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  #1  
Old 04-03-2020, 01:46 PM
Old Grey Hare Old Grey Hare is offline
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Bug-out kit for a tiny car.

I've been mulling a tent for a while, a two-person canvas tent. Mainly to get back to camping, which I haven't done in forever.. 30+ years. Then there's the distinct possibility of losing the house to a number of things.. disaster, civil unrest.. joblessness.. the list goes on.

But this Corona situation has made me think I better get a move on this plan. This one could bring all of it and more, within the next month or three, I think. If we make it to August we should be OK. Til the next one. Or we could be fighting in the streets in another month. Who knows.

I have very limited room in my car.. it's a Mini (ok, you all may laugh now. But I'm not a mountain man, I'm a low-density city dweller, so I needed the land equivalent of a Zero.)

But like a Zero, a mini's tight.. and I'm solo, I have no family, they're all dead. I have a few friends here and there, but who knows if in time of a real SHTF we can link up.

The linchpin will be the tent. I was considering a two-man canvas A-Frame, but being solo, those aren't the easiest to put up. So then there's Springbar and Kodiak. Both make 4' tall 8x6' 2-man canvas tents of modern design and will fit in a mini with rear seats down. I'm leaning to Kodiak for a number of reasons, despite them being made in China. And yes, that it's made in China *burns* me.

I want a nice canvas tent and not an "emergency" nylon shelter. I could do weeks.. months... year+ in a good tent. I've lived the tent life.. when I was 12. And a bit more in the military, but one can't compare a GP tent with a 2-man tent...

So.. tent. My guns. First-aid kit. Light, heat. Sheets, army blankets, cot, etc. I have about 5 gallons of kero and a few Dietz / Kirkman lanterns. A table and chair. AM/FM/SW radio. Some kind of way of making power (solar / inverter). LED lighting makes solar charging practical.

Camp tools such as axe and machete - i have plenty knives but need ax/machete. Big brass / deadhead rubber hammer for tent stakes.

Field mess kit, wood camp stove.

Fishing gear. Oh god I've never fished a fish in my life. Never cleaned one, coooked one. Last rabbit I got for myself and dressed was 30+ years ago. Can I still do that? I don't remember *how*.

Spares for guns.. springs, firing pins, that kinda thing. Cleaning gear. Knife-care stuff. Oh and an AR-7. That's a gap in my shootin' irons.. I have nothing for squirrel / rabbit. Well maybe the .45

Flag (US and Gadsden) and halyard to fly them.

Perimeter wire alarm, store-bought or improvised.

All I mentioned should fit in the Mini... if I'm the sole occupant. Everything will be camp-style; folding canvas/nylon and such.

I'm I over thinking this? Or is my abandoning what little faith I had left in humanity the right thing during these times? I don't trust the system anymore.. not just the gov't, I trust *none* of it now.

I fully expect I'll have to stand alone if SHTF in an epic, 1918 way.
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  #2  
Old 04-03-2020, 03:00 PM
mark2734 mark2734 is offline
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First I honestly don't think the world is going to end.

BUT having said that being prepared is just like carrying a gun for self defense, but to have it and not need it then to need it and not have it.

So I'll say the limiting factor is your car. While the Mini has COOL in capital letters for someone looking to survive long term it sucks because, well its a Mini.

Very low ground clearance and little room. Upgrading to a basic two door Jeep would get you a LOT more ground clearance, a little more room, and not take up that more urban footprint.

Just my 2 cents worth.
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  #3  
Old 04-03-2020, 03:32 PM
bulldozer1 bulldozer1 is online now
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There are many great nylon tents. Wind, water and weather proof. Much lighter, space saving and easier to put up then a canvas tent. Even a small canvas tent weights a ton and is anything but portable.
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  #4  
Old 04-03-2020, 03:42 PM
wccountryboy wccountryboy is offline
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The car is a factor.... but I'll skip over that for now.

