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  #126  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:04 PM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
This couldn’t be further from the truth.

Too large of an angle creates a really short ramp. Not enough of an angle creates too much ramp length which might actually interfere with disconnector function.

Between 7-8 degrees is what I do. The cut only needs to be a hair deeper than the top of the disco. The ramp pushing down on the top of the disco is way better than it being hit from the back.
I was commenting on the pic that showed just a 45 on the front edge, which is not a narrow-long ramp cut. Even just rounding over the front edge (only where it hits disco) will make it smoother.
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  #127  
Old 12-07-2018, 03:43 PM
EvolutionArmory EvolutionArmory is offline
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Ahh, I’m sorry then.

Isn’t a chamfered breechface/stripper rail pretty much standard on slides now anyway if it hasn’t always been?

I don’t see how that’s relavant to this conversation I guess.
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  #128  
Old 12-14-2018, 05:51 AM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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I found my pics.

These were taken using a small scope-cam on my android. I cut this ramp by hand using small files.



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  #129  
Old 12-14-2018, 07:02 AM
Sailormilan2 Sailormilan2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyyou View Post
Let's look at a stock setup. there is 90* angle on the slide, impacting the disconnector. The disco has an angle on it, not sure what the angle is, but let's say it's 60*
44* on the back side(hammer side), and 42* on the front(muzzle) side
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  #130  
Old 12-14-2018, 09:04 AM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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I have many pics, forgot this one. I was showing that even rounding the edge of slide can help. The disco spec shows a small radius on it's 44* cut, etc.

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  #131  
Old 12-14-2018, 11:21 AM
EvolutionArmory EvolutionArmory is offline
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But what would adding such a shallow ramp accomplish?

If the ramp is shallower than the top of the disconnector, what benefit does it have in easing the disco down? You are basically only doing half of the job and gaining no benefit.
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  #132  
Old 12-14-2018, 11:55 AM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
But what would adding such a shallow ramp accomplish?

If the ramp is shallower than the top of the disconnector, what benefit does it have in easing the disco down? You are basically only doing half of the job and gaining no benefit.
When you say "shallow" do you mean the length of the ramp?

When you cut any angle, even one that is not as deep as disco head and not very long, you reduce the impact, it creates 2 wedges hitting each other.

But yes, to make it very smooth it has to start at least as deep as the disco head sticks up (and dont forget that there is space between slide and frame, so cutting exactly the height of disco head will probably leave ~3 thou extra in depth of ramp). Longer ramps = less impact.
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  #133  
Old 12-14-2018, 05:53 PM
kinnison kinnison is offline
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  #134  
Old 12-16-2018, 11:24 AM
Dustin_Housel Dustin_Housel is offline
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I run 4.5 degrees at usually .050 deep

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  #135  
Old 12-16-2018, 11:49 AM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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Originally Posted by Dustin_Housel View Post
I run 4.5 degrees at usually .050 deep
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Do you put a small radius on the front and backs edges of the cut?
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  #136  
Old 12-16-2018, 03:55 PM
Jolly Rogers Jolly Rogers is offline
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Originally Posted by 1911_Kid View Post
Do you put a small radius on the front and backs edges of the cut?
What purpose would that serve? The front edge is above the head of the disco. The rear end will not have any stress as the disco is depressed to the frame rail.
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  #137  
Old 12-16-2018, 09:30 PM
passx passx is offline
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1911 kid, guess i’m trying to understand what you’re trying to accomplish. The disconnector cut is intended to take the side load off of the disconnector by pushing down on the top not the side, done right the slide becomes much smoother and more consistent in its operation.

I just did the slide of my 6” long slide Fusion 9mm and cannot believe how nicely it works, it was good before but now is just butter. Haven’t shot it yet so I don’t know if it’ll eliminate the fliers yet although this gun is pretty consistent so i’m Hoping for a little improvement, but besides all that the slide operation is just so slick now, i’m happy with it.

Machined it at 7deg, .060in deep and just slightly wider than the disco at .155in. , really work well. Probably shoot it Tuesday so i’ll Let you know how it does.

So anyway, 1911kid, not trying to pick on you but I really don’t see any benefit in doing what you’re doing outside maybe a slight radius on the edge of the breech face. Don’t know. Going to do my 5”sa 9mm RO and my Thompson 5” .45 next, one of the few things that don’t seem to have any negatives to it.

