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  #1  
Old 01-18-2020, 07:57 AM
buyamerican buyamerican is offline
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New Colt Python Cylinder Rotation Problem/Fix?

Hickok45 had the cylinder rotation problem on his new Python review but a fix was never covered. He was sending it back to Bud's gun shop. Anyone know what the fix is? I have seen others on forums with the same problem but no repair was covered. Anyone know what Colt is doing to correct this problem? One new owner was wanting a replacement but I don't think Colt will do that. I am glad to see the Python back and wish the best to Colt.
  #2  
Old 01-18-2020, 08:23 AM
GBertolet GBertolet is offline
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There is an issue with light primer strikes also. Maybe there is a connection with the cylinder rotation issue?
  #3  
Old 01-18-2020, 09:49 AM
FNHipowerluv FNHipowerluv is offline
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My guess would be the cylinder hand got stuck in the in the rearward position some how, and didn't touch the teeth on the ejector. The way the lock work is set up, the hand should engage the teeth every time the hammer is pulled back. The only way the hammer could move rearward without turning the cylinder, is if the hand never touches the teeth. Hickock's gun might have had too loose tolerances, and cause that hand to get stuck rearward, since it can pivot on the trigger freely when no resistance is being applied to it.
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  #4  
Old 01-18-2020, 10:37 AM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FNHipowerluv View Post
My guess would be the cylinder hand got stuck in the in the rearward position some how, and didn't touch the teeth on the ejector. The way the lock work is set up, the hand should engage the teeth every time the hammer is pulled back. The only way the hammer could move rearward without turning the cylinder, is if the hand never touches the teeth. Hickock's gun might have had too loose tolerances, and cause that hand to get stuck rearward, since it can pivot on the trigger freely when no resistance is being applied to it.
I think this is what it is..

2 theories were discussed so far.

1.) in the interest of a non stacking DA pull, the new spring was designed to weak to push the pawl reliably forward and up. 2.) the pawl being accidentally few thou to shallow to reliably engage the ratchet thereby sliding over it. 3.) Maybe a third, the pawl being rough, not smooth enough and binds up, that's a variation of theory 1.

Not sure which one is it yet, have not got my paw on one.
  #5  
Old 01-18-2020, 10:41 AM
drail drail is offline
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A Colt revolver with a non stacking trigger pull? Put that crack pipe down and step away slowly........
  #6  
Old 01-18-2020, 10:47 AM
FNHipowerluv FNHipowerluv is offline
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Originally Posted by drail View Post
A Colt revolver with a non stacking trigger pull? Put that crack pipe down and step away slowly........
The MKIII guns weren't as bad in that regard.
  #7  
Old 01-18-2020, 10:49 AM
joebuck joebuck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drail View Post
A Colt revolver with a non stacking trigger pull? Put that crack pipe down and step away slowly........

^^^^
That's a good one. Damn. Can anyone do anything right anymore? Love Colt products for decades but this is standard nonsense. Please don't release products to have customers beta (or alpha) test the stuff.
  #8  
Old 01-18-2020, 11:05 AM
UncleEd UncleEd is online now
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Whether in the theories the problem lies with
the V-spring chosen or slightly off dimensions
with some parts, the Colt lockwork was not
chosen by other manufacturers in the world.

The Smith & Wesson design however, and to
an extent the Ruger design, have been copied
or modified.

I'm thinking of the Rossi, the Taurus, the various
Spanish knockoffs, the various Charter Arms,
the French MR72 or MR88, the Korth ape the
Smith or Ruger designs of lockwork.

A very logical and solid reason exists for this.

Heck, even the later Colt revolver designs such
as the Anaconda have more in common with the
Dan Wesson internals than the old, original
Colt design found in the Python.
  #9  
Old 01-18-2020, 11:30 AM
FNHipowerluv FNHipowerluv is offline
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Originally Posted by UncleEd View Post
Whether in the theories the problem lies with
the V-spring chosen or slightly off dimensions
with some parts, the Colt lockwork was not
chosen by other manufacturers in the world.

The Smith & Wesson design however, and to
an extent the Ruger design, have been copied
or modified.

I'm thinking of the Rossi, the Taurus, the various
Spanish knockoffs, the various Charter Arms,
the French MR72 or MR88, the Korth ape the
Smith or Ruger designs of lockwork.

A very logical and solid reason exists for this.

