the opinions of others, but we ( as a collective 2A community) are much better off reading the opinions of others rather than writing that someone should avoid comments.


I asked a couple of members earlier in this thread who commented they don't like safeties on their guns, and folks seem to keep popping up saying the same, but this is a 1911 Forum. All 1911's (OK, nearly all) have a thumb safety and a grip safety, and folks are here complaining about the presences of such devices on a gun they probably have, or at least I'd think they have or they wouldn't be here posting on a 1911 forum.

I always wonder, over at GlockTalk or wherever folks like to hang out and post about their polymer, striker fired, no manual safety equipped pistols, are there a bunch of guys posting in threads comments like...

- "I'll never carry a gun without a manual safety as you'll shoot yourself"
- "Striker triggers are terrible and completely unusable"
- "Polymer guns are incredibly inaccurate and don't work at all"

My guess is no. If you shoot a Glock, or revolver, or 1911, or ray-gun, you understand how the system works and have come to grips with strengths and weakness of each gun.

JTQ WROTE: [B]My point is, if you don't like the manual of arms on a 1911, and perhaps lack the ability or confidence in your ability to operate the 1911, don't project your shortfalls on others who may have the ability to operate the 1911 properly. [/B

What are you referencing to ? I did NOT write that I didn’t like the manual of arms
Nor did I project any shortfalls on others.
You should learn to understand what is written...before expressing your thoughtlessness.


JTQ WROTE: If you don't like a manual safety, for whatever reason, that's fine, but don't tell other folks they shouldn't have one because they can't work them and a safety will get them killed on the streets. You don't know their skill set.

Again your lack of reading comprehension.....I never wrote / told other folks they shouldn’t have....because ......

JTQ WROTE: I don't want folks who hate pistols with manual safeties to leave the forum, please stay and learn about the 1911, but I think it would be helpful to avoid commenting about how the gun should be employed if you don't have a desire, or skillset, to employ the gun yourself.
I have no idea how you arrive at the conclusion of someone who doesn’t have the desire or skill set to employ the 1911. ....of course I have no idea how you came to your previous conclusions either.

My post is factual. You may agree with it...or not.....and I would love to read your opinion on it....but asking to avoid comments on a thread that is solicited to members on this website....is contradictory to everything that this forum stands for.

Last edited by IZNTHESKY; 02-14-2020 at 03:10 AM.
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  #87  
Old 02-14-2020, 07:42 AM
jtq jtq is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IZNTHESKY View Post
My post is factual. You may agree with it...or not.....and I would love to read your opinion on it....
Quote:
I am only saying that.....in the worst conditions of fighting for your life....
Your gross motor skills will work.....hopefully the way you have trained.....
And your FINE motor skills (ie; manipulating safety switch) will deteriorate.
Quote:
If the need ever arises that you grab your gun to protect yourself or a loved one......I don’t want anything to interfere with my drawing and firing the pistol. A grip or trigger safety is fine as they do not involve any additional gross motor skills to manipulate.

Some may argue.....but imagine:
an attacker or multiple attackers that are already striking, pushing and wrestling with you.....
Can you protect yourself for the few precious seconds with one arm....while drawing and firing with the other ?

Will your mind and hand be able to manipulate that safety switch while you are focused on protecting yourself from attack.
Gross motor skill or fine motor skill, it doesn't really matter what you want to call it, all the controls on the 1911 require the same level of motor skill.

For those that shoot the 1911, here's how most grip the 1911...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDzC6djUQxM

Here's the draw stroke beginning at about the :40 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGGxwJrrABY

Note the order in which both of these gentlemen get to the thumb safety and when they get to the trigger. For a 1911 shooter your chances are greater to not pull the trigger rather than to forget the thumb safety.

If folks don't care for the 1911, or love it, but feel it is a poor choice for their personal defense, that's fine. Just say, "I'm not confident in my abilities to operate it properly", or "the capacity is too low for me", or "it's too heavy for me", or whatever reason that is doesn't work for you.

However, saying with broad brush strokes that in the in the generic, folks won't be able to operate a thumb safety in a critical situation is just not true. The 1911 has been around for a very long time, and if it were true, it wouldn't be in production anymore.

