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  #1  
Old 12-02-2019, 05:04 PM
gtmtnbiker98 gtmtnbiker98 is offline
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New Delta Elite - nothing but problems

Picked up a new two-tone Delta Elite last month and have had nothing but problems. Using Armscor, Magtech, and Sellier & Bellot 180 gr, this gun has had nothing but failures to feed.

The gun has already been sent back to Colt and I received it back on the 27th of November. No notes or anything in regards to what they did if anything. Fast forward to today, I took it out with some Magtech and Sellier & Bellot 180 gr and again experienced failures to feed from the magazine when loading the gun. The rounds aren't nose diving, they are pointed up towards the chamber and wedged, just prior to really engaging the extractor.

For whatever reason, while using both OEM and Wilson magazines, the gun will fail to load the first road using both the slide catch to release the slide and the sling shot method to release the slide. Doesn't matter which method, the gun hangs up on the first round. Once I manage to get the gun to load as any other gun normally does, it appears to run "okay" but I've experienced a few failures to feed.

Now, if I download the magazines to less than four, the gun will load and chamber fine, with a few exceptions. So, what am I missing here? Magazine spring tension seems to be the common denominator, here. I really dread the thought of sending it back to Colt for another month. However, with that said, Colt can't seem to want to answer their phone to take Customer Service calls. I'm about to cut my losses with this one.

Last edited by gtmtnbiker98; 12-02-2019 at 05:13 PM.
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  #2  
Old 12-02-2019, 05:11 PM
joebuck joebuck is offline
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First off. Stop using cheap foreign ammo. Then maybe swap out recoil springs for a different set. Yes, you shouldn't have to do any of it when a gun is new. I would also demand that Colt tell you what was done with the damn thing when they had it and send if off again if you don't like to tinker with 1911's. Tell them you don't want it back till it works. Period. That is if they bother to answer the phone!!!
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  #3  
Old 12-02-2019, 05:13 PM
4110mm 4110mm is offline
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They won't take it back or exchange it I assume although I would try to force them to do just that.

Or talk you dealer into trading to back in towards another gun and have him deal with it, split the loss or whatever. I am hooked on Dan Wesson but there a little higher $ and all dealer can order one I assume.

How is Sellier & Bellot crap ammo?
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  #4  
Old 12-02-2019, 06:02 PM
Big Pete10 Big Pete10 is offline
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I would try some better ammo, Win, Fed or Rem. I have a rather new Wiley Clapp Commander and it feeds everything I've tried in it, 230 RN, 200 RN cast, 225 TC cast. S&B usually works, I don't know about 180 grain tho.
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  #5  
Old 12-02-2019, 06:06 PM
fnfalman fnfalman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtmtnbiker98 View Post
Picked up a new two-tone Delta Elite last month and have had nothing but problems. Using Armscor, Magtech, and Sellier & Bellot 180 gr, this gun has had nothing but failures to feed.

The gun has already been sent back to Colt and I received it back on the 27th of November. No notes or anything in regards to what they did if anything. Fast forward to today, I took it out with some Magtech and Sellier & Bellot 180 gr and again experienced failures to feed from the magazine when loading the gun.
I've used the same ammo in my two Delta Elites and they work fine, so it ain't the ammo.

Quote:
The rounds aren't nose diving, they are pointed up towards the chamber and wedged, just prior to really engaging the extractor.
Would you consider polishing the chamber a bit? If the rounds are wedging against the roof of the chamber and they are just plain jane ball bullets then maybe the chamber is on the rough side. Just my guess.

I find it hard to believe that the gun was shipped with the wrong recoil spring and Colt didn't even check on it when you sent back the gun. However since that recoil springs are dirt cheap, it doesn't hurt to get a Wolff spring of either the correct weight or slightly heavier and see if that would help.

Quote:

Now, if I download the magazines to less than four, the gun will load and chamber fine, with a few exceptions. So, what am I missing here? Magazine spring tension seems to be the common denominator, here. I really dread the thought of sending it back to Colt for another month. However, with that said, Colt can't seem to want to answer their phone to take Customer Service calls. I'm about to cut my losses with this one.
I'd say send the darn thing back and have Colt make it right regardless of how long it takes. It can't be the magazine issue since that you use both the Colt factory mag and Wilson mag.

Or take a loss and sell it off and go to Colt's Facebook page and shame them.

I had a CCO that shot 6" low at 7-yards. I sent it in for correction and it took Colt six months to put in a new sight. But it did come back shot to point of aim AND they threw in a steel MSH replacement without charge...so it wasn't all bad.
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  #6  
Old 12-02-2019, 06:43 PM
Sandhills Write Sandhills Write is offline
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One thing to try, load your magazines completely full, and let them set a week, that will break in the mag springs, and maybe take care of your problem. I just got a new Wilson Supergrade, and in the instructions it says to fully load the magazines so the springs are fully compressed to break them in. Worth a try.
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  #7  
Old 12-02-2019, 07:55 PM
dsf dsf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtmtnbiker98 View Post
Picked up a new two-tone Delta Elite last month and have had nothing but problems. Using Armscor, Magtech, and Sellier & Bellot 180 gr, this gun has had nothing but failures to feed.

