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  #26  
Old 07-29-2018, 05:36 PM
jeffbird jeffbird is offline
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[QUOTE=regalsc;12572794]
Quote:
Originally Posted by BradE View Post
The number of snowflakes that cry about a stiff safety, or tight bushing is absolutely hilarious. The level of diva is unreal.[/QOTE]

Yes really it is. I’m 63 & my hands hurt sometimes but not so much as to say the thumb safety on my Baer is too hard or the gun is hard to rack because it isn’t. I have man hands always have & I don’t ever put lotion on them. One of the guys at my range loves the way the thumb safety is on my Baer. Using the different field strip technique is a piece of cake but I didn’t wear a helmet when I rode my bicycle when I was a little kid either!
Count me in this camp. I owned two Wilsons, a Stealth and a Tac Elite. The Stealth ran nicely. The Tac Elite never ran reliably despite two trips back to the Wilson shop. Tried a Baer and the Wilsons were traded for Baers a week later. Ten years later, the first Baer, a SRP, is still my everyday carry gun, and have two other SRP’s, a fullsize and a Commanche. All have run perfectly from day 1. Just make sure to use Wilson or Tripp mags.
The first SRP was made in Illinois. To rack the slide in the beginning required a good hard grip on the slide and shove on the grip to break it open. The most recent one was not as tight and made me kind of miss the old days when people thought their guns were stuck closed. 😊
Anyway, have no worries. Buy a Baer, wipe off the oil dripping off of it, shoot a case of American Eagle through it and go home with a smile.

Last edited by jeffbird; 07-29-2018 at 05:39 PM.
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  #27  
Old 07-29-2018, 09:25 PM
XMP XMP is offline
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I've owned pretty much every production and semi-production 1911 around. I like both Wilsons and Baers. They're different in my opinion though and I can see why they might appeal to different sorts of people.

For me there are things to love about both. Baers for me are like Jeeps. The very things that make them annoy some people are the very things that make them desirable to others.
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1911s: Baer - Custom Carry Commanche, TRS, TRS (no FCS); Brown - Special Forces (black), Special Forces (black on stealth grey); Colt - Wiley Clapp CCO, Gunsite Government; Nighthawk - Talon II; Springfield - Milspec; Wilson Combat - CQB (Black on OD), CQB Compact (black on grey), Professional 9mm [and Wilson/Beretta Centurion].
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  #28  
Old 07-29-2018, 10:13 PM
EL Perdido EL Perdido is online now
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I like Jeeps
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  #29  
Old 07-29-2018, 11:23 PM
drail drail is offline
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Ahhh - Jeeps. Yes indeed. I especially love working on them.
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  #30  
Old 07-30-2018, 04:18 AM
Fazer386 Fazer386 is offline
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I never had the opportunity ($$$$) to shop around the Elite pistol builders. In Ď89, I shot IPSC with a SA .45 built with WC parts. My buddy bought a Les Baer frame kit and built a freakish tight pistol. I was blown away. I sold my SA .45 pistols.

I ordered a custom LB PII without a Bo-Mar. This LB pistol was the tightest pistol Iíve ever owned. That was Ď98 and my pistol is running strong at 67K. I added TRS in Ď04 and they are my Work Horses. I only own Colts and Les Baer pistols. I never needed to shop around.

I talked to Les when he was the Customs Shop Manager at Springfield Armory. Les was great to talk with, I spoke to him once in his shop to order a few parts. LB customer service has been excellent in my experience. Iíve never had an issue with a pistol to send it out. I never used the warranty card. I maintain my own pistols. I havenít called the shop in years, plus I have ano excellent gunsmith in my backyard.

Les Baer pistols are not for the fussy gun owners. LB pistols are made to be shot... A lot. Just as I never understood the 6920 buyer that pouts about the finish.

Les Baer owners are a unique crowd. Iím proud to be one of them.
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  #31  
Old 07-30-2018, 06:36 AM
ballistic64 ballistic64 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbird View Post
Anyway, have no worries. Buy a Baer, wipe off the oil dripping off of it, shoot a case of American Eagle through it and go home with a smile.
This ^^

