Found an odd 9mm case in range brass - 1911Forum
1911Forum
Advertise Here
Forum   Reviews   Rules   Legal   Site Supporters & Donations   Advertise


Go Back   1911Forum > >

Notices


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-19-2019, 03:25 PM
f1racefan f1racefan is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: western Kentucky
Posts: 722
Found an odd 9mm case in range brass

As I was going thru the 9mm brass I picked up at the range yesterday, something caught my eye. Down inside the case of one piece of brass was a ridge. I'm guessing it's put there by the manufacturer to limit how far into the case the bullet gets seated. The headstamp was "MAXX Tech". Seems this might cause problems if your press was set up to seat any deeper than the ridge. I'd never seen this before so thought I'd post a pic here.

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-19-2019, 03:33 PM
JamieC JamieC is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 899
Yeah, I've thrown out a bunch of them, they DO screw up the 'works' when trying to load a bunch.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-19-2019, 03:34 PM
Ghostrider903 Ghostrider903 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 315
It will also decrease case volume. I would send them directly to the scrap yard


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old 05-19-2019, 04:25 PM
jjfitch jjfitch is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 6,201
"Stepped" 9mm brass, not meant for reloaders!

Fairly common in the last few years.

Smiles,
__________________
John, Retired LEO, CA POST Certified Firearms Instructor, NRA Endmt., NRA Instructor, NRA RSO, Blue Lives Matter
Gun Control: Acquire target, align sights, press trigger, only after you have identified your target and what is beyond it and made the decision to shoot!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-19-2019, 04:57 PM
yeti yeti is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Illinois
Posts: 3,039
I know there are folks that reload & leave it, but no thanks. I pitch that stuff.
Also keep an eye out for Amerc, Ammoload, Freedom & older IMT.
__________________

NRA Life Member
RSO
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-19-2019, 07:31 PM
Twoboxer Twoboxer is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 811
Sorry, they reload exactly the same as (eg) Blazer Brass, Federal, etc.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-19-2019, 07:46 PM
jjfitch jjfitch is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 6,201
Stepped case reload data?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Twoboxer View Post
Sorry, they reload exactly the same as (eg) Blazer Brass, Federal, etc.
Which powder manufacturer provides reload data for stepped brass?

Smiles.
__________________
John, Retired LEO, CA POST Certified Firearms Instructor, NRA Endmt., NRA Instructor, NRA RSO, Blue Lives Matter
Gun Control: Acquire target, align sights, press trigger, only after you have identified your target and what is beyond it and made the decision to shoot!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-19-2019, 10:51 PM
Twoboxer Twoboxer is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 811
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjfitch View Post
Which powder manufacturer provides reload data for stepped brass?

Smiles.
Results on chrono and paper tell me they do not need to .
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-20-2019, 02:37 AM
MSgt Dotson MSgt Dotson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,536
as long as you are 1/2 -1 grain short of max loads..

Not the case to suddenly use if already at a max load of Clays or Titegroup....
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-20-2019, 06:03 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 6,673
Sounds like we are getting a little bit reckless and assuming that the pressure curve of powder is linear. You would have to “guess” to begin with before attempting chrony runs. No point at all. Toss it! There are gazillions of 9mm once fired cases for cheap, why even mess with it.
**Note to beginning reloaders: Experimenting like this is NOT advised. Load development should be done by component manufacturers.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-20-2019, 07:46 AM
yeti yeti is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Illinois
Posts: 3,039
There are so many quality reloadable brass cases out there, many are free for the taking. Stepped case design also introduces the potential to rupture at the step.
I don't know why I'd ever use these cases, unless it was an end of days can't find anything else scenario.
__________________

NRA Life Member
RSO
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-20-2019, 08:50 AM
Tom Freeman's Avatar
Tom Freeman Tom Freeman is offline
More Cowbell...
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,514
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twoboxer View Post
Sorry, they reload exactly the same as (eg) Blazer Brass, Federal, etc.
Some of them will break in two leaving the front half in the chamber.
__________________
I am a rather brilliant surgeon, perhaps I can help you with that hump…
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-20-2019, 09:08 AM
Jim Watson Jim Watson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Florence, Alabama, USA
Posts: 21,426
Some of the others will, too. The only case head separation I ever had was a WW case.

I don't worry about it, 9mm brass is cheap and I only recover what I shoot in practice. Match empties are left behind as I seek out lunch after the competition. So I don't recycle 9mm til it wears out.

The reduced volume of the stepped case increased pressure enough to increase average muzzle velocity by a whopping 13 fps. With MY load.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-20-2019, 09:48 AM
JBnTX JBnTX is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Watson View Post
The reduced volume of the stepped case increased pressure enough to increase average muzzle velocity by a whopping 13 fps. With MY load.
Now that's scary.....
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-20-2019, 10:56 AM
mikld mikld is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: So. Oregon
Posts: 1,133
In the last few years I've been reading about bullets seated too deep in 9mm raising the pressures considerably and occasionally dangerously. I would think the stepped cases with much reduced capacity would produce much higher pressures when loaded the same as "normal" 9mm rounds. Smaller capacity with same powder charge would increase pressure. If I found some f these stepped cases, I'd toss them Even if they were only "questionable", 9mm brass is plentiful, often free or very cheap...
__________________
My Anchor is holding fast...
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 05-20-2019, 11:36 AM
GySgt 7291 GySgt 7291 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Louisville, Ky
Age: 66
Posts: 369
Not all MaxxTech brass is stepped but the few I've run across won't go through the sizing die, brings reloading to an abrupt halt. I check for them when prepping brass but one gets through once in a while. With the amount of 9mm brass available I don't see any reason to try reloading them.
__________________
Butch
Semper Fidelis
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-20-2019, 11:54 AM
jjfitch jjfitch is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 6,201
Safety First!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Sounds like we are getting a little bit reckless and assuming that the pressure curve of powder is linear. You would have to “guess” to begin with before attempting chrony runs. No point at all. Toss it! There are gazillions of 9mm once fired cases for cheap, why even mess with it.
**Note to beginning reloaders: Experimenting like this is NOT advised. Load development should be done by component manufacturers.

