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  #1  
Old 02-14-2020, 05:56 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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StealthArms 80% Safety Issue

So I had this beast all "complete" last night with the exception of fine stuff. Just a rough fit, slide was tight, etc.

Today I decide in prep for the fine detail work, I would take it apart and clean everything beyond just the blow out and rub down. When I started reassembly, I was testing everything as I put it in the frame. After placing my thumb safety, all the sudden the hammer refuses to drop while grip safety is depressed. Turns out if I press it too hard, it's binding somewhere and preventing the hammer from falling. If I depress it only slightly, everything functions as intended. The only change I made was I bent out the seat spring to give the grip safety more pressure as it would dance in place if you shook the frame.

I only got this as a project, so I'm not a gunsmith. Just an Average Joe with probably only a dangerous amount of know-how. Any ideas friends?
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  #2  
Old 02-14-2020, 09:17 PM
cecannonjr cecannonjr is offline
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Grip safety fine tuning

The grip safety has an arm on it that rests against the back of the trigger bow and prevents the trigger from being pulled when the grip safety is not depressed. The arm is notched so that when the grip safety is depressed, the arm rises and allows the trigger to be pulled. It sounds like this arm needs to be fine tuned by filing material off to correct the function. Most grip safety's come with some extra material on the arm so that it can be tuned to your gun.
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  #3  
Old 02-14-2020, 10:03 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cecannonjr View Post
The grip safety has an arm on it that rests against the back of the trigger bow and prevents the trigger from being pulled when the grip safety is not depressed. The arm is notched so that when the grip safety is depressed, the arm rises and allows the trigger to be pulled. It sounds like this arm needs to be fine tuned by filing material off to correct the function. Most grip safety's come with some extra material on the arm so that it can be tuned to your gun.
Okay. I already did that once. I was thinking that I needed to take more off from what I gathered, but wanted to make sure before I removed too much. I also noticed that the trigger isn't resetting after a fire, and read somewhere that the notch is actually supposed to be a bit rounded? I guess so that the trigger bow can kind of roll back off without any resistance but too much and it can fire without the GS being depressed.
Basically I'm asking, will filing more make my issues worse or does that seem the way to go?
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  #4  
Old 02-15-2020, 07:04 AM
Jolly Rogers Jolly Rogers is offline
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That is very difficult to say without having the gun in hand and marking up parts to see the contact points. Then testing the malfunctions carefully even to the point of testing for dragging contact with ones senses set on safe cracking feedback.
Joe
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  #5  
Old 02-15-2020, 08:37 AM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jolly Rogers View Post
That is very difficult to say without having the gun in hand and marking up parts to see the contact points. Then testing the malfunctions carefully even to the point of testing for dragging contact with ones senses set on safe cracking feedback.
Joe
Any suggested pictures I should post? I have to physically pull the trigger forward to reset it and the GS pops out then. The trigger and GS are definitely binding, I'm just not sure if that's what's preventing the hammer from falling or not.
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  #6  
Old 02-15-2020, 10:28 AM
TRX302 TRX302 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NotHankHill View Post
I have to physically pull the trigger forward to reset it and the GS pops out then.
Yep, typical result of the safety arm being a little too long.

Use a felt tip marker and see where it's touching, then remove some metal. Use a very fine file or sandpaper glued to a stick to remove metal.

Since it's *almost* working, you only need to remove a tiny amount. For the first time, just rub the file lightly across the area with the ink scraped off, re-ink, and try it again. Three or four light strokes, with checking on each one, will probably do it.

There's *some* clearance past "just enough" if you go too far, but the idea is not to get into that range if you can help it; you might need it if you ever move the safety to a different frame.
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  #7  
Old 02-15-2020, 04:07 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRX302 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotHankHill View Post
I have to physically pull the trigger forward to reset it and the GS pops out then.
Yep, typical result of the safety arm being a little too long.

Use a felt tip marker and see where it's touching, then remove some metal. Use a very fine file or sandpaper glued to a stick to remove metal.

Since it's *almost* working, you only need to remove a tiny amount. For the first time, just rub the file lightly across the area with the ink scraped off, re-ink, and try it again. Three or four light strokes, with checking on each one, will probably do it.