Last edited by passx; 12-16-2018 at 09:35 PM.
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  #138  
Old 12-17-2018, 08:22 AM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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If you pass an end mill straight across on the angle to make a "long" ramp, where the end mill leaves the metal it creates a hard line, literally just a flat angle cut on the metal. In cross section it looks like two lines that meet on an angle, and the point it forms is what rides the disco. if you round over that point just a tad (very small radius, like using a 600 rubber stone) the disco now has a small radius to travel over. It just eases the transition. It really only needs to be done on the backside of the ramp, the front side is deeper than the disco so you dont have that interface, etc.

This edge
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Last edited by 1911_Kid; 12-17-2018 at 10:37 AM.
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  #139  
Old 12-18-2018, 06:06 AM
EvolutionArmory EvolutionArmory is offline
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Originally Posted by 1911_Kid View Post
When you say "shallow" do you mean the length of the ramp?

When you cut any angle, even one that is not as deep as disco head and not very long, you reduce the impact, it creates 2 wedges hitting each other.

But yes, to make it very smooth it has to start at least as deep as the disco head sticks up (and dont forget that there is space between slide and frame, so cutting exactly the height of disco head will probably leave ~3 thou extra in depth of ramp). Longer ramps = less impact.
No, I mean the depth of your ramp. It looks like it is more shallow than the disconnector would protrude from the frame. So basically, if your cut is less deep than the top of the disconnector, whatever angle you cut it to will be meaningless because the breechface is still gonna smack the back side of the disco instead of clearing it and pushing it down from the top.
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  #140  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:16 AM
Dustin_Housel Dustin_Housel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1911_Kid View Post
If you pass an end mill straight across on the angle to make a "long" ramp, where the end mill leaves the metal it creates a hard line, literally just a flat angle cut on the metal. In cross section it looks like two lines that meet on an angle, and the point it forms is what rides the disco. if you round over that point just a tad (very small radius, like using a 600 rubber stone) the disco now has a small radius to travel over. It just eases the transition. It really only needs to be done on the backside of the ramp, the front side is deeper than the disco so you dont have that interface, etc.

This edge
Yes when I get done it take a stone and break all edges slightly

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  #141  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:40 AM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
No, I mean the depth of your ramp. It looks like it is more shallow than the disconnector would protrude from the frame. So basically, if your cut is less deep than the top of the disconnector, whatever angle you cut it to will be meaningless because the breechface is still gonna smack the back side of the disco instead of clearing it and pushing it down from the top.
Ah, i now see what you are saying. But, any ramp cut does not push directly down on disco, it pushes it from the side, the ramp is a wedge and the force is applied via an angle. Hence, trigonometry for the vertical and horizontal component vector forces.

And no, hitting the back (side) of disco via a parallel face (no ramp) is not the same as hitting the disco on a ramp that is 45º and very short (1/8" long). Not an ideal ramp, etc. If the ramp is not deep enough for disco to clear at the start, there may be a little bit of parallel hit until disco gets under the ramp.

The disco itself has an angle cut on both sides, etc.

Any angle, regardless of depth or length is better than nothing at all. A longer ramp that starts at least as deep as the disco protrudes will obviously exhibit the least impact.
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Last edited by 1911_Kid; 12-18-2018 at 12:26 PM.
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  #142  
Old 12-18-2018, 12:59 PM
stevemaury stevemaury is offline
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From https://forums.1911forum.com/showpos...26&postcount=2
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  #143  
Old 12-18-2018, 01:04 PM
Dustin_Housel Dustin_Housel is offline
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Yeah that's a factory cut one from NHC I haven't changed

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  #144  
Old 12-18-2018, 03:56 PM
EvolutionArmory EvolutionArmory is offline
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Originally Posted by 1911_Kid View Post
Ah, i now see what you are saying. But, any ramp cut does not push directly down on disco, it pushes it from the side, the ramp is a wedge and the force is applied via an angle. Hence, trigonometry for the vertical and horizontal component vector forces.

And no, hitting the back (side) of disco via a parallel face (no ramp) is not the same as hitting the disco on a ramp that is 45º and very short (1/8" long). Not an ideal ramp, etc. If the ramp is not deep enough for disco to clear at the start, there may be a little bit of parallel hit until disco gets under the ramp.

The disco itself has an angle cut on both sides, etc.

