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  #26  
Old 12-17-2017, 10:35 AM
Autonomous Autonomous is offline
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In my experience SA CS is absolutely top notch.

I'd like to hear their side of the story.
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  #27  
Old 12-17-2017, 11:04 AM
noose noose is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amati View Post
Never spoken with her, my calls over the last 4 years were handled by Amanda and lately Debbie who are both not only extremely polite and helpful but also extremely knowledgeable about all technical issues. Pleasure to talk with them, I'd love to buy them a beer.

People who complain about SA Custom are the kinds of people that make me change tables at a restaurant.
LOL! I didn't exactly buy them a beer, but I sent a LARGE box of assorted chocolate truffles for their customer service/repair team. Hopefully the receiving clerk(s) didn't consume it all. I did email one CS rep to make sure they were aware they were coming.
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  #28  
Old 12-17-2017, 11:24 AM
Amati Amati is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noose View Post
LOL! I didn't exactly buy them a beer, but I sent a LARGE box of assorted chocolate truffles for their customer service/repair team. Hopefully the receiving clerk(s) didn't consume it all. I did email one CS rep to make sure they were aware they were coming.
Richly deserved and I'll follow suit.
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  #29  
Old 12-17-2017, 07:14 PM
passx passx is offline
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I’ll second noose’s comments in that i’ve dealt with Penne and Debbie both, great ladies imho.
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  #30  
Old 12-17-2017, 07:38 PM
Big Orange 83 Big Orange 83 is offline
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I bought a RO Compact a few months ago and after shooting it on my first range trip had to send it back for work.. Yes the customer service is excellent. In fact from the day I shipped it out to the day it was back in my hands was 14 days. BUT I sent it back because 1. it shot 3 inches high at 10 yards. 2. the trigger had alot of creep in it(they replaced sear and adjusted spring). 3. slide to frame fit was not impressive. 4. when assembly of the gun I could not get the slide stop to slide in easily, so they modified it for easy installation. 5. I had them pin the ejector. I LOVE this gun now it shoots fantastic but for $800 I should not have to send it back for multiple issues.. I can see 1 issue here and there but the amount of problems mine had imo is unacceptable.
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  #31  
Old 12-17-2017, 08:42 PM
cindynles cindynles is offline
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I have a recently produced (2017) TRP. No quality issues (other than normal SA issues) to speak of.
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  #32  
Old 12-17-2017, 09:06 PM
Shawn13Thomas Shawn13Thomas is offline
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Just bought a new mil spec in October, shoots wonderfully
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  #33  
Old 12-18-2017, 01:03 AM
monadh monadh is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noose View Post
I just can't understand how people call into SA and say that their experience was bad. Get what you give?
I understand people have their preferences based on their experiences or impressions, and it is further understood that those can influence their assumptions. Yours here appears to be that my experience with SA was bad enough to have made me treat the people I with whom spoke poorly, and if that is correct, you are speaking in ignorance based on a bias.

Here is what has formed my own impression of Springfield.

I bought a TRP which was on of the best, most accurate pistols I have ever seen. This is a 50 yard group I had shot with it from a rest. It is 5 rounds.



Based on that, I placed my order for a Professional and used my favorite gun store as the "ship to". When I ordered (in the 2013 time frame) I was given a great price because of my LGS and told it would be 36 months to delivery. 36 months was fine with me.

In the intervening time, I bought a LW Champion Operator because my TRP was so good. The Ch Op was also a very accurate pistol. So accurate, in fact, that I was able to hit a standing arrow at 50 yards off hand and win a bet with my daughter.



I called into SA to let them know how well their pistols were performing for me and asked if they could track down the person(s) who had made my TRP so they could sign the paper plate. I was told nope, it was made by a team, and we don't know who made your TRP. But, they were so happy that I was letting them know about the performance, they sent me a couple of free hats, a coffee mug, and the SA polo type shirt. That was great PR and a great response.