My first 1911 was the PM2 and is still the most accurate 1911 I own. Opened the box, wiped the grips off and ran 500 rounds of some factory ammo through it, keeping the slide, bushings etc. drenched with CLP. A few FTEs in the first few hundred and not a problem since. I also didn't clean the PM until the round count was up close to 1500. The round count has to be up close to 8000 by now and I have since switched from CLP to Gunfighter. To this day the gun is just as accurate as the day I got it.
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  #32  
Old 07-30-2018, 06:56 AM
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apipeguy apipeguy is offline
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I own a 1 1/2” PII and several Wilson’s. Wouldn’t sell any of them. At this point I only shoot bullseye with my PII and started using Wilson ETM HD mags in it about 10,000 rounds ago and my very occasional FTF’s disappeared. I’ve used customer service from both companies and have no complaints.
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  #33  
Old 07-30-2018, 07:49 AM
bad2006z71 bad2006z71 is offline
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My 2001 build SRP (NIB when I bought it) was super tight, but after just 200 rounds, it smoothed up great, and after 700 rounds, so far, has not giving me anything but joy.
The bushing requires a plastic wrench to turn, but the slide and frame are super smooth and come apart pretty easily.

My 2015 build UTC 45 is a pain in the MFA (some not so nice language) to disassemble, the bushing is tight, but not as tight as the SRP, still requires a wrench. Slide to frame is almost welded together and takes a plastic hammer to hammer off. Accuracy and reliability through roughly 1000 rounds as been excellent.

My 2006 build TRSC is just like my SRP, smooth slide/frame fit, with super tight bushing. No failures (that wasn't specifically ammo related) through it when my buddy owned it, nor through the 300 or so rounds I've put through it.

My 2018 UTC 9mm is a POS and should never have left Baer in the condition it did. Ok POS is a strong wording, maybe disappointment would be better. Accuracy is great, but could barely get a mag through without failure to extract, get maybe 50 rounds through then failure after failure. Sent the slide assembly to AC and he said he was surprised it ran at all, Uncle Les' monkey's missed some things. Even after AC magic touch, spring change, and lighter oil, it still won't extract WWB, but seems to do good with Blazer brass, though I only have about 250rds of Blazer through it. WWB is junk. I need to get a case of either Blazer or AE and test it again.

My buddies SRP is somewhere around 2-3K rounds without any hiccups.

In my experience with Baer products, in 45acp you are golden. In 9mm, look elsewhere.
There are members here with 20k + rounds on Baer 45's without any or very little trouble.
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Last edited by bad2006z71; 07-31-2018 at 07:48 AM.
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  #34  
Old 07-30-2018, 08:50 AM
Hairtrigger Hairtrigger is offline
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it seems you already made your mind up and if you owned a LB anything would be an issue...
Ill go ahead and say it
Buy a Wilson
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  #35  
Old 07-30-2018, 05:01 PM
CastleBravo CastleBravo is offline
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Most Baer complaints are the product of either misunderstanding or disagreeing with Baer's philosophy for building guns. If you don't want a supertight gun with average cosmetics that's blued like a factory Colt government model and might take 500 rounds of hardball through it before it feels and runs smoothly... buy something else.
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  #36  
Old 08-01-2018, 12:22 PM
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Flight Medic Flight Medic is offline
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I, too, am considering purchasing a Baer. And I have also read the negative comments on the ol' interweb. Since no one seems to dispute the fact that his guns can be problematic at first, and its an accepted fact that some require a thousand rounds down range before functioning properly, my question is...what is the advantage to owning a gun built with this "philosophy" (as compared to a 1911 from one of the many other semi-custom builders which does NOT require such a lengthy break-in period)? Do the Wilsons and Browns really lose accuracy after several thousand rounds from NOT being "hard fit"??

Obviously his pistols must be something extraordinary or he wouldn't have earned such a cult following. I really want to buy one just to see what all the hubbub is about. I just hope I dont receive an example which needs to be sent back to Les to correct.
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  #37  
Old 08-01-2018, 01:20 PM
regalsc regalsc is online now
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My Baer was tight as explained in earlier posts but has never had a ftf or fte so there was no so called breakin. They are test fired before leaving the factory which is more than some makers do. Buying any gun is a crapshoot anymore.
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  #38  
Old 08-01-2018, 04:54 PM
delta 5.56 delta 5.56 is offline
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I have a SRP I purchased 2 yrs. ago, tight slide and thumb safety at first, but by far the most accurate 1911 I own. Not as nice looking as my Wilson Combat pistols but will out shoot them every time I go to the range. Les Baer pistol's are priced right in my opinion. Buy 45 acp

Last edited by delta 5.56; 08-01-2018 at 05:31 PM.
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  #39  
Old 08-01-2018, 08:55 PM
jtq jtq is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flight Medic View Post
I, too, am considering purchasing a Baer. And I have also read the negative comments on the ol' interweb. Since no one seems to dispute the fact that his guns can be problematic at first, and its an accepted fact that some require a thousand rounds down range before functioning properly, my question is...what is the advantage to owning a gun built with this "philosophy" (as compared to a 1911 from one of the many other semi-custom builders which does NOT require such a lengthy break-in period)?
I'll admit I don't own a Baer, but I've been on the forums for a few years and read an awful lot of Les Baer threads. I don't see the "his guns can be problematic at first", and the "fact that some require a thousand rounds down range before functioning properly" comments very often, if at all.