I would respectfully suggest that you re think materials from the ground up. I can see form some of your other posts that you have an interest/ passion for the things of yesteryear....
Get over it. Its the 21st century. Canvas is a 16th century material. For tentage, its heavy, bulky, holds water, and rots quickly. There are plenty of modern tent options and material that weight less, take up less space, hold up to weather better, last longer, and are easier to use... even military tents aren't made of canvas anymore, and haven't been for decades... I remember the GP Medium... I've been in service for 30 years, and every piece of kit I have now is vastly superior to what I had as a brand new Ranger gunner going to Panama. It works better, lasts longer, is more effective or efficient, weighs less....

Back to the car. You're trying to cram a small truck's (shortbox Taco) worth of stuff into a micro car. Spacious notwithstanding, will it handle the weight? All of you're "old school" kit weights a ton.... a Jeep would give you vastly more space and capability- but its still a modern Jeep, not the most reliable vehicle on the road. A smaller truck, like a Tacoma, offers tons of space, and great capabilities.... a 4Runner is a bit less space, but fully enclosed- a micro RV. Both are far more reliable than either a Jeep or a Mini...
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  #5  
Old 04-03-2020, 03:59 PM
bradsvette bradsvette is offline
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That would be the most extensive bug-out kit I've ever heard of. Especially for a small car. I would think in terms of scenario vice carrying every piece of camping equipment you can throw in there. If you live in a city, you must be able to first escape to a safe area. I'd want a recent tune-up on the car, a full tank of fuel, good tires, water, a battle rifle, ammo, and body armor. Next, where will you go? Think about what you'd need there. What if you have to abandon the car? What can you physically carry? A pull-cart might be advisable. First priority is getting to safety.
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2020, 04:07 PM
USMM guy USMM guy is online now
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I thought that Mini Coopers were bug out kits!

But seriously, cover your basics. Food, water, and shelter. Then go from there. Ask yourself what you actually need. And what is in the nice to have luxury kit?

What kind of budget do you have. If you have a generous budget, or even if you do not. Buy quality gear, cry once be done with it. Also be efficient. You mention a rubber mallet for pounding in stakes. Well fine but there is not much else you can use a rubber mallet for. Instead I would get a small hatchet that has a hammer head on the backside. Same size and weight and much more useful.

A small battery powered radio would be nice. A suppressed .22 rimfire pistol and ammo would be useful. Clothing would be a whole chapter by itself. Fire making gear. signalling mirror. Forget about the Canvass tent, get a synthetic one. Do not neglect hygiene and first aid. a couple of extra quarts of oil for the car. Cooking gear. It can be daunting. Take your time and think about it.
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  #7  
Old 04-03-2020, 05:12 PM
HarryO45 HarryO45 is offline
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You use a pistol to fight your way to a rifle. You use a mini to drive yourself to a Ford dealership - F150 FX4
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  #8  
Old 04-03-2020, 05:56 PM
chrysanthemum chrysanthemum is offline
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Plans that involve a massive re-ordering of a person's life, including survival activities that person has not engaged in for decades -- or never -- are dicey.

It's one thing to go into an "off the grid" survival mode if one has past experience, training, skills, etc. But for someone without that (experience, training, skills), a shelter-in-place strategy or shelter-in-second-home strategy might be better.

IOW, any bug-out kit needs to be matched with what the individual can reasonably utilize (with their skills).

But everyone's circumstances are different...and thus one's own judgement is what must be relied upon.
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Last edited by chrysanthemum; 04-03-2020 at 06:01 PM.
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  #9  
Old 04-03-2020, 06:10 PM
John Joseph John Joseph is offline
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I have a canvas miner's tent. Easy to pitch. Plenty of room. Canvas tents are heavy and take up a lot of room though.
You can get internal frames for wall tents, but that also takes up a lot of additional room.
For the long haul I'd prefer a wall tent with an extended rain fly for a "porch"

With minimum space being a consideration, a high end three man Kelty or Big Agnes dome would be nice for camping.

For a bug out situation just get a blue plastic tarp. You'll fit right in with all the homeless street people. Get a big enough tarp and you can hide your Mini under it as well.
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  #10  
Old 04-04-2020, 01:22 PM
Old Grey Hare Old Grey Hare is offline
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Heh well, first things first.. thank you all for your input.