Any angle, regardless of depth or length is better than nothing at all. A longer ramp that starts at least as deep as the disco protrudes will obviously exhibit the least impact.
According to the 1911 disco print, the top of the disco should have a .015 radius where the top meets the face and rear, correct? Now, if your disconnector ramp is slightly deeper than how far your disco protrudes from the frame, the ramp will push the disco down much more from the top.
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  #145  
Old 12-18-2018, 04:50 PM
1911_Kid 1911_Kid is offline
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Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
According to the 1911 disco print, the top of the disco should have a .015 radius where the top meets the face and rear, correct? Now, if your disconnector ramp is slightly deeper than how far your disco protrudes from the frame, the ramp will push the disco down much more from the top.
Agree, but the rail doesnt just hit at/on that small radius, it slams into some of the face of the disco that is cut at 44º, etc.

If you have a ramp deep enough then there's really no need for that 44º angle on the disco. It would seem the prints did angles on disco vs not cutting a ramp into the slide. I dont know enough history about 1911's to know why they chose to not put a ramp on the slide and cut angle on disco. Perhaps no ramp you have more face to strip a round, thus more reliable ??
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  #146  
Old 12-18-2018, 05:53 PM
EvolutionArmory EvolutionArmory is offline
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Originally Posted by 1911_Kid View Post
Agree, but the rail doesnt just hit at/on that small radius, it slams into some of the face of the disco that is cut at 44º, etc.

If you have a ramp deep enough then there's really no need for that 44º angle on the disco. It would seem the prints did angles on disco vs not cutting a ramp into the slide. I dont know enough history about 1911's to know why they chose to not put a ramp on the slide and cut angle on disco. Perhaps no ramp you have more face to strip a round, thus more reliable ??
How can a ramp that is cut so it is deeper than the top of the disco at a 7 or 8 degree angle hit anywhere but the top of a 44 degree angle.

Pardon the crude drawing. It was what I had available to me.

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  #147  
Old 12-18-2018, 06:35 PM
JNW JNW is offline
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Q: How many angels can dance on the head of a disconnector?

A: 1911
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  #148  
Old 12-18-2018, 07:47 PM
oso1 oso1 is offline
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Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
How can a ramp that is cut so it is deeper than the top of the disco at a 7 or 8 degree angle hit anywhere but the top of a 44 degree angle.

Pardon the crude drawing. It was what I had available to me.



EA how many more times or different ways do you have to explain the purpose of the ramp ? This is like the 5th time in this thread already, if anyone doesn't understand by now I don't know what to say
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  #149  
Old 12-18-2018, 08:15 PM
SV 22 SV 22 is offline
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I asked a question previously that got skipped over. Smooth guns are great, but precise guns are interesting. One of the benefits of the disconnector ramp was fewer first rounds flyers. As I understand it, the idea was that the slide only hits the disconnector on loading the first round. Is this because one is physically incapable of releasing the trigger before the slide begins its forward movement?
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  #150  
Old 12-18-2018, 08:46 PM
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Well I went to the range today to try a couple of things, first was my 6” Fusion 9mm longslide that I built and just added a disco ramp to this week (thanks to EA and Rob @ACWby the way) the ramp made things really smooth and slick.

So shooting it today was great, this gun is very accurate anyway but adding the disc ramp just really tightened things up, nice tight groups, extremely happy with the results, I will be doing this to more of my 1911’s for sure.

I shot the fusion back to back with my Sig p210 and quite simply the Fusion is much easier to shoot accurately with tighter groups.

The otherreally interesting part of the range trip today was that i’ve had problems with using .357 Tulammo in my S&W that would lock it up (crap Ammo !) anyway, I let my friend shoot a load of Geco .357 through it, after 5 noisey, fire breathing rounds (I was. Watching behind him) I noticed fire coming from just in front of the firing bench, called for a firing halt and looked over the front of the nicely carpet covered bench’s to see a pretty good sized fire building and following the saw cut in the floor,,, holy crap ! I grabbed the fire extinguisher as my buddy ran up front to let them know.

There was a fairly packed house and the counter guy (nice guy !) kinda ripped on me for using the fire extinguisher and not just let them take care of it, I tried to explain that the fire was growing fairly quick but he was still not happy and was really unhappy with me fogging the place over with the extinguisher...... oh well, interesting day ! I’m really happy with the disco ramp.. highly recommended!
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