It may not work for you, which is perfectly fine, but others have no trouble operating the 1911 with whatever motor skill it may be.
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  #88  
Old 02-14-2020, 08:10 AM
SCfromNY SCfromNY is offline
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I am in the group that does not want a safety on my EDC. I have a Dan Wesson Bobtail that I try to be comfortable carrying but it just does not work for me. I will also say that I shoot 1911's marginally better than my EDC's which are H&K's.

All that said you can talk about muscle memory and practice all you want however when I was shooting in competition, USPSA & IDPA, shooters better than me; Masters on rare occasions would draw, curse and then click off the safety. Now if a master shooter, meaning no insult but I venture there are not a lot here, can under the stress of a match forget to drop the safety what would happen in a more stressful self defense situation?

So if you are confident with your safety great. But for those of not that is our opinion. Do I wish there was a gun with a 4lb 1911 trigger with no safety that was safe to carry? Absolutely. I don't think there is.
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  #89  
Old 02-14-2020, 08:15 AM
jtq jtq is online now
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Originally Posted by SCfromNY View Post
All that said you can talk about muscle memory and practice all you want however when I was shooting in competition, USPSA & IDPA, shooters better than me; Masters on rare occasions would draw, curse and then click off the safety.
I see this comment often and wonder if these guys enter in a variety of competitions with a variety of guns.

For instance, at a single competition, do they enter multiple classes with say a G34 in one class, a CZ75 in another, and a 1911 in another? If so, that would probably explain the issue.
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  #90  
Old 02-14-2020, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by SCfromNY View Post
I am in the group that does not want a safety on my EDC. I have a Dan Wesson Bobtail that I try to be comfortable carrying but it just does not work for me. I will also say that I shoot 1911's marginally better than my EDC's which are H&K's.
For you, you are an HK shooter.

Do you shoot an HK USP or a P30 or a VP9? If you are a VP9 shooter, would you have some issue if you suddenly picked up a USP or a P30 for a match?
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  #91  
Old 02-14-2020, 12:03 PM
Big Pete10 Big Pete10 is offline
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I prefer a thumb safety except on guns like the 92FS, carry it hammer down safety off(Mine has been converted to decocker only). Revolvers don't need safetys, you shoot D/A or thumb cock it. I guess I don't understand those who don't think they can learn to use a gun with a thumb safety. It does take a conscious effort to turn it off but it becomes natural to turn it off as you draw the gun once you learn to use it. It's OKAY to say keep your finger off the trigger til you are ready to shoot and you should do so, but there are other things that can fire the gun, draw string on your jacket, dog stepping on the gun and firing it, anything that gets to the trigger can fire it if it doesn't have a safety. My G19 has a pull of about 4-1/2# just like a lot of 1911 carry guns have, most would never consider carrying a 1911 with the thumb safety off even tho it has a grip safety. And No, I don't carry the G19, it's a range toy.
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  #92  
Old 02-14-2020, 03:29 PM
Fafhrd Fafhrd is offline
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I won't argue about what all shooters should do or should prefer. I prefer having a thumb safety on a pistol for a number of reasons, one of them being that the trigger pull on most pistols isn't as long or deliberate as the pull on a DA revolver, and it certainly isn't on a half-cocked striker pistol. I've owned quite a few pistols with decockers only, but I prefer a good, solid manual safety and I practice with them till they're second nature.
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  #93  
Old 02-15-2020, 07:59 AM
SCfromNY SCfromNY is offline
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jtq: My H&K's are P2000, P2000sk, P30, and P30sk. The triggers are either DA/SA or LEM which I prefer. My oldest handgun remaining in my safe is a Sig P226 which is a DA/SA. I am comfortable with shooting different triggers. I like to have a hammer for various reasons.
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  #94  
Old 02-15-2020, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by SCfromNY View Post
jtq: My H&K's are P2000, P2000sk, P30, and P30sk. The triggers are either DA/SA or LEM which I prefer. My oldest handgun remaining in my safe is a Sig P226 which is a DA/SA. I am comfortable with shooting different triggers. I like to have a hammer for various reasons.
My point was about the confusion you mentioned with the 1911 shooters you saw in competition. If the 1911 is not the gun you live with, but rather the gun you just break out for a weekend shoot, and is just one of a variety of different guns you shoot, forgetting how to work the controls can be an issue.