Yeah, I like the old. I do realize the New is better (this is why I drive a 2013 Mini, not a 1963 Mini.. tho the old one had twice the room and is half the size o.O) My 1911 is from 2019. The M1 can't be helped, they don't make 'em anymore. My lever gun was made the day of the impeachment phone call. Im not 100% oldster, y'know

I am planning a war wagon. But again, it'll be old.. EMP proof, really, is what I mean. No ECU, mechanical everything. Which means it'll break all the time, I remember points and condenser ignitions. I had in mind a jeep, or a bronco or something like that. THen this thing snuck up on me, and I must make do with what I have. But the war wagon is still on the drawing board. I need a bigger car, that's for sure. Even going to the range with long guns in the mini is a process. A little short carbine fits in the trunk no sweat, but that M1? HAH! Gotta fold down the seat for that one. Get a towel to cover it, because surely a man in a car with a long gun in the car is up to no good.

I'm still going through all this in my mind and on paper. Believe it not the kit I outlined above does fit in the car. Question is do I need all that.

Then, as some of you point out.. go minimalist. Which I'm also considering. Ultramodern tent, sleeping bag, food and water for a week, call it a day.

The Kodiak, just for info, is 30" x 12" rolled up, 35 pounds. That's with the poles in the bag too.

I think I'll end up with a compromise -- put together a minimal kit right now, and get the fancy canvas tent later. I'm dead-nuts serious about getting back to camping, just to get away from everything on long weekends or whatnot. Plenty of camping opportunities around here.

City life has made me soft.
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  #11  
Old 04-04-2020, 01:29 PM
bradsvette bradsvette is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryO45 View Post
You use a pistol to fight your way to a rifle. You use a mini to drive yourself to a Ford dealership - F150 FX4
LOL. I think the Old Grey Hare lives in the city though. The Mini is definitely easier to park. But I guess with a 150 or a big 250 one could just plow over the other cars.

Last edited by bradsvette; 04-04-2020 at 01:34 PM.
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  #12  
Old 04-04-2020, 03:21 PM
Amos Iron Wolf Amos Iron Wolf is offline
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That's what I like about my Nissan NV200 mini-cargo van. Besides the 5 year/100K bumper to bumper warranty that I extended to 6 year/120K. I can get more in the back of the van than I can a small pickup, the distance to the deck is lower, and it already has a cover. And... It gets a little better mileage than my Juke NISMO did.

I keep a camp/emergency box in there and a sleeping bag or two outside the box. A couple of ways to make fire, a couple more ways to sterilize water, FAK, etc.. I have a full sized cooler and one of those plastic tubs the same size for grocery runs. It makes it easier to carry in the tub and roll in the cooler with all the groceries in one place. The tub can also double as a water container for collecting, sterilizing, and storing water in an emergency. The cooler as well once any cool packs have given up all the cool.

I have a small 400 watt inverter in there, but I'd like to go to a little bigger one. I've actually used to inverter and a air/vacuum pump to inflate/deflate two of those twin size air mattresses (the heavy blue ones) they roll up to a fairly small roll. Not tiny, but easily tucked. Up front is a 25 watt mini-sized 2m/70CM ham radio.

I can haul stuff, sleep in it, shoot from it, and live in if it came to that. Plus, being white it looks like many of the other commercial vans running around. I could even have some magnetic signs made up of different companies or fictitious one if I wanted to really have it blend in. Maybe something like "Sam's Sewer Cleaning." That would probably make a lot of people much less curious about what's inside. LOL.

OP. Start reading forums and blogs about ultralight backpacking. Those folks have it down for going minimal, lightweight, compact, and still being protected from the elements and staying warm. Tents, stoves, sleeping bags, cooking gear, they know how to shave the ounces and still enjoy the trip. There are probably many videos on YouTube about such things. Heck, there are probably videos about people living full time out of their Minis.