Heck, even the later Colt revolver designs such
as the Anaconda have more in common with the
Dan Wesson internals than the old, original
Colt design found in the Python.
The S&W system is just the Colt system inverted with a a different trigger rebound mechanism (The early S&W trigger rebound system was even more similar to a Colt.)
  #10  
Old 01-18-2020, 12:02 PM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drail View Post
A Colt revolver with a non stacking trigger pull? Put that crack pipe down and step away slowly........
I am so sorry, one has to be careful what to say around here.

let me rephrase: in the attempt to reduce the Colt typical long and stacking DA trigger pull, Colt overdid it, reduced spring tension of the V spring too much for the pawl to reliably do it's thing....is a theory....
  #11  
Old 01-18-2020, 12:04 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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The Colt Python has only been out for two weeks, and already people expect Colt to have fixed all the issues by now??? It took Glock nearly a year to fix all the Glock 42 issues which they claimed it never even had. Same with the issues that plagued the early Gen4s. And then SIG took several months as well to finally solve the issue of broken strikers in its P365, not to mention the drop-fire issues with the P320. And don't forget that the first version of the S&W 586/686 (aka "no dash") had to be recalled due to cylinder binding issues, which took them several months to a year to fix as well.

If you're worried about problems with the new Colt Python, be like the rest of us and wait for the bugs to get worked out before you go out and buy one. This seems to be SOP for any new gun these days regardless of manufacturer.
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Avoid the temptation to replace everything on your brand-new 1911 just to make it "better". Know what you're changing out and why. You may spend a lot of money fixing things that weren't broken to begin with. Shoot at least 500 rounds through it first, then decide what you don't like and want to improve. Regarding vintage 1911s, pre-1970 pistols are highly collectible in original, unaltered condition and should NEVER be refinished or modified as it completely ruins their monetary value.
  #12  
Old 01-18-2020, 12:04 PM
UncleEd UncleEd is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FNHipowerluv View Post
The S&W system is just the Colt system inverted with a a different trigger rebound mechanism (The early S&W trigger rebound system was even more similar to a Colt.)
True enough about the rebound system in early Smiths.

But Smith simplified the whole process and therein lies
the success of that design.

I've seen Pythons hung up when the internal
cylinder stop screw comes loose, something in design
more complicated than the Smith system.

Oh well, Colt will solve the problem on the new Python
and everyone will be happy hopefully.
  #13  
Old 01-18-2020, 02:11 PM
buyamerican buyamerican is offline
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DSK has made a valid point along with everone else. I have ALS and my range time is coming to and end much faster than I would like. Left hand is done and now my right hand is wanting to catch up. As dumb as it sounds I am on a list for one. I have a older one that is never fired anymore. As 4110mm said the pawl is not engaging the rachet for some reason. I hope an owner will post the fix that was made to correct the problem. The video Hickok45 was a good one and the gun seems accurate and I would hope most of the new Pythons are fine. Only time will tell. Thanks to all for your comments.
  #14  
Old 01-18-2020, 03:56 PM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buyamerican View Post
DSK has made a valid point along with everone else. I have ALS and my range time is coming to and end much faster than I would like. Left hand is done and now my right hand is wanting to catch up. As dumb as it sounds I am on a list for one. I have a older one that is never fired anymore. As 4110mm said the pawl is not engaging the rachet for some reason. I hope an owner will post the fix that was made to correct the problem. The video Hickok45 was a good one and the gun seems accurate and I would hope most of the new Pythons are fine. Only time will tell. Thanks to all for your comments.
I pray for you that you will have many years more of good shooting fun ahead of you and I know others see will join because when 2 or more gather in His name, He is among us and He can heal. As you wait for the new one, just shoot the old one, I don't see why not.
  #15  
Old 01-18-2020, 04:14 PM
buyamerican buyamerican is offline
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Good idea 4110mm. Yes I believe in prayer for sure. I am thankfull for all the prayers I get. This ALS is some bad stuff. There is a bunch of fine folk's on this forum and I appreciate all of them. I am trying to get some range time in with my right hand. I am good for about 3 magazines out of a 1911 and I am done. I sold my 642 S&W because I had a hard time pulling the trigger. I have sold off a lot of my stuff and it is very hard to do. Back on subject. I would really like to hear from owner's of the new Python.
  #16  
Old 01-18-2020, 04:52 PM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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Originally Posted by buyamerican View Post
Back on subject. I would really like to hear from owner's of the new Python.
I sold my 1964 6'' full set with signed test target in a reddish brown vinyl case and miss it. It was a gorgeous example of royal blue, the best and a fabulous bullseye shooter. I am a tactical shooter and in a episode of stupor I sold it for big money but still...

I have no new one and I am not going to get one either. I think if you know the old, this one can only disappoint, it's a sign of the time.

I follow the Coltforum and there are 2-3 threads, one has about 140 pages full of pictures, reports, pawls, crowns, grips and everything that occurred and can be found. I am sure you have looked there. If not, go here:

https://www.coltforum.com/forums/pyt...020-a-131.html

Don't abandon us...come back here as well...
  #17  
Old 01-18-2020, 05:11 PM
buyamerican buyamerican is offline
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Headed to Colt Forum. I was looking on you tube and a person called "GoldenWeb" has a video posted that looks like a person firing a new Python at the shot show and the cylinder stops turning. The person firing the gun is a well known gun writer but I can't remember his name. It looked like they had several boxes stacked up.

