Reliable 9mm PCC options - 1911Forum
1911Forum
Advertise Here
Forum   Reviews   Rules   Legal   Site Supporters & Donations   Advertise


Go Back   1911Forum > >

Notices


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-10-2019, 08:40 AM
HarryO45 HarryO45 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Home of the Infantry
Posts: 4,764
Reliable 9mm PCC options

I got a young kid involved in 3G. He has done a few matches with a standard .223 AR. He loves the sport, and his family wants to fully supports his pursuit in competitive shooting$$$. He has done quite well, he is a natural shooter.

His family wants him to look at a 9mm because of ammo costs.

They did a little research and decided to buy a complete upper and adapter kit for the lower, so it can accept 9mm mags. I am not a Pcc Guy, but I donít notice the adapter guns at competition.

I didnít know the family was ready to buy until last night. They called me and asked what I thought about the purchase. I told them to h old off, till I got some other opinions. That is why I am here.

They want to go budget. I am concerned that the adapter will be frustrating in function and possibly ruin his experience in competition. But, I really donít know? Maybe there are some great adapters? Do I have a unjustied aversion to adaptors? Complete PCC is expensive, but I really donít know much about the cheaper models.

What Would you recommend for a 16Ē PCC in 9mm for hard use? We want economy but also must have reliability.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09-10-2019, 09:09 AM
techiede44 techiede44 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 504
OK, not an AR, but the Ruger PCC 9 has been very reliable for me & my friends using Glock mags including the 33 round sticks.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09-10-2019, 09:15 AM
HarryO45 HarryO45 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Home of the Infantry
Posts: 4,764
Quote:
Originally Posted by techiede44 View Post
OK, not an AR, but the Ruger PCC 9 has been very reliable for me & my friends using Glock mags including the 33 round sticks.
I thought about that too. I have not personally seen them in competition, but it is reliable and 33rds is plenty. Affordable. Optic ready. Adjustable stock, for growing into to it too.

Last edited by HarryO45; 09-10-2019 at 09:17 AM.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old 09-10-2019, 09:27 AM
Zippo Guy Zippo Guy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Northern California
Posts: 435
My vote is for the Ruger. However, I had to send mine back to get it to run trouble free.
__________________
Rick
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-10-2019, 10:09 AM
VoceNoctum VoceNoctum is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Fla
Posts: 1,256
Personal experience, Colt pattern or Glock pattern AR's are fine, as long as you stick with standard stuff. (People like to try to tweak buffer spring and buffer and all sorts of stuff to try to get faster less recoil more this, more that.)

Beretta CX4 storm works great, limited options.
Keltec Sub2000, works great, cheap gun and feels like it.
Chiappa PAK9 (pistol ak 9mm), works great, lots of fun, needs some additions for a brace or whatever. Century NAK9 is similar but bigger and Chiappa has a rifle version, but I've tried neither.
PTR9CT, works great, lots of fun and style, but expensive.

Things I haven't tried:
Hipoint, cheap, feels it, low cap mags.
Ruger, neat idea, take downs are fun, not expensive.
Sten repro, really want one, but paying that much for a pipe with a trigger, bleh.
B&T, they gotta be out of their damn mind with that price for a straight blowback. Hear great things though, but easy to dismiss this as fanboi raving.

CZ Evo9: Lots of options, works good, but everything seems just a little "off" in feel and looks.

CMMG, the newest and bestest, radial delayed blowback means less recoil than straight blowback. Get the ARC mag inserts and you can use them in magpul mags and have regular AR magazines. Uses normal buffers.

To build one requires CMMG barrel and bolt and the ARC mags, but otherwise good to go. People tweak them a lot, but I've no idea how much is needed vs boredom.

If I was doing it now, I'd give the CMMG Radial stuff a try. As it is, I've already got a Colt system 9mm SBR so not switching that any time soon.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-10-2019, 12:44 PM
mark2734 mark2734 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: California
Posts: 4,925
I'm in the process of building a AR lower into a 9. VoceNoctum covered most of the bases.

I'm going with Taccom,
https://taccom3g.com/product-categor...d-accessories/
instead of CMMG. I have their buffer setup and will be purchasing an upper soon.

Their buffer and spring system allows some tuneability but without the drawback of mixing several brands. Also they have several different pre-assembled uppers, you just have to pick the options you want.

Finally when I called and asked some questions the guy on the phone was super nice and took the time to talk to me like a person, something a lot of companies seem to fail.