I would suggest that if you really expect to fish for some food, start now. Get your license, fit either a collapsable or breakdown rod/reel kit and find some places to fish. Learn about handline kits. If you haven't hunted for years, you probably won't eat well trying to do it when things have gone south. A lot of people say that, but if every wannabe nimrod is bashing around game is going to get scarce faster than toilet paper in a panic. The dumber animals will get killed of quick, the smarter ones will change up and be very hard to find. With all the idiots banging around the bush it will be hard even for savvy hunters to score. First shot and it will be like loud noise in a zombie flick. Everyone within earshot is heading your way.

When I lived in Alaska I had a trucker who ran the haul road tell me his trick for collecting wolves to sell their fur while on the road. He would find a place to pull off and wait for another truck to pass him. Then he would start using his dying rabbit call. He got quite a few wolves that way. They would hear the truck go by and then the squealing rabbit and to them it was a dinner bell. They had learned from experience to associate the sound of the truck followed by a distressed animal as something got hit and was an easy kill or just a fresh scavenge if it was dead by the time they got there. Expect the same from people. Hence the suggestion of a few for a suppressed .22 LR. Subsonic rounds of course.

Decades ago Tom Brown, wrote a book on urban survival. See if you can find an old copy. Some good information in there. I still have a copy somewhere around.

The more stuff you have the more you have to keep up with it and the longer it takes to set up and tear down.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:42 PM
sambob sambob is offline
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Originally Posted by Old Grey Hare View Post
I've been mulling a tent for a while, a two-person canvas tent. Mainly to get back to camping, which I haven't done in forever.. 30+ years. Then there's the distinct possibility of losing the house to a number of things.. disaster, civil unrest.. joblessness.. the list goes on.

But this Corona situation has made me think I better get a move on this plan. This one could bring all of it and more, within the next month or three, I think. If we make it to August we should be OK. Til the next one. Or we could be fighting in the streets in another month. Who knows.

I have very limited room in my car.. it's a Mini (ok, you all may laugh now. But I'm not a mountain man, I'm a low-density city dweller, so I needed the land equivalent of a Zero.)

But like a Zero, a mini's tight.. and I'm solo, I have no family, they're all dead. I have a few friends here and there, but who knows if in time of a real SHTF we can link up.

The linchpin will be the tent. I was considering a two-man canvas A-Frame, but being solo, those aren't the easiest to put up. So then there's Springbar and Kodiak. Both make 4' tall 8x6' 2-man canvas tents of modern design and will fit in a mini with rear seats down. I'm leaning to Kodiak for a number of reasons, despite them being made in China. And yes, that it's made in China *burns* me.

I want a nice canvas tent and not an "emergency" nylon shelter. I could do weeks.. months... year+ in a good tent. I've lived the tent life.. when I was 12. And a bit more in the military, but one can't compare a GP tent with a 2-man tent...

So.. tent. My guns. First-aid kit. Light, heat. Sheets, army blankets, cot, etc. I have about 5 gallons of kero and a few Dietz / Kirkman lanterns. A table and chair. AM/FM/SW radio. Some kind of way of making power (solar / inverter). LED lighting makes solar charging practical.

Camp tools such as axe and machete - i have plenty knives but need ax/machete. Big brass / deadhead rubber hammer for tent stakes.

Field mess kit, wood camp stove.

Fishing gear. Oh god I've never fished a fish in my life. Never cleaned one, coooked one. Last rabbit I got for myself and dressed was 30+ years ago. Can I still do that? I don't remember *how*.

Spares for guns.. springs, firing pins, that kinda thing. Cleaning gear. Knife-care stuff. Oh and an AR-7. That's a gap in my shootin' irons.. I have nothing for squirrel / rabbit. Well maybe the .45

Flag (US and Gadsden) and halyard to fly them.

Perimeter wire alarm, store-bought or improvised.

All I mentioned should fit in the Mini... if I'm the sole occupant. Everything will be camp-style; folding canvas/nylon and such.

I'm I over thinking this? Or is my abandoning what little faith I had left in humanity the right thing during these times? I don't trust the system anymore.. not just the gov't, I trust *none* of it now.

I fully expect I'll have to stand alone if SHTF in an epic, 1918 way.
Well removing the rear and front passenger seats would give you more room IF It's just going to be you.
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:28 PM
The War Wagon The War Wagon is online now
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Cool

A) stuff little car to the gills



B) shove it INSIDE my truck.