There's *some* clearance past "just enough" if you go too far, but the idea is not to get into that range if you can help it; you might need it if you ever move the safety to a different frame.
Would this also cause the issue of the hammer not falling until a very slight amount of pressure is released off the GS? Like possibly the trigger bow is pushing the safety arm up into some workings?

I'll address the trigger first. Hopefully it will correct both issues. Thanks to everyone for their input.
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  #8  
Old 02-15-2020, 11:11 PM
BBBBill BBBBill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NotHankHill View Post
ÖWhen I started reassembly, I was testing everything as I put it in the frame. After placing my thumb safety, all the sudden the hammer refuses to drop while grip safety is depressed. Turns out if I press it too hard, it's binding somewhere and preventing the hammer from falling. If I depress it only slightly, everything functions as intendedÖ
The upper part of the blocking arm should be fit to block trigger movement with the grip safety in the relaxed (no grip) position. When you hold with a firing grip the grip safety is depressed, pivoting the trigger blocking arm tip upwards to clear the trigger bow. There is a "lazy L" shaped notch on the underside of the end of the trigger blocking arm of the grip safety. The upper horizontal surface of that notch should clear the top edge of the trigger bow, allowing clearance for the bow to slide under the blocking arm. The rear (almost vertical) face of that notch acts as a stop for the trigger on guns that do not have an overtravel screw in the trigger shoe. If either of those faces of the notch are not finish fit properly it could cause the problems that you are seeing.

You can install the thumb safety shaft through the frame and grip safety while leaving the safety lug out of the frame to allow you to see through the window in the frame. Leave the grips off, too. I will help make it more visible. Depress the grip safety and pull the trigger while watching the end of the blocking arm to observe its interaction with the trigger bow.
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  #9  
Old 02-16-2020, 10:38 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Well I shaved a bit more off, one file at a time then test. Still both hang ups. Last time testing and the hammer falls, but without the GS being depressed. The trigger still hangs up and hammer fails to fall when GS is depressed.

I cant see well enough in that hole to find out what the issue is, but I'm quite stumped. Obviously it was not too much material on the upper part of that arm though... I'll order another one and try again. I had planned on getting a second anyway because somewhere along the lines, I got a wicked gouge out of the nice matte finish on the GS. Oh well.

Any other ideas though?
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  #10  
Old 02-16-2020, 11:44 PM
BBBBill BBBBill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NotHankHill View Post
Well I shaved a bit more off, one file at a time then test. Still both hang ups. Last time testing and the hammer falls, but without the GS being depressed. The trigger still hangs up and hammer fails to fall when GS is depressed.

I cant see well enough in that hole to find out what the issue is, but I'm quite stumped. Obviously it was not too much material on the upper part of that arm though...

Any other ideas though?
Where did you file - the forward end or the underside (horizontal surface) in the notch? A light shown up through the mag well should make it visible.
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  #11  
Old 02-16-2020, 11:52 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBBBill View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotHankHill View Post
Well I shaved a bit more off, one file at a time then test. Still both hang ups. Last time testing and the hammer falls, but without the GS being depressed. The trigger still hangs up and hammer fails to fall when GS is depressed.

I cant see well enough in that hole to find out what the issue is, but I'm quite stumped. Obviously it was not too much material on the upper part of that arm though...

Any other ideas though?
Where did you file - the forward end or the underside (horizontal surface) in the notch? A light shown up through the mag well should make it visible.
The underside of the very end, in the L notch. Looking through the magwell, theres a bit of aluminum, about 1/8 inch on either side of the slot that happens to be covering where the arm sits when assembled.
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  #12  
Old 02-17-2020, 05:35 AM
Jolly Rogers Jolly Rogers is offline
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I wonder if the GS and mainspring housing ledges are causing a static install issue that allows the GS to be in the depressed location with no hand pressure? Where the GS cannot rotate out enough to engage the blocking arm.
Joe
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  #13  
Old 02-22-2020, 03:09 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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So after finishing the rest of what I needed to do (lapping mostly) I've come back to this. New GS does the same thing the old did before too much removed material. I covered it in sharpie as well and nothing wore off. Still even keeps the trigger from resetting. I'm going to try to get a video for clarity and see if I can't get a better peek up into the guts. Otherwise, I'm kind of at a bit of a loss. Lol