The only problem with it (and the TRP) was that the finish was not very durable. Using the included holster (which was a mistake I freely admit, but who would have thought the finish would wear so easily?). I called SA custom and spoke to Dave and explained what happened. I asked about having it refinished on my own dime to something durable. He steered me toward melonite. I figured he knew what he was talking about, so I sent it in July 2015. Turn around time was supposed to be about 6 weeks. When it had not shown up nor had I received an update, I called mid October and was told it would be mid November before it might come back. It beat that by a week or so. The durable melonite finish began to show wear after just a few months of careful carrying in a Milt Sparks VMII. I didn't send it back because why bother. I would be accused of using their provided holster.

I continued to wait on my Pro and decided to buy a RO Champion 9mm. It was a nice pistol, but I never could get it to group consistently I figured it was just me and that for some reason I could shoot the TRP and the LW Ch Op well but not the RO.

It was during this time, roughly 2 years, that Springfield had a price change on the Pro. Thirty one months into the wait, I called SA to check status on my order. I was told that I would not be receiving my Pro because they had tried to call my cell (the only number they had for me), left a message, and I had failed to respond, so no Pro for you. I questioned whether or not they had called me and told the lady such. I looked at my cell phone records and there was no phone call from SA at all. I told her that they had no called me, I had proof, and that I expected to be put back on the list for a Pro. She checked and told me I could get back on the list but they would not honor the original price. I made it politely clear that this was wrong, and I expected them to honor the agreed upon price. After more consultation on her side, they agreed to reinstate my order at the agreed upon price.

Some months go by, and the LGS calls me to tell me that my Pro is ready to be shipped to them, and the price was far more expensive than our agreed upon price. They told me the SA rep had told them there was no way they would honor the original price, even though I had an invoice from them. I told the LGS to tell the SA rep to keep his Pro. Thirty one months of waiting for nothing.

I e-mailed Deb, the person I had originally spoken with, and let her know all that had transpired, and that it was deceptive of them to agree to a price and then not honor it. I told her how disappointed I was at the way SA had treated me, I would never buy another Springfield, and that I had taken the money I had for the Pro and bought a custom Dan Wesson. It took her only a little while to get back with me and ask me to call her to discuss, she would make it right. I told her again it was too late, and that I had taken my business elsewhere. She replied that she wished I had spoken to her before doing anything. I replied that I wished they had lived up to our agreement.

I bought a Mil Spec (which is PERFECT) and RO 9mm when I had to send a Colt in for repair, and it was a terrible pistol. The RO misfed badly, shot huge 12 yard groups, and nothing could sort it out. I called SA to send it back, and they were nice about it, but when I thought further I decided to get rid of the RO Champion and the RO. Springfield would not get any more money from me.

Yeah, I have had bad experiences with SA and their pistols, and I will assure you, no person at SA got butthurt from anything I said.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amati View Post
People who complain about SA Custom are the kinds of people that make me change tables at a restaurant.
Please feel free to move to one in the corner.
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Last edited by monadh; 12-18-2017 at 07:46 AM.
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  #34  
Old 12-18-2017, 06:24 AM
Billy1911 Billy1911 is offline
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Monadh :
Your right up is very clear and well written . I do not type that well . I'am also
a big fanboy of Springfield pistols both stock and custom . Now this is where I
will agree with you SA CS in both departments have been hit or miss with me
as well . Your Pro experience was close to mine in the fact I had to go back and
forth on price after waiting 31 months after it was ordered in 2014 well before the
price increase . It should have been an easy fix , but it was not . It took a
month and a half of back and forth to fix and yes it did get fixed in the end
OK I say nothing is perfect , things happen I say to myself . Move on .