The gun has already been sent back to Colt and I received it back on the 27th of November. No notes or anything in regards to what they did if anything. Fast forward to today, I took it out with some Magtech and Sellier & Bellot 180 gr and again experienced failures to feed from the magazine when loading the gun. The rounds aren't nose diving, they are pointed up towards the chamber and wedged, just prior to really engaging the extractor.

For whatever reason, while using both OEM and Wilson magazines, the gun will fail to load the first road using both the slide catch to release the slide and the sling shot method to release the slide. Doesn't matter which method, the gun hangs up on the first round. Once I manage to get the gun to load as any other gun normally does, it appears to run "okay" but I've experienced a few failures to feed.

Now, if I download the magazines to less than four, the gun will load and chamber fine, with a few exceptions. So, what am I missing here? Magazine spring tension seems to be the common denominator, here. I really dread the thought of sending it back to Colt for another month. However, with that said, Colt can't seem to want to answer their phone to take Customer Service calls. I'm about to cut my losses with this one.
Just wondering - does the mag spring exert greater upward pressure when loaded with 3 or 4 rounds or with a full magazine? There's less t lift with fewer rounds, but the spring is less compressed than with 7 or 8 rounds loaded. I ask because I'm wondering if there's an extractor issue. Too much tension, a sharp lower edge or a bit less than ideal daylight between hook and breechface?

If lifting less means the spring exerts greater pressure, maybe it's enough to overcome whatever's getting in the way.
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  #8  
Old 12-02-2019, 08:49 PM
CAR CAR is offline
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I would try Winchester 230 gr. Ball and see if you still have the same issue.

Some .45 Auto ammo does not have enough chamfer at the extractor rim and that causes the round to get bound up on the extractor when feeding. Sometimes you can see a mark left on the case rim chamfer from the extractor.

Last edited by CAR; 12-02-2019 at 08:51 PM.
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  #9  
Old 12-02-2019, 08:57 PM
Phil McGrath Phil McGrath is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CAR View Post
I would try Winchester 230 gr. Ball and see if you still have the same issue.

Some .45 Auto ammo does not have enough chamfer at the extractor rim and that causes the round to get bound up on the extractor when feeding. Sometimes you can see a mark left on the case rim chamfer from the extractor.
Ahhhhh, you are aware that the Delta Elite is a 10mm not a .45?
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  #10  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:04 PM
MG1912 MG1912 is offline
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Originally Posted by fnfalman View Post
I'd say send the darn thing back and have Colt make it right regardless of how long it takes.
I've been on this forum long enough to have formed the impression that Colt customer service is pretty atrocious. In fact, when my Colt had a few bobbles, I didn't even bother sending it to them, as I was afraid I'd be without my gun for months and months, and it would still come back not fixed. I sent it to Dave Panciotti right off the bat. I'm very happy with that decision, but it did cost me money. Yes, Colt should make it right, but do they? Have things improved in the last two years (the last time I was a regular here)?
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  #11  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:09 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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If Brent was still there he'd make it right. Unfortunately he isn't.

And it's not an ammo problem either. S&B ammo is great stuff, and Armscor and Magtech are still just as good as Rem-UMC and WWB. A gun like a Delta Elite shouldn't require premium ammo just to work properly. Anything that's brass-cased would work. It sounds to me like the OP needs to either send it back to Colt and make them fix it, or else go straight to somebody else who actually knows what they're doing and pay them. The downside to the latter solution is that, if the issue is a manufacturing problem the gunsmith cant solve then you're out of luck because the warranty may be voided.
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  #12  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:18 PM
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RickB RickB is offline
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It's not the recoil spring, unless someone forgot to include both springs and you're running on just the 7# spring?

If it seems to run better with less mag spring tension, then I'd suspect excess extractor tension; both combined are too much for that 7# recoil spring ( ) to overcome.
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  #13  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:43 PM
Retired AF CE Retired AF CE is offline
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It sounds like it has too tight of extractor.

I would check that first.

Then I would check the slide, taking everything out and mounting it on your frame. Work it back and fourth to see if its binding.

Also check your recoil springs.
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  #14  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:35 PM
TRSOtto TRSOtto is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsf View Post
Just wondering - does the mag spring exert greater upward pressure when loaded with 3 or 4 rounds or with a full magazine? There's less t lift with fewer rounds, but the spring is less compressed than with 7 or 8 rounds loaded. I ask because I'm wondering if there's an extractor issue. Too much tension, a sharp lower edge or a bit less than ideal daylight between hook and breechface?

