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house break-in next door

4K views 47 replies 39 participants last post by  HT77 
#1 ·
I live in an urban area in California. A week ago, my neighbor leaves for work at 7:30am. His spouse leaves the house at 11am for two hours. When she returns, she discovers that someone broke the glass on their sliding glass door which faces the backyard and has stolen a laptop computer, some cash and miscellaneous other items. I was on a bike ride and returned home at 11:30am. I never heard anything from my neighbor's house, and given the orientation of my home office, I think I would have heard the glass being broken had it occurred while I was home. So, the perp must have broken in between 11am and 11:30am.

I started to think about what I would have done if I had heard the glass being broken. My first thought was that I would have called the police, then grabbed my Colt .45ACP and walked over to my neighbor's to investigate. I've done this before when I have heard other neighbors' home alarm go off. I feel like it's being a good citizen. (The neighbor who got broken into does not have a home alarm...yet.) As I thought about it more, what would I have done if I confronted the perp exiting my neighbor's house with the stolen goods? I could try to detain him, pending the arrival of the police. But what if the perp, unarmed, called my bluff and tried to leave anyway?

I have been a gun enthusiast all my life, and I have studied the legality of shooting someone. I have read Massad Ayoob's "In the Gravest Extreme" and David Kenik's "Armed Response" as well as many other articles about self defense. As we know, these laws are governed by state statute and not federal law. In California, you can only shoot someone if you feel an immediate threat to your life. You cannot just shoot someone for committing a property crime. If the perp in this case said, "screw you," and started to leave the premises, what would I do?

I disagree with California's laws regarding this situation, as, I'm sure, most of the readers do also. But, for purposes of this discussion, they are what they are.

What should I do in this situation? Don't tell me to try to use non-lethal force; I'm an old guy and these perps can often be high on drugs or otherwise not too blessed in the brains department. I feel deflated that there doesn't seem to be a good course of action in this situation. Am I completely handicapped by state law? I don't want to ignore a possible crime being committed, but what alternatives are out there?

Thanks for your thoughts.

Cal
 
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#34 ·
You call the police and stay put! Camp out at a window with binoculars or a camera and try to see what you can see. Take notes. If you're at the point where you've called the cops, you do not go walking over there and especially with a gun. It's just "stuff." It isn't worth the possibility of the situation escalating over STUFF. Or getting shot by the cops because they have no idea who you are. And this goes double for being in California. You do not want be "judged by 12...Californians."
 
#35 ·
As most of the posts here indicate, allowing law enforcement to do their job is the right answer. I agree - particularly if it's your neighbor's property vs. their lives and well being.

Ironic that today, living in Dallas TX, we received a neighborhood watch letter describing the shortage of DPD officers and that impact on non-violent response time. Got to think that questions like the OP asked could become in reasingly common.
 
#38 ·
My two cents is about the same as the rest. As much as it pains me to say this, and I personally think we need laws that say if someone is stealing the stuff you (or your neighbor) worked hard to buy that you can chase the sob down and shoot em in the back or in this case walk next door and shoot em in the teeth. But for whatever reason we don't enjoy those rules of engagement.

So the old security guard adage applies. Observe and report.
 
#40 ·
Ok, I'm gonna take a different approach to this.

Most of you have given great answers for what to do in case of a burglary, but you guys know after the fact that it was a burglary and nothing more.

In a situation where you hear (suspect) someone breaking in next door my first thought is, is my neighbor home? What if she is being assaulted while we wait for the cops to show up?

Now, I'm not saying I'd go over and confront anyone to find out..... but if I was sure she was in the house and in jeopardy then I'm not sure.....
 
#41 ·
You can become the bad guy. ...

This...

"Also, consider the perspectives of the responding officers arriving at a burglary call and spotting you onsite with a gun; it will at least momentarily be assumed you're the perp, and that can go irretrievably bad before you get a chance to clarify things."

Call 911 and observe. Unless your life or the life of someone you care about is in jeopardy, adding a firearm to the situation usually creates more problems than it solves.
 
#42 ·
In California, you can only shoot someone if you feel an immediate threat to your life. You cannot just shoot someone for committing a property crime. If the perp in this case said, "screw you," and started to leave the premises, what would I do?
First of all, the FIRST think to do is call 911. If they tell you to stay put, STAY PUT.

You should NEVER shoot unless you feel an immediate threat to your life.

Absent a directive from authority (such as the 911 operator) you can go out and investigate what may be a crime in progress -- someone breaking into a house or a car, for example, but you CANNOT shoot unless you feel an immediate threat to your life.

Now in some states, such as Texas, the law is different, but regardless of the state NEVER shoot unless your life or that of an innocent person is threatened.

If the perp says "screw you" and walks off, LET HIM GO. Get a good look at him, and especially memorize what he's wearing and any distinguishing marks or tattoos, so you can identify him later.

If he advances on you, weapon in hand, that's another matter.
 
#44 ·
All good advice. Call the police & be a good witness.

No matter how nice your neighbor is, he's probably not going to foot your lawyer or hospital bill if something goes wrong.
 
#45 ·
Caught a guy actively breaking into my neighbors front door in broad daylight. Grabbed my pistol, stuck it in my back pocket with one hand on it behind my back and had my phone on video record in the other, went out and yelled at him... he said he was a friend and i said good good I'll call him and tell him you're here. He said dont bother and ran to his truck parked in the street and rode off. Then i called the cops. Im sure if i had more time or thought more clearly I'd have called the cops first and i will next time. Anyway the cops took my video, and i find out later they'd been looking for this guy and now they had his plates and made an arrest. Something like 8 different burglaries he was suspected of.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
 
#46 ·
The biggest problem, among many, in going out and engaging the burglar, is you don't know who else may have called it in....the cops may already be on their way. Now they show up and they have the well intended but overzealous neighbor in the mix, maybe pointing a gun, maybe he or she is in the back yard, in the garage, and the officer rounds the corner sees the neighbor with a gun...well, you get the idea.

Part of my annual training for my agency is a Virtra-trainer, 270 degree shoot / don't shoot simulator, very immersive experience. The person running the system can alter the story line based on the commands I give, etc. Sounds come in from 360 degrees and the 270 degree screens means there's things happening outside of your peripheral vision.

One scenario had me dispatched to reports of a suspicious person in an apartment complex. The scenario begins and as I'm rounding a corner, I see someone matching the description facing away from me.

Its dark, I give commands to stop and raise their hands...instead they start to turn, and I see something in their hand...remember...its dark.... I shoot...turns out to be an off duty cop that didn't call in to dispatch that he was investigating the suspicious person....he was holding a badge. Legitimate shoot? Maybe, maybe not...but either way, that person is not going home after that.
 
#47 ·
It looks like people here are trying to establish a Policy.

Meaning a set action (or inaction) to take in a set situation.

That's fine if there IS a set situation. But "break in next door" could manifest itself 1000 different ways.

Form the neighbor breaking in himself because of losing his key, to a rape & murder home invasion.

Because of these variables I will not make a set plan. I will assess what's happening to the best of my abilities & take the action that assessment warrants.

Ranging from going back to bed, to charging in like Rooster Cogburn. Or one of the 998 actions in between those extremes.

Hiding inside while on hold with 911 is one of them.
 
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