I know when I talked to Amanda in the past or David things have gone very
smooth . Amanda now works in a different department which I think is a big
loss to SACS as far as CS . Stock SA CS has always been good to me as far as
taking care of my needs and being friendly doing it . Now getting back to SACS
I will say this , I have left a detailed voicemail message and I have yet to receive
a reply back . That was after weeks of trying to get through and its been weeks
since leaving the message , disappointing to say the least . I have since
found a smith to take care of the issues I needed taken care of , Yes I
could have waited then sent more messages by Email and by phone but
part of me says why can't my first message just be returned and why do
I as a customer have to make multiple attemps to make contact . I will
say I'am not angry , just very disappointed as someone who has spent
a good amount of money with SACS over the years and someone who
has worked in CS . So I know what a hard job it can be at times . So I
understand peoples frustration . Yes it should be simple at least contacting
customers back or taking their phone calls to say the least . I also want to
make this clear SACS and SA CS are two different departments independent
of one another and this is not a quality issue . Its a CS issue .

Bill
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Last edited by Billy1911; 12-18-2017 at 04:59 PM.
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  #35  
Old 12-18-2017, 07:38 AM
Chipperchoi Chipperchoi is offline
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My EMP 4, I would give it a 95/100 from a quality stand point.

There were a few feeding hiccups at the beginning due to rough feed ramp but that was a quick fix with some polish and some elbow grease.

The finish on it was a good not great. There were chatter marks from the machining around the slide barrel opening that I took a stone to polish out. Also had all these scratch marks on the face of the slide.

Overall nothing damaging or functional but purely cosmetic. that being said, I love my EMP 4 now. Great shooting handgun that makes me look good against all the Glocks in my classes.
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  #36  
Old 12-18-2017, 07:55 AM
Amati Amati is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipperchoi View Post
The finish on it was a good not great. There were chatter marks from the machining around the slide barrel opening that I took a stone to polish out. Also had all these scratch marks on the face of the slide.
We were just discussing your post and we were all wondering if this was a NIB purchase and in the affirmative why you completed the purchase since all these imperfections must have been visible to you as soon as you took the gun in your hands.
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  #37  
Old 12-18-2017, 08:14 AM
Chipperchoi Chipperchoi is offline
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I should have checked it more thoroughly for sure. The rest of the pistol was spotless and I didn't think to check the muzzle end.

The chatter marks were hidden by the barrel and didn't see until I broke the gun down. As for the scratches, I didn't really think to check as I didn't want to stare down the barrel at the store. lol
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  #38  
Old 12-18-2017, 09:07 AM
noose noose is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monadh View Post
I understand people have their preferences based on their experiences or impressions, and it is further understood that those can influence their assumptions. Yours here appears to be that my experience with SA was bad enough to have made me treat the people I with whom spoke poorly, and if that is correct, you are speaking in ignorance based on a bias.
I don't think you read both of my posts... In mine prior to your quote, I said "There's only so much verbal abuse one person can take. I'm not saying you did that but always remember you are talking to a human being on the other end. Maybe a wife, mother, husband..."

I made no such assumption and I'm sorry if your experiences have been less than stellar. Mine have always been. Literally for years.
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  #39  
Old 12-18-2017, 10:12 AM
GRPfan GRPfan is offline
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Following up Post #7 -- put another 150 rounds through it, Federal aluminum cased 230 grain ball fodder, using some new Tripp Research Cobra mags, and again, zero malfunctions. So I stopped at 350 rounds of flawless operations, not one bobble, figured shooting more would just be wasting ammo. I packed it up and sent to John Harrison for a trigger job on the existing parts, relieving the VIS for barrel feet contact, and fitting one of his FP Stops.

Gun is phenomenal. I am sorry to hear about a few years of QC issues, and my experience with one gun recently made doesn't prove it's up to snuff, of course, but this PX9110ML (MC Operator) was perfect out of the box.

As for customer service, Deb has always been prompt and professional on the infrequent occasions I've corresponded with her. I must admit, monadh's experience is horrifying. I'm sure Deb would have probably made it right, based on my infrequent dealings with her, but I cannot faule monadh's decision one bit. You give a firm so many strikes and they're out. What a shame.