I went with this adapter block, https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1019567735
It's made by someone and sold under 8-9 different brand names. The biggest advantage I saw was the mag release and bolt hold open are the same as standard AR.

For mags I went to Gun Mag Warehouse, https://gunmagwarehouse.com/all-maga...nes--9mm-luger
and picked up some 32 round ASC mags and a 10 round Metalform. I heard to stay away from ProMag

Hope this helps

Last edited by mark2734; 09-10-2019 at 12:49 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09-10-2019, 02:50 PM
bradsvette bradsvette is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: South
Posts: 2,819
Are they going to sell the AR or buy an additional gun? 556 ammo is pretty cheap now too. Why not just spend the money on bulk ammo. Nothing against PCCs. I love the concept and have several myself.

If they don't sell the AR. And if a new PCC is $800, and a thousand rounds of 9mm are $200. That's $1000. That money in 556 ammo would be about 4000 rounds. To recoup the cost savings of the new additional gun, in ammo savings alone, will take a long time and a lot of shooting, because he will also be buying 9mm for the new gun.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-10-2019, 03:49 PM
HarryO45 HarryO45 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Home of the Infantry
Posts: 4,764
we think alike

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradsvette View Post
Are they going to sell the AR or buy an additional gun? 556 ammo is pretty cheap now too. Why not just spend the money on bulk ammo. Nothing against PCCs. I love the concept and have several myself.

If they don't sell the AR. And if a new PCC is $800, and a thousand rounds of 9mm are $200. That's $1000. That money in 556 ammo would be about 4000 rounds. To recoup the cost savings of the new additional gun, in ammo savings alone, will take a long time and a lot of shooting, because he will also be buying 9mm for the new gun.
i think the same way. Glad you brought that up... the boy is 14yo and big for his age, strong frame. I think he should stay with the 556 too. But I took him to a match and we shot 300 rounds of ammo in a single match (carbine only). They bought 400 rds of ammo retail and it was not what they expected, and they compared it to 9mm, so here we go... adapter for 9mm lower and new upper and magazines$$$.

me personally I think all kids should learn to shoot the AR well... learn that Manual of Arms at an early age and stick with it. That MoA is not going away. Later you can fool around with other guns, but the early years are the best for learning.

https://teach.com/become/where-can-i...rly-childhood/
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-10-2019, 04:20 PM
Striker2237 Striker2237 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 7,018
The MPX G3 supposedly works now, I have no direct experience.

MP5 pattern clones work very well, ergos are a bit of an issue and won't keep up with a competition 5.56 AR

AR pattern guns from high end makers work really really well, JP makes a great one. These are the fastest.

CZ Evo 3s are extremely reliable but need changes for ergos and comfort and are high recoil for what they shoot. These are the best overall value.

B&T is Gucci and very very well made but do not keep up with MP5 clones due to not having a delay system.

Since it's competition you will benefit from some sort of locked breach system or a 5.56 will have less recoil.
__________________
Carry gun:Wilson Carry Comp Custom .45S Pocket carry:on loan Other 1911s:WC Supergrade Accucomp .38, WC BW Opticomp, WC CQB Compact, WC CQB Professional, WC Super Sentinel, WC CQB Elite 9mm, WC EDC X9, WC X9S, Ed Brown SR, NHC Predator II Opticomp, NHC T3 Hardchrome, Kimber Ultra, ATI Tactical, RIA Tactical 10mm, Kimber Ultra Diamond 9mm, Detonics Combat Master MKVI, Colt Centennial .460 Roland

Last edited by Striker2237; 09-10-2019 at 04:22 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09-10-2019, 05:06 PM
havanajim havanajim is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,430
If going with the PCC is a done deal, then in my experience the dedicated 9mm ARs seem to be more reliable than the adapter models, but, that does vary based on brand too, so I suppose that 'it depends' is the answer. I have a old Rock River dedicated version that, although not inexpensive, has never missed a beat, regardless of magazine brand or ammo type over a good bit of match use. However, of late, the CZ Scorpion has taken the lead as 'preferred' PCC, when I'm not using the Thompson. The CZ is simply a fantastic carbine. I find that it performs better than the SIG at much less cost - that goes for mag cost as well. Plus, there's a Scorpion after-market industry that makes 'customizing' extremely easy.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 09-10-2019, 09:16 PM
Descartian Descartian is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 1,841
For AR platform, JP rifles are going to be the best bet for hard competition use. I would definitely go with a dedicated 9mm lower and not an adapter.