Last edited by buyamerican; 01-18-2020 at 06:07 PM. Reason: remove negitive statement
  #18  
Old 01-18-2020, 05:19 PM
7.62Kolectr 7.62Kolectr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drail View Post
A Colt revolver with a non stacking trigger pull? Put that crack pipe down and step away slowly........
I donít know you so donít take this as an insult but Hackathorn tested one in an extensive YouTube review and said just that, it doesnít stack. I think he may know a thing or two?
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  #19  
Old 01-18-2020, 05:36 PM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buyamerican View Post
Headed to Colt Forum. I was looking on you tube and a person called "GoldenWeb" has a video posted that looks like a person firing a new Python at the shot show and the cylinder stops turning. The person firing the gun is a well known gun writer but I can't remember his name. It looked like they had several boxes stacked up. That is sad which makes me think Colt knew of a potential problem and released them anyway.
you mean hickock45?
  #20  
Old 01-18-2020, 05:38 PM
Culpepper Cattle Co. Culpepper Cattle Co. is offline
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Assuming a larger non-rotation issue and not just a few isolated problems, I'm less interested in the cause than the fix.

Will it be a chewing gum and string solution if it's actually a baked-in design problem, or will Colt be willing to do the heavy lifting of acknowledging it and calling 'em all back for a true correction?

Or will they go the Glock and Sig route of refusing to take official responsibility and issue a recall, but instead offering "free, voluntary 'upgrades'"? Hopefully not.

Colt's already had one recall on this one, but essentially silent since it was effected before the Python was officially announced and on the market.
  #21  
Old 01-18-2020, 05:43 PM
7.62Kolectr 7.62Kolectr is offline
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Originally Posted by Culpepper Cattle Co. View Post
Assuming a larger non-rotation issue and not just a few isolated problems, I'm less interested in the cause than the fix.

Will it be a chewing gum and string solution if it's actually a baked-in design problem, or will Colt be willing to do the heavy lifting of acknowledging it and calling 'em all back for a true correction?

Or will they go the Glock and Sig route of refusing to take official responsibility and issue a recall, but instead offering "free, voluntary 'upgrades'"? Hopefully not.

Colt's already had one recall on this one, but essentially silent since it was effected before the Python was officially announced and on the market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buyamerican View Post
Headed to Colt Forum. I was looking on you tube and a person called "GoldenWeb" has a video posted that looks like a person firing a new Python at the shot show and the cylinder stops turning. The person firing the gun is a well known gun writer but I can't remember his name. It looked like they had several boxes stacked up. That is sad which makes me think Colt knew of a potential problem and released them anyway.
I doubt they knew of anything and release them anyway.
A Colt rep has signed up on the Colt forum and addressed some of the issues.
It is quite nice for an actual rep to join a forum and address peoples concerns.
Colt is going to do their best to fix these things. I consider it a small hiccup in a long coming road of production.
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  #22  
Old 01-18-2020, 05:44 PM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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Originally Posted by 7.62Kolectr View Post
I donít know you so donít take this as an insult but Hackathorn tested one in an extensive YouTube review and said just that, it doesnít stack. I think he may know a thing or two?
IIRC Hack is a paid consultant to Colt no? Did he not mention that in his latest ramblings on about the series 70? I don't think Hickock45 mentioned that he is paid for by Colt.
  #23  
Old 01-18-2020, 10:03 PM
Culpepper Cattle Co. Culpepper Cattle Co. is offline
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I doubt they knew of anything and release them anyway.
A Colt rep has signed up on the Colt forum and addressed some of the issues.
It is quite nice for an actual rep to join a forum and address peoples concerns.
Colt is going to do their best to fix these things. I consider it a small hiccup in a long coming road of production.
The "Colt rep" over at the Colt forum was outed as a fraud.
  #24  
Old 01-18-2020, 11:06 PM
Totally Tactical Totally Tactical is offline
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The latest I heard was Colt wanted all the defective guns back to see what is going on with them and figure out the fix.
It's like what they say about cars " Never buy a new model the first year out"

My thoughts are that Colt should have done enough test firing to catch this before it hit the market, especially on a gun costing this much.
  #25  
Old 01-18-2020, 11:09 PM
7.62Kolectr 7.62Kolectr is offline
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Originally Posted by Culpepper Cattle Co. View Post
The "Colt rep" over at the Colt forum was outed as a fraud.
I saw that thread as well. Seems to me it was one persons opinion of it being a fraud. But I don’t think it was ‘proven’? Of course I could be wrong. Either way Colt has taken the reigns on the issues and they are addressing them rapidly and head on. it’s not the end of the world and Colt will be making these new Pythons for years to come.
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Last edited by 7.62Kolectr; 01-18-2020 at 11:28 PM.
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