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  #26  
Old 05-25-2020, 09:01 PM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
If you decap inside, how much exposure to lead are you really getting??
Iíve actually done some testing: I laid out the finest bright white garbage bags from my kitchen, and then deprimed ~200 cases on a single stage press. Man thatís slow...

Without a respirator, I can easily smell the primer/powder residue. So the stuff is dispersed in the air. When I finished, there was a fair amount of residue visible. Just a thin dusting of gray residue. Not really visible unless you did the ďwhite glove testĒ, but since I started with clean plastic, the source is easily identified. More importantly, it continued a couple feet from the press.

And of course my gloves became silvery grey.

Now: can I clean up the area? Reasonably well, yes. Certainly well enough to be less of a problem for an adult. But not perfectly. Definitely not enough for anywhere a toddler may wander (Perhaps years down the road).

Quote:
In the scheme of things (at least according to California), you are apt to have more exposure to lead by rolling up your garden hose.
Thereís worse things in a new garden hose than a minuscule amount of lead leeching from the brass. (Or old hoses, if youíve ever cut one open and looked at the mold inside...)

That said, Paracelsus said ďthe dose makes the poison,Ē but the sentiment isnít strictly true. Lead in particular is extremely well studied, and there is no known amount that is safe, for children or adults. Itís just a matter of how quickly the harm accumulates.

For that matter, young kids (like mine) are only supposed to drink a few oz of fruit juice in a day, because the stuff has a lot more lead than anybody expects ó the legacy of around a century of adding tetraethyllead to gasoline.

Quote:
Just a thought. I donít know if anyone here has actually studied the lead content of a fired and washed primer........
When wet tumbling with stainless, the general recipe is water, dish soap, and citric acid. Citric acid chelates lead (clamps onto the lead atoms like a crabís claws), and dissolves/washes away the lead.

D-lead soap (or itís competitors) do the same thing: they chelate the lead and allow it to be dissolved in water and washed off easily.

I donít plan on testing primers (cleaned or not), but I do plan on testing brass after itís been cleaned. There are instant lead tests sold at Home Depot for $10.

But for anybody reading: DO NOT get a ďwater testĒ and test the dirty wash water from your stainless tumbler. The lead level will be too high for municipal water, will trigger mandatory reporting, and an investigation by people who need somebody to punish to get a good performance review this year.

Last edited by Pariah Zero; 05-25-2020 at 09:05 PM.
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  #27  
Old 05-26-2020, 01:54 AM
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Rifter Rifter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
It does bring up a good question...
Obviously, once a round has been fired, most of the lead styphnate from the primer is blasted out. Then the cleaning process (primers intact) flushes out more of the contaminate. If you decap inside, how much exposure to lead are you really getting?? In the scheme of things (at least according to California), you are apt to have more exposure to lead by rolling up your garden hose. Just a thought. I donít know if anyone here has actually studied the lead content of a fired and washed primer........
Unless you've got your snout stuffed into the tumbler snorting up the dust from cleaning cases, the chances of getting lead poisoning from normal metallic catridge reloading is pretty much nonexistant. Considering the number of rounds I've loaded over the last 5 decades (I quit counting somewhat past 400k), and that I know several people who have me beat by a country mile, worrying about it is a total waste of time.
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  #28  
Old 05-26-2020, 06:14 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Thatís kinda what I was getting at...
Sure, itís a dirty business, but most of it from spent powder residue. I get Fletchís point about not wanting all the crap on the floor of a nice office, especially bits of anvils everywhere. My primer cup catches most and I vacuum up the rest. I donít have the round count @400K, but Iíve done my share. My lead level is low.
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  #29  
Old 05-26-2020, 09:42 PM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Thatís kinda what I was getting at...
Sure, itís a dirty business, but most of it from spent powder residue. I get Fletchís point about not wanting all the crap on the floor of a nice office, especially bits of anvils everywhere. My primer cup catches most and I vacuum up the rest. I donít have the round count @400K, but Iíve done my share. My lead level is low.

Itís not *my* lead level that Iím concerned about.

Itís a lot easier to prevent anybody else in my home from exposure if processing is done outside.
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  #30  
Old 05-27-2020, 06:28 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Donít get me wrong, Iím not disagreeing with processing outside, it is a dirty business. Letís put the entire thing in perspective though. There are many things in your house right now that have a higher potential for lead exposure to you and your kids than punching a few primers.
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  #31  
Old 05-27-2020, 11:38 PM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Donít get me wrong, Iím not disagreeing with processing outside, it is a dirty business. Letís put the entire thing in perspective though. There are many things in your house right now that have a higher potential for lead exposure to you and your kids than punching a few primers.

I donít agree that punching 5k primers is ďa few.Ē

It only takes 200 μg (0.003 grains) to cause permanent brain damage and lifelong neurological problems in a toddler.