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Old 04-04-2020, 05:36 PM
Sistema1927 Sistema1927 is offline
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Sounds like you need a trailer.







In order to tow the Mini behind an RV.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:59 PM
shooter59 shooter59 is offline
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One of the big issues with the ‘bug out’ crowd, is the fact that many don’t own a working deuce and a half. Seriously, some have so much ****, they couldn’t get it loaded into anything in a week by themselves.

Look to the backpacking/mountaineering world. I’ve backpacked first 50+ years, and finally retired from mountaineering on a serious scale 10-15 years ago.

Properly equipped, everything you need to live fairly comfortably for 7-10 days at a time, you can carry. Including a couple of lightweight firearms, with lightweight ammunition.

Three serious limiting factors are your fitness level, knowledge about using said equipment, and water.

Most places in North America, a top notch water filter will be fine, so then fitness and knowledge are paramount.

Personally, the entire ‘bug out, meet family and friends at the rally point, and start constructing camp’ is seriously flawed anyway. I’m going to hang on to my solid roof and walls unless they disintegrate, but being able to tote what I need to live for up to a couple weeks with my boots and back are appealing. But then I’ve been doing it since I was a child.

Just one idea, but for such limited space, I’d suggest it as a possibility to consider.

Last edited by dsk; 04-04-2020 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:39 PM
OZ 1911 OZ 1911 is offline
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Mini emergency sleeping vehicle not good - did it once on the south east coast in England.
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:14 PM
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Flight Medic Flight Medic is offline
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Originally Posted by Old Grey Hare View Post
<snip>I have very limited room in my car.. it's a Mini</snip>
I believe the recommended bug-out bag for that vehicle is a fanny pack!!
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Old 04-05-2020, 09:31 AM
scubadad scubadad is offline
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I believe the recommended bug-out bag for that vehicle is a fanny pack!!
Did you really just use the word fanny

I am not so worried about bugging out as I already live on a farm in the country. For me I carry a get home bag. I never venture far so it is light

Gun/ammo
small first aid kit
knife and multi tool
duct tape and para cord
3 days of essential meds
box of granola bars and water
small tarp
roll of tp

I always wear boots that are capable of a long hike (even if I am not) and there is always an extra blanket and jacket in the car stored in one of those vacuum bags.
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Old 04-05-2020, 09:46 AM
45acpskng 45acpskng is offline
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Bud, if SHTF like you're thinking, you'll need to be mobile, constantly on the move. Tent=Target! Buy ammo & mags, a GOOD knife, if you're in the Northeast/Northwest, water won't be a problem. Good Luck Rambo!
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Old 04-05-2020, 11:26 AM
shooter59 shooter59 is offline
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Bud, if SHTF like you're thinking, you'll need to be mobile, constantly on the move. Tent=Target! Buy ammo & mags, a GOOD knife, if you're in the Northeast/Northwest, water won't be a problem. Good Luck Rambo!
That’s hilarious!&#x1f602;&#x1f602;&#x1f602;&#x1f602;&#x1 f602;&#x1f602;
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Old 04-05-2020, 01:03 PM
Old Grey Hare Old Grey Hare is offline
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Bud, if SHTF like you're thinking, you'll need to be mobile, constantly on the move. Tent=Target! Buy ammo & mags, a GOOD knife, if you're in the Northeast/Northwest, water won't be a problem. Good Luck Rambo!
I"m somewhat of a prepper. Comes from growing up and living in hurricane country. Got guns, ammo, good blades, water, food, TP, a means to cook, 5 gal kero, lanterns, etc -- all of that right now. Enough for about 3 months (ammo for about 3 years ;o)

It's the shelter that I'm dithering on, but I"m now starting to think just as you say -- light, mobile.

When I wrote the post, I was thinking a bit more fixed -- bug out to some remote location and stay there for weeks.