Videos:



Last edited by NotHankHill; 02-22-2020 at 05:12 PM.
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  #14  
Old 02-22-2020, 06:22 PM
Magnumite Magnumite is offline
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Is this by chance a Series 80 pistol with a Series 70 grip safety? If it is, look for interference on the right side of the blocking arm. If it isn’t, look for interference on the right side of the blocking arm and part of the frame not milled out properly.

Also, if the grip safety is binding held in, there may not be enough clearance between the gs radius and frame radius. The thumb safety pin could be rotated slightly causing reset issues or simply binding in the thumb safety pin bore and not allowing enough movement.

Sear spring middle leaf short and sharp, digging into the angled disco spring ramp or just under it, and preventing reset. Kinda slim, but I encountered it once.
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  #15  
Old 02-22-2020, 07:27 PM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnumite View Post
Is this by chance a Series 80 pistol with a Series 70 grip safety? If it is, look for interference on the right side of the blocking arm. If it isnít, look for interference on the right side of the blocking arm and part of the frame not milled out properly.

Also, if the grip safety is binding held in, there may not be enough clearance between the gs radius and frame radius. The thumb safety pin could be rotated slightly causing reset issues or simply binding in the thumb safety pin bore and not allowing enough movement.

Sear spring middle leaf short and sharp, digging into the angled disco spring ramp or just under it, and preventing reset. Kinda slim, but I encountered it once.
It was the Stealth Arms 80% Build kit. All parts are Series 70 1911 parts. I will look for milling issues, but otherwise everything seems to fit and move properly. The grip safety itself isn't binding per-say, but seems to be causing either the hammer or the sear assembly to bind. The thumb safety was not inserted for the testing, but was inserted backwards as in the videos just to have a pivot point. Lastly, how would I tell about the sear spring? When I pull the trigger forward only a very slight amount, it resets the GS, which implies to me that the bow is hanging on the arm, probably just needs fine tuning where I filed.

Edit: Added a pic. Was looking to see if the GS arm was clearing everything. It seems to be clearing the sear and discon as well as frame. Could it be that my disconnected isnt sitting perfectly flush on the trigger bow?

Last edited by NotHankHill; 02-22-2020 at 09:48 PM.
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  #16  
Old 02-23-2020, 01:40 AM
Magnumite Magnumite is offline
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I didn’t see the forest for the trees, I thought the issue was a little different. Had to reread. BBBBill’s post indicated the trigger bow blocking lug to prevent excessive trigger overtravel. File where pointed out in the pic.
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Last edited by Magnumite; 02-23-2020 at 01:42 AM.
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  #17  
Old 02-25-2020, 06:52 AM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnumite View Post
I didnít see the forest for the trees, I thought the issue was a little different. Had to reread. BBBBillís post indicated the trigger bow blocking lug to prevent excessive trigger overtravel. File where pointed out in the pic.
Did this on the old one to test. Still catching. When I can this week I'm going to take the fcg out along with all the rear stuff and give everything a once over again with a fine stone. I'll update after that. Thanks everyone for your continued help!
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  #18  
Old 03-03-2020, 08:23 AM
NotHankHill NotHankHill is offline
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Sorry for the double post. Obviously I'm forum illiterate because I couldn't figure out how to edit my old post. I haven't been able to do anything with this lately as my arthritis in my left hand has been very angry the last couple weeks. I have shaved off the spot recommended but it did not alleviate my issue. I doubt it's the cause, but could my GS be binding the hammer strut when squeezed too hard? I am admittedly not a gunsmith at all, but I can't see anything else that would cause this.

I've started the search for a gunsmith nearby just in case I am unable to get this 1911 operating smoothly. Thanks for all your help of course!

Let me know what other photos/videos I should take that would help to diagnose this issue. I'm not even sure what to search for as my terms only seem to yield "hammer follow" or the firearm cycling only to half-cock.
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