Thanks for your support. It is never good practice to deviate from manufacturer's recommendation. If a load or components are not listed it is usually because of safety or performance issues.

Smiles,
__________________
John, Retired LEO, CA POST Certified Firearms Instructor, NRA Endmt., NRA Instructor, NRA RSO, Blue Lives Matter
Gun Control: Acquire target, align sights, press trigger, only after you have identified your target and what is beyond it and made the decision to shoot!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-20-2019, 01:29 PM
RetiredRod's Avatar
RetiredRod RetiredRod is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Springfield, Missouri
Posts: 14,351
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjfitch View Post
Thanks for your support. It is never good practice to deviate from manufacturer's recommendation. If a load or components are not listed it is usually because of safety or performance issues.

Smiles,
Sounds good, but I wonder if it's really true. It seems to me that bullet and/or powder manufacturers don't list more "loads" in their manuals (& on line, etc) because they don't want to spend the time and resources to assemble & test every possible bullet/powder/OAL combination. They only list the "safe" loads that meet the needs they perceive their customers have.
__________________


NRA Life Member
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-20-2019, 02:04 PM
jmorris jmorris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,758
They change internal volume of the case enough, my powder check die stops the machine.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-21-2019, 11:05 AM
mikld mikld is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: So. Oregon
Posts: 1,133
I believe reloading manuals don't include specific component combinations because they aren't appropriate, won't work well together, or unsafe. Also the popularity of a combination is taken into consideration. I have a Lyman Cast bullet Handbook #3 and it has just a few 45 Colt loads listed (just six), but the #4 has many more, perhaps because the 45 Colt is having a "resurrection"?
__________________
My Anchor is holding fast...
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 05-21-2019, 11:31 AM
JMB-1911A1 JMB-1911A1 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 72
MAXX Tech seems to get plenty of bad reviews as a complete round.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 05-21-2019, 12:36 PM
jjfitch jjfitch is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 6,201
For clarity.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by RetiredRod View Post
Sounds good, but I wonder if it's really true. It seems to me that bullet and/or powder manufacturers don't list more "loads" in their manuals (& on line, etc) because they don't want to spend the time and resources to assemble & test every possible bullet/powder/OAL combination. They only list the "safe" loads that meet the needs they perceive their customers have.
What I had in mind (Post #17) but wasn't clear about would be, as an example 147 grain in 9mm even though 125 grain is listed for a specific powder. The max case volume becomes compressed but still sub standard performance. Or meeting factory velocity means a dangerous over pressure.

Or like the pressure spikes when WST gets close to MAX at certain temperatures!

In either case, simple calibration issues that might not be catastrophic otherwise could result in "KABOOM"!

WST and W296 are two powders that come to mind that require careful respect when reloaders experiment outside factory recommendations.

Smiles,
__________________
John, Retired LEO, CA POST Certified Firearms Instructor, NRA Endmt., NRA Instructor, NRA RSO, Blue Lives Matter
Gun Control: Acquire target, align sights, press trigger, only after you have identified your target and what is beyond it and made the decision to shoot!

Last edited by jjfitch; 05-21-2019 at 12:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-22-2019, 06:34 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 6,673
Go ahead and shove 7 1/2 grains of Accurate #7 in there and see what happens. There is no sane reason to monkey with it. “Because it’s there” doesn’t cut it with this activity!
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-22-2019, 05:44 PM
Oso Polaris Oso Polaris is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Texas
Posts: 66
Case Separation - 9mm Internal Shoulder Cases

Freedom Munitions uses these style cases. At our range if there is a case separation then 95% of time it is one of these cases at exactly that internal shoulder position. Nice clean circular separation. Picture below is the front half of a couple of 9mm cases that I found recently... What are the odds that I had these sitting on my reloading bench in a Ziploc and wondered what/why I had them. Fate - I guess.



These days 9mm cases are cheap and easy to find or pick up at the range... I throw out/recycle these "Ugly Duckling" shouldered cases.

Last edited by Oso Polaris; 05-22-2019 at 05:50 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-22-2019, 06:04 PM
Fatboy46 Fatboy46 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: D/FW area
Posts: 346
save them- melt them down to brass ingots..
__________________
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:36 PM.


NOTICE TO USERS OF THIS SITE: By continuing to use this site, you certify that you have read and agree to abide by the Legal Terms of Use. All information, data, text or other materials ("Content") posted to this site by any users are the sole responsibility of those users. 1911Forum does not guarantee the accuracy, integrity, or quality of such Content.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 2015 1911Forum.com, LLC. All Rights Reserved