I'd like to think I am better prepared than Rambo. All he had was that knife, and the duffel bag on his back. But then, Rambo was a professional solider, I forgot what he was.. Ranger or what.. I'm soft ex-Air Force, for us a calamity is having the cable out or a broken AC ;o)
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Old 04-05-2020, 02:42 PM
Twofinger Twofinger is offline
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I agree, pandemic is no reason to panic, nor is it end of society. I also think preppers have been somewhat validated and will use this to make sure wife and I can withstand a few weeks without Starbucks.

IMO for most of us staying in place is the best move. You have nominal control of the property, people know you and your community will usually be your allies. You can also fill up your bathtub and everything else that will hold water and not have to worry about moving 400lbs of water. You can also stock up on medical supplies, again, not worry about making hard choices of what to leave behind if you run out of gas. (Gasoline lasts only months before it goes bad, by the way. How long is function of temp, humidity etc)

I suggest your bug-out bag be a bug-in bag, that is, it gets you back home.

If you are really serious about this, the best advice I can give is go search out forums where war has struck civilized societies. Bosnia, and eastern Ukraine have some excellent observations of life in civil unrest.
Some things that stuck out to me:
#1 thing is never let others know what you have. You will be attacked. Look very poor.
A lot of people are going to go into non-urban areas to find food, most will not be successful. Unless you have something already prepared in the country, there are probably too many risks and not enough resources to try to do "survival" in the bush, especially if you have no experience.
"Gangs of New York" will eventually form. That is if you are independent, you will be overwhelmed by groups of 10-50 armed people. You can't hole up, sustain yourself or pull the trigger fast enough to not be overwhelmed. You NEED allies. Forums say family and close friends are overwhelmingly best.
Many people suffer, lose survival ability or die from relatively minor peacetime issues, broken bones, infected wounds, especially bad water and lack of modern meds. Disease will take as many as bullets will. So stock up.

Buy water jugs to supplement your bathtub and have a rain catching system, the blue tarp, perhaps.
Have a way to make and sustain fire. Wood will go quick.

Cigarettes, meds, booze and ammo are proxies for currency, and there will be opportunities to swap, but getting to and from the "market" is fraught with peril and most will only be able to go after dark, and in groups of 2-4, armed. One does the trade, others are insurance.

If you insist on moving around two things: consider taking a bicycle and ways to lash stuff to it. Never forget the NVA/VC won the war by carrying darn near everything down from the north on bicycles. Second if any survival situation goes past months into years, most of the high tech will go by the wayside. I think the only exception is (according to the forums) cell phone service was limited, but still sometimes available.

Last edited by Twofinger; 04-05-2020 at 02:50 PM.
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Old 04-05-2020, 05:52 PM
TRSOtto TRSOtto is online now
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Having lived in the woods in a tent for 47 days, I'll tell you.....it ain't easy WITHOUT civil unrest. And I still needed weekly supply trips. Add in civil unrest....having to defend yourself and your belongings from 360 degrees 24/7....nope.

Water water and more water is what you need. Whatever you THINK you need on a daily basis. Rethink it....it ain't enough. And water is NOT mobile for those who plan on living out of s backpack. It's heavy. Damn heavy.

Honestly, I question why Anyone thinks they are better off bugging out than you are in staying home. A home is secure and defensible. A tent.....not in the least.

And you guys who think you can get by without a tent......or some other rainproof structure..... you're dreaming. Wet = cold. Cold + wet = miserable. Go live in a tent for a month with ONLY what you can pack in. Try it. Hell.....most won't make it a week. If you make it a month....you'll need a trip to the pharmacy for your meds.

The whole bugout thing is a fantasy created by the prepper industry. Pure fantasy.
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  #25  
Old 04-05-2020, 07:28 PM
TRX302 TRX302 is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,000
Remove the passenger seat and the back seat and you'll have a lot more room.

I used a 1986 Ford Escort as an ersatz truck for a while. I could set a fully assembled big block Ford on the passenger floor using the shop crane. The rear door openings were too small, but there was a whole lot of "stuff" room with the cushions out.

The seats just unbolt. Take them out once for practice, trial fit your "stuff", then put them back. Twenty minute and they can be back out again, depending on how awkward the bolts are to get to.
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