I would buy another current production SA 1911 without hesitation based on my new gun, though.
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Last edited by GRPfan; 12-18-2017 at 10:14 AM.
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  #40  
Old 12-18-2017, 10:18 AM
Amati Amati is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipperchoi View Post
Also had all these scratch marks on the face of the slide.
You got us scratching our collective heads in puzzlement as we understand the "face of the slide" to be the single most easily visible surface of the pistol. Are we misunderstanding something?
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  #41  
Old 12-18-2017, 10:24 AM
Chipperchoi Chipperchoi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amati View Post
You got us scratching our collective heads in puzzlement as we understand the "face of the slide" to be the single most easily visible surface of the pistol. Are we misunderstanding something?
The muzzle end of the slide.
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  #42  
Old 12-18-2017, 12:16 PM
bad2006z71 bad2006z71 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monadh View Post
I understand people have their preferences based on their experiences or impressions, and it is further understood that those can influence their assumptions. Yours here appears to be that my experience with SA was bad enough to have made me treat the people I with whom spoke poorly, and if that is correct, you are speaking in ignorance based on a bias.

Here is what has formed my own impression of Springfield.

I bought a TRP which was on of the best, most accurate pistols I have ever seen. This is a 50 yard group I had shot with it from a rest. It is 5 rounds.



Based on that, I placed my order for a Professional and used my favorite gun store as the "ship to". When I ordered (in the 2013 time frame) I was given a great price because of my LGS and told it would be 36 months to delivery. 36 months was fine with me.

In the intervening time, I bought a LW Champion Operator because my TRP was so good. The Ch Op was also a very accurate pistol. So accurate, in fact, that I was able to hit a standing arrow at 50 yards off hand and win a bet with my daughter.



I called into SA to let them know how well their pistols were performing for me and asked if they could track down the person(s) who had made my TRP so they could sign the paper plate. I was told nope, it was made by a team, and we don't know who made your TRP. But, they were so happy that I was letting them know about the performance, they sent me a couple of free hats, a coffee mug, and the SA polo type shirt. That was great PR and a great response.

The only problem with it (and the TRP) was that the finish was not very durable. Using the included holster (which was a mistake I freely admit, but who would have thought the finish would wear so easily?). I called SA custom and spoke to Dave and explained what happened. I asked about having it refinished on my own dime to something durable. He steered me toward melonite. I figured he knew what he was talking about, so I sent it in July 2015. Turn around time was supposed to be about 6 weeks. When it had not shown up nor had I received an update, I called mid October and was told it would be mid November before it might come back. It beat that by a week or so. The durable melonite finish began to show wear after just a few months of careful carrying in a Milt Sparks VMII. I didn't send it back because why bother. I would be accused of using their provided holster.

I continued to wait on my Pro and decided to buy a RO Champion 9mm. It was a nice pistol, but I never could get it to group consistently I figured it was just me and that for some reason I could shoot the TRP and the LW Ch Op well but not the RO.

It was during this time, roughly 2 years, that Springfield had a price change on the Pro. Thirty one months into the wait, I called SA to check status on my order. I was told that I would not be receiving my Pro because they had tried to call my cell (the only number they had for me), left a message, and I had failed to respond, so no Pro for you. I questioned whether or not they had called me and told the lady such. I looked at my cell phone records and there was no phone call from SA at all. I told her that they had no called me, I had proof, and that I expected to be put back on the list for a Pro. She checked and told me I could get back on the list but they would not honor the original price. I made it politely clear that this was wrong, and I expected them to honor the agreed upon price. After more consultation on her side, they agreed to reinstate my order at the agreed upon price.

Some months go by, and the LGS calls me to tell me that my Pro is ready to be shipped to them, and the price was far more expensive than our agreed upon price. They told me the SA rep had told them there was no way they would honor the original price, even though I had an invoice from them. I told the LGS to tell the SA rep to keep his Pro. Thirty one months of waiting for nothing.