Even within the HK line-up there are a variety of different controls. Somebody that shoots a VP9 on a daily basis, even at the Grand Master level, may have trouble operating a USP45 V1, with a DA/SA trigger and a frame mounted decocker, or trying to shoot a LEM pistol at speed.

I enjoy watching Patrick E. Kelley do his "Out of the Box to Match" video's ( https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP2...B3-5Za-KOVsOHg ). There is no day in this lifetime, I'll ever be able to outshoot him.

On the other hand, he shoots so many different guns, you'll occasionally see him stumble mid-stage with some characteristic of the gun he's currently shooting that is different from what he's used to. Common examples are short stroking the trigger on a DA/SA gun or inadvertently dropping a mag mid-string.

There is little chance he'd have these problems with a gun he shoots regularly, but because he's just giving it a go in competition, he occasionally has trouble with the controls he's not intimately familiar with.

I'm not telling folks they need to like the 1911. Actually, I'm pretty much the opposite. I often try to talk folks out of the 1911. It's not for everybody. If folks prefer striker fired guns that's great. If they prefer DA/SA guns, that's great too.

The issue I'm brining up is folks who dabble in the 1911, and can't work the controls, telling everybody, that nobody can work the controls. I believe that to be inaccurate.
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  #95  
Old 02-15-2020, 09:22 AM
Herbert Cannon Herbert Cannon is offline
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Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
I donít care for either one on any pistol filling a self-defense role.
Only if it is da or da sa.
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  #96  
Old 02-15-2020, 09:31 AM
Herbert Cannon Herbert Cannon is offline
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Originally Posted by Austin_TX View Post
LOL, not exactly. I love 1911s. I just donít rely on them in any SD capacity. Theyíre either collectibles or range toys for me ó nothing else.

Iím also obsessed with Swiss P210s, to take another example among many, but between the extremely awkward safety, the heel mag release (on almost all versions) and non-drop-free mags, and the low magazine capacity, I would never assign any of mine to a self-defense role either. I donít really mind any of those features on collectibles and range guns, though.
Of course 1911s are range toys that went through how many criminal events, battles, wars and campaigns? With how many soldiers depending on them? I don't think any pistol that experienced all of that is a range toy.
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Old 02-15-2020, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Herbert Cannon View Post
Of course 1911s are range toys that went through how many criminal events, battles, wars and campaigns? With how many soldiers depending on them? I don't think any pistol that experienced all of that is a range toy.
In fairness to Austin_TX he's only commenting for himself. That's cool with me. He's not telling others they won't be able to use the controls on a 1911 in a heated event, just that he chooses not to.
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  #98  
Old 02-15-2020, 10:50 AM
cavelamb cavelamb is offline
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Very interesting - very long thread.
So here's another two cents...

I like the firing pin block as found on the Sig P938.
It provides a safer way to lower the hammer on loaded chamber.

Also the thumb safety on that design allows the slide to be racked
with the safety on. Which the 1911 can not do.
It seems to reduce the chance of Accidental Discharge.

The P938 doesn't have a grip safety and I have no problem with that.
The grip safety simply means you are holding the pistol in your hand.
As opposed to dropping it?
Okay, fine.
But then just holding then pistol generally means the safety is disengaged.

Compare that to the trigger safety on striker fired pistols.
Those mean you have your finger on the trigger. (hopefully intentionally).
As opposed to dropping the pistol (again?).
But that can be easily defeated by catching the trigger on anything - keys,
clothing or something in a woman's purse? As mentioned several times already.

I like the thumb safety, and I think Sig's version is a real improvement.

I'm more comfortable carrying a loaded chamber with the hammer down
and safety off than a loaded chamber with the hammer cocked and locked.

Yes, in a serious situation I have to cock the hammer, but I'm okay with that.
I have practiced that and can choose to cock at several points in the draw.

Which is the same way I draw a revolver - even double action (Ruger SP101).

Cocking the hammer vs long slow trigger pull to accurately hit a small target?
It's just natural now.