I do almost always see comments that they are difficult to field strip before about 1,000 rounds, and their finish and machining are a little crude by Brown and Wilson standards, but nearly every thread I've read has commented about while stiff when new, their Les Baer worked accurately and reliably from round 1 through round forever.

It seems to me, for those trying to decide between a Baer and a Wilson or some other semi-custom, that if you have to ask, chances are good the reason you're asking is because you are attracted to the Baer because of the price and not because of the feature set, or better yet the characteristics. The Baer's seem to me to be a gun you either "get" the build philosophy or you don't. They're probably not for everybody, but if you have to ask, they probably aren't for you.
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  #40  
Old 08-01-2018, 10:18 PM
Hairtrigger Hairtrigger is offline
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Not sure having a break in period is such an issue for some people
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  #41  
Old 08-01-2018, 10:21 PM
jlag19 jlag19 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hairtrigger View Post
Not sure having a break in period is such an issue for some people


Great point! Youíre going to shoot the gun anyway, right?


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  #42  
Old 08-01-2018, 11:33 PM
toofew1911s toofew1911s is offline
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While people who bought Les Baer guns were mostly aware that they were tight fitting guns, I think many were surprised at just how tight some individual Baer guns could be. I know I was. I expected tight - I didn't expect "beat with a mallet to assemble/disassemble" tight. I know mine was that tight - and as a new owner you don't want to damage your new gun by beating it to death with a blunt instrument or twisting a bushing with enough force to score the outside of the barrel. While you understand it will loosen up with a bit of shooting, it is still unnerving to deal with until it does.

But to me, all the things you read on the Baer guns should be more reassuring than anything else. Most everyone with any experience with them assures you it will all work itself out with a little time - and it almost always does. And I don't know if I have ever read a report of a Les Baer gun not shooting well. So when you add it all up, I don't see many negative reports on anything other than warrantee work from Les Baer - and I have never had a problem yet so can't comment on that.
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  #43  
Old 08-02-2018, 12:07 AM
XMP XMP is offline
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Two thoughts: first, I'd never trust any gun for serious business without 500-1000 rounds through it anyway; so even if there wasn't an advised break in I'd still break in any gun.

Second, it seems part of the problem is that many of us can't get over what grandpa or our drill sergeant drilled into us to clean our weapons everytime we shot them (or even more often). Once we recognize this isn't necessary and is in fact probably detrimental then it's not so bad to shoot a 1000 rounds through a Baer before worrying about disassembly.

For me those two things "solve" the new Baer problems that some seem to have.
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1911s: Baer - Custom Carry Commanche, TRS, TRS (no FCS); Brown - Special Forces (black), Special Forces (black on stealth grey); Colt - Wiley Clapp CCO, Gunsite Government; Nighthawk - Talon II; Springfield - Milspec; Wilson Combat - CQB (Black on OD), CQB Compact (black on grey), Professional 9mm [and Wilson/Beretta Centurion].
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  #44  
Old 08-02-2018, 12:58 AM
toofew1911s toofew1911s is offline
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Originally Posted by XMP View Post
Two thoughts: first, I'd never trust any gun for serious business without 500-1000 rounds through it anyway; so even if there wasn't an advised break in I'd still break in any gun.

Second, it seems part of the problem is that many of us can't get over what grandpa or our drill sergeant drilled into us to clean our weapons everytime we shot them (or even more often). Once we recognize this isn't necessary and is in fact probably detrimental then it's not so bad to shoot a 1000 rounds through a Baer before worrying about disassembly.