I e-mailed Deb, the person I had originally spoken with, and let her know all that had transpired, and that it was deceptive of them to agree to a price and then not honor it. I told her how disappointed I was at the way SA had treated me, I would never buy another Springfield, and that I had taken the money I had for the Pro and bought a custom Dan Wesson. It took her only a little while to get back with me and ask me to call her to discuss, she would make it right. I told her again it was too late, and that I had taken my business elsewhere. She replied that she wished I had spoken to her before doing anything. I replied that I wished they had lived up to our agreement.

I bought a Mil Spec (which is PERFECT) and RO 9mm when I had to send a Colt in for repair, and it was a terrible pistol. The RO misfed badly, shot huge 12 yard groups, and nothing could sort it out. I called SA to send it back, and they were nice about it, but when I thought further I decided to get rid of the RO Champion and the RO. Springfield would not get any more money from me.

Yeah, I have had bad experiences with SA and their pistols, and I will assure you, no person at SA got butthurt from anything I said.



Please feel free to move to one in the corner.
What they did to you on your Pro was retarded. If you have a deposit on an agreed upon price, then that is the price you should have to pay.

-I have only had 3 issues with my 12 or so SA pistols. A N marked loaded that wouldn't group worth a sh*t, SA fixed it correctly no questions asked.

-My CO 45 was shooting low, they took it back and replaced the front sight, no questions asked.

-My first LBO had so many internal machining marks that the gun just felt rough, shot well though. SA did nothing.

A fourth thing was simply my nit pickyness, my RO 45, which went through their custom shop, had a very loose slide/frame fit (though it shot well), and well, after owning a tight as heck Baer and well fit DW's, just felt like crap. I sent it in fully expecting them to laugh and return it, but the refit the slide and replaced the barrel and bushing, no questions asked.

Overall I have been please with the SA 1911's I have purchased, my tastes have since gravitated to DW and Les Baer.

Outside of the CO guns, SA offers nothing out of the box that I am interested in and the gutting of the Custom Shop was the nail in the coffin.
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  #43  
Old 12-18-2017, 01:15 PM
fj40 fj40 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bad2006z71 View Post

SA offers nothing out of the box that I am interested in and the gutting of the Custom Shop was the nail in the coffin.
I was interested in a PRO until they raised the price where it is now in Guncrafter, Nighthawk, or Wilson price range. I'd rather get exactly what I want at this price range.
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  #44  
Old 12-18-2017, 01:29 PM
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AZ Husker AZ Husker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mwilburt View Post
I work at a popular gun store in central Virginia. We sell Springfield 1911's and their entire line of poly-frame guns.
We have experienced NO issues with Springfield quality.

On those very rare occasions when we've sent a customer's 1911 or poly gun to Springfield for service, the work is done quickly and the problem solved successfully.
Which is it???
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  #45  
Old 12-19-2017, 05:53 AM
Billy1911 Billy1911 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bad2006z71 View Post
What they did to you on your Pro was retarded. If you have a deposit on an agreed upon price, then that is the price you should have to pay.

Yes it should be that simple . What I think happened was after the Price
increase announcement in June or July of 2015 , Every custom shop pistol
that left the shop got charged the extra 500.00 regardless of when the
pistol was ordered . When it should have just been tacked on to every pistol
ordered after the price increase . Not a very good business practice . Sell
a pistol for one price , then bump the price up 500.00 12 months into the
24 to 30 month waiting period .

Its kind of like having a 100% backed warranty . So you call for 4 weeks
in Oct/Nov on friday's because that is your day off and are told 3 of the 4 that
no one is their to answer the phone . Then on the 4th week your put into
voice mail . You leave a message and know one ever calls you back . How
good is a 100% warranty if know one is there to help you ?