Non AR although AR like go with the SIG MPX PCC. A lot of the hard core competition guys over on BEnos are changing over to the SIGís. AR like ergonomics and a piston system vs a blowback make it a winner. Itís a lot softer shooting than a blowback AR too.

I just ordered a MBX PCC.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-10-2019, 09:28 PM
Descartian Descartian is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 1,841
Hereís a great deal if you go with the MPX. No affiliation.

https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/278168-wts-two-sig-sauer-mpx-pcc-competition-carbines/
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-11-2019, 06:06 AM
HarryO45 HarryO45 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Home of the Infantry
Posts: 4,764
thank you - all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Descartian View Post
...competition use. I would definitely go with a dedicated 9mm lower and not an adapter.
Yea, I think this pretty much sums up the recommendations. I appreciate everyone time in responding. I will go with my instincts, and let the family know... that my recommendation is stick with the 5.56 and bulk purchase ammo.

Avoid adapters, new buffers, upper, and possible headaches, especially during the young lad's enjoyment/training in action shooting. If the want to go the 9mm route buy a complete unit from a good company.

Stick with the AR.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-11-2019, 11:14 AM
Stealth01 Stealth01 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: MidWest
Posts: 414
Thatís a shame... The AR9 is about as much fun as you can have with your clothes on!!
Attached Thumbnails
710CF24C-2C8C-44D4-8308-70ABFB4BDADB.jpeg  
__________________
Ken
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-11-2019, 02:05 PM
VoceNoctum VoceNoctum is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Fla
Posts: 1,256
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryO45 View Post
Yea, I think this pretty much sums up the recommendations. I appreciate everyone time in responding. I will go with my instincts, and let the family know... that my recommendation is stick with the 5.56 and bulk purchase ammo.

Avoid adapters, new buffers, upper, and possible headaches, especially during the young lad's enjoyment/training in action shooting. If the want to go the 9mm route buy a complete unit from a good company.

Stick with the AR.
Most of the conversion stuff runs as much as the guns anyway. The AR lower is not the most expensive part afterall.

If they want to cheap it up with a Palmetto upper on top of whatever lower they can find, it'll probably work fine. Glock mag guns usually work fine, but issues with bolt hold open.

As said though, blowback AR's in 9mm have more recoil than 223 anyway. Not as loud though!


Other option, tell them to get a 22lr AR15 for real cheap practice. I think the S&W ones are pretty cheap.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 09-12-2019, 08:26 PM
Doctor481 Doctor481 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: South Louisiana
Posts: 135
I have a SIG MPX, run it suppressed and it’s been flawless
Very soft shooting and quick handling
__________________
A 9mm might expand but a .45 will never shrink!
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-12-2019, 08:37 PM
Jim Watson Jim Watson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Florence, Alabama, USA
Posts: 21,322
Three gun swings both ways.
The serious competitor needs a .223 and a 9mm.
As for 9mms...
One friend shoots a Taccom with 5.25" barrel and 11"" bloop tube. Very light and gives same ballistics as pistol. (A lot of PCCs keep separate PCC and PCP ammo because of different barrel lengths.)
Another has a Foxtrot Mike that serves well.
I have seen kit guns disappoint.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-13-2019, 08:36 AM
M-Peltier M-Peltier is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,480
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryO45 View Post
Yea, I think this pretty much sums up the recommendations. I appreciate everyone time in responding. I will go with my instincts, and let the family know... that my recommendation is stick with the 5.56 and bulk purchase ammo.

Avoid adapters, new buffers, upper, and possible headaches, especially during the young lad's enjoyment/training in action shooting. If the want to go the 9mm route buy a complete unit from a good company.

Stick with the AR.
I think your recommendation is solid. If he's dabbling in 3G, was the thought to use a 9mm to train with? or was he planning to compete in PCC instead of 3G?
__________________
Ex-Military, 20+ years 3-Gun competitor, Colt certified Armorer, NRA Instructor, NSRT Officer-Retired, LGS Guru.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:14 AM.


NOTICE TO USERS OF THIS SITE: By continuing to use this site, you certify that you have read and agree to abide by the Legal Terms of Use. All information, data, text or other materials ("Content") posted to this site by any users are the sole responsibility of those users. 1911Forum does not guarantee the accuracy, integrity, or quality of such Content.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 2015 1911Forum.com, LLC. All Rights Reserved