For me those two things "solve" the new Baer problems that some seem to have.
While the highlighted text sounds to be a good idea, with my Baer it wasn't possible. Maybe with cleaner ammunition. While my PII had zero malfunctions when clean, after 400 rounds or so dirt and grime started to cause malfunctions. So unless I wanted to put up with the malfunctions, it was time to disassemble and clean gun. But I didn't. I just cleaned what I could out of the chamber, ran a bore snake through it and sprayed some lubricant on it and went another 300 rounds. But by then I was getting malfunctions every other magazine so I finally tore it down and cleaned it. Haven't fired it since then but I expect it to back to 100% in the reliability dept.
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  #45  
Old 08-02-2018, 02:39 AM
regalsc regalsc is online now
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Did you add any lube to your Baer when shooting a lot of rounds?
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  #46  
Old 08-02-2018, 06:58 AM
Magnumite Magnumite is online now
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I owned two Wilson Combat guns, sold them then bought a Baer PII. I like his build philosophy.

I am not posting to bash Baer because that may be how it seems, but I have a difficult time with the Baer accolades when there are considerable flies in the ointment. Look through the pistol enough and you'll likely find other issues like poor slide stop molding. Yes, it may not be a barstock or forged part. Guess it depends on the era in which it was built.

The one Baer I have I bought used, low round count. Oddly I still have it...I should have looked at it closer when I bought it, hey it was a Baer, no need to check...right? After the first range trip I detail stripped it to do a thorough once over. The factory barrel fit was horrible. The only correct parameters were the barrel bushing fit and link length. It was a "Baer" stamped Kart EZ Fit barrel which he used in his non-1.5" guns. So Kart fit the link. Baer wouldn't do me the courtesy of looking at pictures. I had to correct the barrel fit, which I was fortunate to do because there was enough metal there to do it. I needed to buy and EGW .203" slide stop to do it. Couple of years later I bought a take off Baer barrel, just had to see why it was removed from the pistol. Same type of poor fitting. But I will attest the gun does run. I have built several 1911's and I can tell you there is no reason for some of those obvious issues to be sent out the door. I believe the reasons are two fold - 1.)personnel turn over in the fitting stages; 2.)He doesn't do a thorough check of the guns before they ship or he ignores issues.

Read enough on Baer fitting issues, some which are major but not readily seen, and I think you'll find the Wilson would be the most feasible purchase. Unless Baer custom has started doing it right, I don't see the value because there is considerable probability there will be an issue he doesn't care to deal with. And he is renowned for not wanting to deal with customer concerns.

All that said, if you get a Baer and it works correctly and is properly fitted, you will have a good gun that will last.
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Last edited by Magnumite; 08-02-2018 at 07:11 AM.
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  #47  
Old 08-02-2018, 08:22 AM
regalsc regalsc is online now
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How would I check the barrel fit on my Baer. It’s a concept V. It has never malfunctioned when I load the 1st round by slingshot it’s so smooth there isn’t the kerchuk if you will like from other 1911’s. It’s accurate but I’m still curious on how to check for barrel fit. I’m only handy enough to fieldstrip. I would have someone else detail strip.
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  #48  
Old 08-02-2018, 10:38 AM
Magnumite Magnumite is online now
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You would look for shiny spots where the lugs interface with the slide and slide stop pin. Also upper lugs and grooves on the barrel, sides of the barrel hood, the barrel's lower barrel lugs and the back of the lower lugs for VIS strike. What I noticed on mine was only the outside of one lower lug was striking the stop pin, and the of the fitting tabs in the rear barrel locking groove were grossly uneven side to side. Additionally, one side of the barrel hood exhibited a super shiny, impacted appearance. Reason for all this it the barrel hood was fitted to far to one side which caused the misfit in the other areas.
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  #49  
Old 08-02-2018, 11:35 PM
Area 1911 Area 1911 is offline
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Originally Posted by regalsc View Post
How would I check the barrel fit on my Baer. Itís a concept V. It has never malfunctioned when I load the 1st round by slingshot itís so smooth there isnít the kerchuk if you will like from other 1911ís. Itís accurate but Iím still curious on how to check for barrel fit. Iím only handy enough to fieldstrip. I would have someone else detail strip.
I have a brand new Concept V that i haven't shot yet but i eventually will shoot it and i hope there is no malfunctions like yours.

I really enjoy learning a lot from people who know way more than i know about 1911's that is for sure. I would hope one of these days i will be as good as some on this forum but for now if i have any problems with my Baer i will be seeking the advice from some pro's here on 1911forum first.
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  #50  
Old 08-03-2018, 12:26 AM
oak1971 oak1971 is offline
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My Baer was and is what I call, well fit. If anyone has had a chance to operate an old lathe or milling machine from the 40's or 50's it's the best comparison I can make on the frame/slide fit. It glides, with zero and I mean zero play. None. Nada. Zip. Lock up is bank vault solid. My Dan Wesson Valor is very close, but not there.
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