But, of course, YMMV...
As will your preferences.
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  #99  
Old 02-15-2020, 11:56 AM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cavelamb View Post
Very interesting - very long thread.
So here's another two cents...

I like the firing pin block as found on the Sig P938.
It provides a safer way to lower the hammer on loaded chamber.

Also the thumb safety on that design allows the slide to be racked
with the safety on. Which the 1911 can not do.
It seems to reduce the chance of Accidental Discharge.

The P938 doesn't have a grip safety and I have no problem with that.
The grip safety simply means you are holding the pistol in your hand.
As opposed to dropping it?
Okay, fine.
But then just holding then pistol generally means the safety is disengaged.

Compare that to the trigger safety on striker fired pistols.
Those mean you have your finger on the trigger. (hopefully intentionally).
As opposed to dropping the pistol (again?).
But that can be easily defeated by catching the trigger on anything - keys,
clothing or something in a woman's purse? As mentioned several times already.

I like the thumb safety, and I think Sig's version is a real improvement.

I'm more comfortable carrying a loaded chamber with the hammer down
and safety off than a loaded chamber with the hammer cocked and locked.

Yes, in a serious situation I have to cock the hammer, but I'm okay with that.
I have practiced that and can choose to cock at several points in the draw.

Which is the same way I draw a revolver - even double action (Ruger SP101).

Cocking the hammer vs long slow trigger pull to accurately hit a small target?
It's just natural now.

But, of course, YMMV...
As will your preferences.
Why would you ever want to lower the hammer on a round? The locking function is really useful in certain situations, the 938 (I use one as my smallest gun, actually used it yesterday on a mouse running along the base of the shop wall.) is a nice little gun but I wish the lever was smoother and larger to act the same way a 1911s does.

The fact it doesn't lock the slide actually a minor thing but you can possibly move the slide back when holstering and have it partially out of battery in super tight leather and that made lead to particles building up there and preventing it from returning. It's also just kinda disorienting and scary a 1911 user since I still momentally think it's off safe and I was carrying it that way. Good little gun, mine has run well from day one to about 6k rounds and nothing has broken plus it handles very well for its size class and has the control setup I am most used to.

In regards to a 1911 heavy user getting hung up on DA/SA or other guns that's not as much of and issue as people who come to the 1911 from anything else. Usually 1911 users can use any gun relatively well aside from short stoke/trigger freeze issues on some guns, I also use Glocks and CZs as my other two main platforms and the Glock is just a 1911 with a long action trigger that's heavy with no thumb rest and a CZ is just a 1911 with a bigger magwell or sometimes a really long first pull (mine are 4lb da so weight is about the same) and really light standard pulls (mine are 2.2 or 1.2 depending on gun). The only guns that trip me up are SIGs since when I draw them naturally my right thumb always ends up using the slide lock as it's rest and thus I need to manually decide to keep my hand looser/partially off the gun or I will not get slide lock and reloads will be much slower and default to a malf still when the hammer falls and nothing happens.
__________________
Carry gun:Wilson Carry Comp Custom .45S Pocket carry:on loan Other 1911s:WC Supergrade Accucomp .38, WC BW Opticomp, WC CQB Compact, WC CQB Professional, WC Super Sentinel, WC CQB Elite 9mm, WC EDC X9, WC X9S, Ed Brown SR, NHC Predator II Opticomp, NHC T3 Hardchrome, Kimber Ultra, ATI Tactical, RIA Tactical 10mm, Kimber Ultra Diamond 9mm, Detonics Combat Master MKVI, Colt Centennial .460 Roland
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  #100  
Old 02-15-2020, 09:33 PM
Austin_TX Austin_TX is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 361
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbert Cannon View Post
Of course 1911s are range toys that went through how many criminal events, battles, wars and campaigns? With how many soldiers depending on them? I don't think any pistol that experienced all of that is a range toy.
I think you missed the key words "for me." I'm talking about how I choose to use 1911s, not about something inherent to them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtq View Post
In fairness to Austin_TX he's only commenting for himself. That's cool with me. He's not telling others they won't be able to use the controls on a 1911 in a heated event, just that he chooses not to.
Exactly.
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