Thatís easily exceeded by decapping brass ó not because thereís so much lead in the primers, but because 200 μg is so little.
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  #32  
Old 05-28-2020, 06:34 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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5K primers in one sitting? Or over the course of a year? Lead in the system is not permanent or we would all die at 20.
I donít mean to be argumentative, but if you are cranking out 5K, that means you shoot regularly. The lead residue in your house is already high. Just being around an indoor range, eating fish from the market, drinking tap water or screwing in a light bulb is gonna expose you.
Again, Iím not fighting the idea of decapping outside, itís a good idea. Decapping washed brass inside will not turn you or your kid into a vegetable.
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  #33  
Old 05-28-2020, 12:58 PM
flechero flechero is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
5K primers in one sitting? Or over the course of a year? Lead in the system is not permanent or we would all die at 20. I donít mean to be argumentative, but if you are cranking out 5K, that means you shoot regularly. The lead residue in your house is already high. Just being around an indoor range, eating fish from the market, drinking tap water or screwing in a light bulb is gonna expose you.
Again, Iím not fighting the idea of decapping outside, itís a good idea. Decapping washed brass inside will not turn you or your kid into a vegetable.
but it still makes a mess! Can't wash out a primer pocket with a spent primer in it!

Thinking through your other comments... If his residue and exposure is already high, than that only makes it that much more important to reduce additional exposure by whatever measure you can. And doubly important for the little ones.
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Last edited by flechero; 05-28-2020 at 01:08 PM. Reason: additional comments
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  #34  
Old 05-28-2020, 08:50 PM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Lead in the system is not permanent or we would all die at 20.
Among other things, Lead is absorbed by the bones instead of calcium. Once in the skeleton, its elimination half life is 30 years. So while not ďpermanentĒ by a strict definition, we donít live long enough to get past that last 12%. And as the bones release the lead, it continues to poison the body & brain. (Itís relatively benign while actually ďinĒ bones)

Quote:
I donít mean to be argumentative,
And Iím not taking it as such.


Quote:
but if you are cranking out 5K, that means you shoot regularly. The lead residue in your house is already high. Just being around an indoor range, eating fish from the market, drinking tap water or screwing in a light bulb is gonna expose you.
Meh; Light bulb screws are coated with tin, not lead. Plus, with modern LED bulbs, I havenít had do change a light bulb in a decade - and donít expect to for quite some time.

Tap water isnít a problem: the local water system is decades too new to use lead pipe, and the source water has zero lead. (Mountain fresh!) Homes use PEX instead of soldered copper because copper is expen$ive $tuff. Homes are way too new for lead based paint. For that matter, congress banned leaded solder for plumbing in Ď86. Most house keys are even plated, to reduce lead leeching from the brass.

As far as shooting goes: my favorite range has HEPA filtering, and a lot of airflow blowing everything ďdown rangeĒ. They provide a washing station (cold water only), and D-lead soap. Thereís a restroom where you can change your clothes (or overalls, in my case). That way thereís a lot less transferred to the car. Guns are then cleaned in my garage, and finally everything else (including me) gets washed in D-lead immediately after getting home. (There are bothD-lead laundry detergent and D-lead hair & body wash).

It sounds a lot more OCD than it is: itís just the usual advice of changing your clothes & showering after shooting - just using D-lead instead of Tide or axe body wash.

The wife likes it because I donít smell like burnt powder, or get soot in ďherĒ clean house.

Which leaves dietary sources of lead. And there really isnít much you can do about it, but the levels are manageable if you follow guidelines (like eating predatory fish no more than once a month).

The bottom line, though, is that itís not inconvenient (or even expensive) to manage lead from shooting sports.
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  #35  
Old 05-31-2020, 11:32 AM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Well, I set up the APP, and gave it a decent test last night.

I like it. Iíll put a review in another thread.
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  #36  
Old 05-31-2020, 03:38 PM
Timbo3 Timbo3 is offline
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Mine came Thursday. I took it out of the box and that us as far as I got.
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  #37  
Old 06-01-2020, 06:52 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Did you have to hurriedly hide it in the closet before the wife saw it??
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  #38  
Old 06-01-2020, 09:58 PM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Did you have to hurriedly hide it in the closet before the wife saw it??

I was not successful.

Which brings up a good time to share the following: [youtube]NptsH2uU3ug[/youtube]
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  #39  
Old 06-02-2020, 06:27 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Gary Gulman?
A bunch of vids popped up.....
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  #40  
Old 06-02-2020, 10:36 AM
Pariah Zero Pariah Zero is offline
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Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Gary Gulman?
A bunch of vids popped up.....

Huh. I only got one video ďI prefer the couch.Ē Must be a mobile vs computer thing. (I posted from a mobile)
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  #41  
Old 06-03-2020, 06:55 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Yeah, I had 5 results pull up. The couch it is!
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