If lifting less means the spring exerts greater pressure, maybe it's enough to overcome whatever's getting in the way.
You have it backwards. A fully loaded mag exerts greater force on the top round than a half loaded magazine does.

Force per inch of deflection x inches of deflection = greater force.

And yes......load those mags full and let them relax for a day or 2.
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  #15  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:37 PM
USMM guy USMM guy is offline
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This is correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dsk View Post
If Brent was still there he'd make it right. Unfortunately he isn't.

And it's not an ammo problem either. S&B ammo is great stuff, and Armscor and Magtech are still just as good as Rem-UMC and WWB. A gun like a Delta Elite shouldn't require premium ammo just to work properly. Anything that's brass-cased would work. It sounds to me like the OP needs to either send it back to Colt and make them fix it, or else go straight to somebody else who actually knows what they're doing and pay them. The downside to the latter solution is that, if the issue is a manufacturing problem the gunsmith cant solve then you're out of luck because the warranty may be voided.
S&B makes excellent ammunition. Something is wrong with the gun, or the magazines.
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  #16  
Old 12-03-2019, 01:43 AM
Col. Colt Col. Colt is offline
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From your original description I would look at two likely culprits - and both are minor to correct.

I have owned three Deltas, and none had feeding issues with quality US made factory ammo, despite the stronger springing for the 10MM. I did use factory Colt or CMC mag back in my IPSC days and no had issues. Also, interestingly enough, all three of mine shoot fine with CMC or Wilson .45 ACP mags, too.

I would not condemn the gun without running a full box of Winchester/Remington/Federal factory 10MM through it. I don't trust the off shore makers as much as some here.

1.) Apparently the rounds are not cleanly sliding up the breech face and under the extractor "in time", but are being shoved up against the top of the barrel before they can straighten out and feed into the chamber as normal. Is this what appears to be happening??

2.) If it is, either the breech face is rough/not flat, etc., and not letting the base of the cartridge case slide up easily, or (more likely) you have an extractor that needs to be properly beveled on the bottom edge and/or tension adjusted. (Lots of info here or online.) If the case rim is encountering a rough breech, it may just be slowing the angle change enough to hang things up. If the extractor is too tight or has a square edge stopping the rim from feeding up under the extractor cutout, same problem can occur - either upsets the timing of events.

I would attempt to make Colt fix it, but if you otherwise like the gun, you will save time and perhaps improve it a bit by letting a custom 1911 smith make it run. Barring something way off on the barrel or slide, (unlikely in this day of CMC) it's probably pretty simple. CC
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  #17  
Old 12-03-2019, 05:37 AM
army_eod army_eod is offline
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The pistol should run 100% from Colt. Send it back and if they don't fix it then call them and inform them they will be hearing from a lawyer. Just the threat sometimes works. Colt has an obligation to make it right.
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  #18  
Old 12-03-2019, 07:31 AM
VIS35 VIS35 is offline
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Magazine and/or ammo issue; not the gun.
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  #19  
Old 12-03-2019, 07:38 AM
trckdrvr trckdrvr is offline
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Originally Posted by army_eod View Post
The pistol should run 100% from Colt. obligation to make it right.

This^^
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  #20  
Old 12-03-2019, 07:40 AM
trckdrvr trckdrvr is offline
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I have been thru this and its very disappointing and frustrating.
But with enough times back to Colt they eventually get it right.
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  #21  
Old 12-03-2019, 09:36 AM
Righteous Righteous is offline
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I had to send back a new classic 45 because the front sight was loose. It came back 3 weeks later with a Tight but canted front sight. No repair notes were in the box. I was pissed and my dealer bought the gun back. I complained about colt on there page and was banned. LOL
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  #22  
Old 12-03-2019, 01:57 PM
Colt Carson Colt Carson is offline
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My Colt 1911s are my most cherished pistols, but I don’t see myself ever buying another Colt. I feel fortunate that my Colts are acceptable fit and finish and run ball ammunition reliably (.45auto). I just don’t feel that if I had an issue with a new purchase I would get acceptable customer support from Colt.
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  #23  
Old 12-03-2019, 02:31 PM
HT77 HT77 is offline
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I can't believe people are blaming this on the ammo.
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Old 12-03-2019, 02:39 PM
dakota1911 dakota1911 is offline
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It would be interesting to have someone look closely at the extractor. Not only tension but the exact shape of the hook at the end. Maybe with enough trips back to Colt they will find somebody to do that or find what else is wrong.
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  #25  
Old 12-03-2019, 02:40 PM
fnfalman fnfalman is offline
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I can't believe people are blaming this on the ammo.
I can't believe that people think S&B or Fiocchi are subpar ammo because they came from Europe. Or MagTech and Aguila are subpar ammo because they came from South of the Border.
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