Yes these are some of the things Springfield needs to address because you
can't make this stuff up . Does every company make mistakes , Sure . But
they also need to know about problems to fix them . At no time during
regular business hours should their ever be know one to answer calls .Even
if they are on vacation someone should be there to at least say , let me take
a message and is it ok if someone gets back to you in two weeks . This is
not the first time calling the custom shop of being kicked to voice mail then
not being called back . Yes that is a problem .
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SA Lipsey's 9mm Combat Operator /SACS-RO Champion / SACS -Mod Longslide / SACS TGO-1 / SACS Professional w/rail / SA TRP / Wilson CQB / Kimber CDP II / HK P30L / DW Target .
Lots and Lots of plastic army men with a Guns of Navarone play set / A huge Star Wars Clone Army fighting with the Jedi Pre-order 66
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  #46  
Old 12-19-2017, 08:43 AM
noose noose is offline
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I'm going to add this to the "discussion". I'm sure SA has and will continue to occasionally mis-step. Compare that to other makers, however. Very few have a lifetime warranty and very few again will fix something that was bought used.

I have a browning pistol I bought new not 2 months ago and I can't get ANYONE on the phone. I managed to get a receptionist after holding for a while yesterday but I've held for a service tech twice for about an hour with no luck. The first time the phone just hung up after a long wait. Maybe a timeout... I don't know. The second time I was on hold for about 45 minutes and then the phone looped back around at 4:07 to tell me that they were now closed and promptly ended my hold at about the 52 minute mark.

I'm going to start early today and leave it on hold at my desk while I work. This the other extreme. I don't expect them to have any answers or make any attempt to fix my issues much less pay shipping both ways and do it in a reasonable amount of time. We'll see, I guess.
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  #47  
Old 12-19-2017, 08:54 AM
Sure1 Sure1 is offline
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I guess I got lucky when I ordered my PRO/LR back in 2014. I received mine after the price increase but they honored my contract price. It was like a 38month wait back then.
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  #48  
Old 12-19-2017, 09:27 AM
wlhawk wlhawk is offline
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I received my PRO after a 15 month wait in 2010 and SA was great to deal with. With close to a dozen SA rifles and pistols, none has been a problem. I would not hesitate purchasing from them in the future.
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  #49  
Old 12-19-2017, 12:58 PM
monadh monadh is online now
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In the end, regardless of which company it is and whatever their track record might be, you pays your money and you takes your chances.

And so far the only companies that have done good by me are Colt, Dan Wesson, and Beretta.
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  #50  
Old 01-19-2018, 06:46 AM
bhunted bhunted is offline
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Hi gang.... Sorry for the quick post and lack of a hefty bio. Live in NJ. I've been shooting since the 70's and have several 1911s... If this post is wrong, please advise and I'll repost where you tell me it should be.


I recently bought my first SA pistol. A TRP Operator 45 with Armory Kote.
First thing I do when I get a new gun home is break it down and clean it.
Well, that was were it started. If it helps, there was a hand written date on the side of the case for 12-14-17...

So, I get it on the mat and I cannot budge the slide. I mean it is really stuck!
I finally get it to rack and break it down. First thing I notice is the barrel link is almost frozen. Only very little movement in the middle of its range. I'm like what the hell. I knock the pin out and the link and the feet have burs. The link itself had machine marks under the lower hole. So I clean up the link and feet so it flops around like a trout in a frying pan.
I figure this has to be it. Put it back together and still real hard to rack. Very little change. Yank it apart again. Run my pinky in the front of the slide and I literally got a scrap on my finger. Sharp burs! I'm starting to get frustrated.
I went over that whole slide and gently knocked any I found down. There were a few. (Oh and slide lock flows freely but when assembling, is a biotch to get it past the plunger)...

Put it back together and its still tight! Argh! Once you break it, it isn't too bad but once it it racks closed, its like someone put a pad lock on it.
So I am at a loss. The only other thing I can say is while the barrel, (which I also polished), seems to drop into the lugs and it takes a tad effort to move it forward with your finger. I'm wondering if under tension, fully assembled, that it is so tight, it has a hard time drifting out of the lugs.
I'm probably going to call CS, but I've never had any gun with probs out of the box. At the price for a TRP, I'd think it would be pristine and fully functional. There was no spent round, no gunpowder residue or anything. Just really oiled up. How the hell did someone actually assemble this and box it and not feel/see the problems???
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John, aka BHunted
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