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  #1  
Old 02-28-2020, 02:52 PM
cavelamb cavelamb is offline
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Socialistic Ideology in America

We've seen a lot of comments that boil down to "It doesn't make any sense".

I wanted to share this from Allysa Ahlgren because it DOES make sense and
might help us better understand what we are facing.

Quote:
The rise in popularity of a socialistic ideology, primarily among young Americans,
has less to do with economic policy and a fiscal mindset and has more to do with
cosmic justice.

Great economist and thinker Thomas Sowell coined the term “cosmic justice,” and
describes it as going beyond simply applying the same rules and standards to everyone,
known as equal opportunity, to seeking blanket equality of social and fiscal outcome.

Sowell calls it “one of the impossible dreams which has a very high cost and very
dangerous potentialities.”

Proponents of socialism are not thinking on economic terms, they’re thinking on arbitrary
terms of universal equality; a seemingly empathetic goal with drastically unempathetic means.

Equal outcome sounds great in theory because the theory presupposes the outcome is a
successful one. However, it is much easier to bring down the successful than to lift up the
unsuccessful.

A team is only as strong as its weakest link, as it is so with socialism.
In reality, equal outcome does not mean equal success but equal mediocrity; more accurately,
equal oppression.

If achieving cosmic justice (something of which will never be possible) is a driving force behind
the socialist mentality, then why would advocating for the destruction of free-will and the liberty
to engage in consensual transactions of capitalism be the crux of the platform?

After all, socialism is just about alleviating unjust oppression, right? It seems paradoxical to
alleviate oppression through the oppression of individual freedom.

However, this illogical rationale is easily dismissed by supporters of socialism due to one powerful
drug – selfishness.

Alyssa R. Ahlgren
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Last edited by cavelamb; 02-28-2020 at 02:55 PM.
  #2  
Old 02-28-2020, 04:51 PM
justjed justjed is offline
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I can describe socialism in two words: Ignorant jealousy.
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  #3  
Old 02-28-2020, 04:56 PM
combat auto combat auto is offline
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Yes, agree with above post...I think whoever wrote the article is quite naive. Socialism is about control plain and simple, control by government and other ego-manics who get their rocks off on control, of individuals.

Socialist leaders are not altruistic, it is merely a facade. Just examine what they say vs how they live their lives.

Why young want to be part of it: free stuff, and wanting to be part of their crowd. Peer pressure at that age is a very strong force. They have an Internet Mommy in AOC who tells them how to act, look, and think. They have a Granddaddy in Bernie who is going to pay for everything.
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Last edited by combat auto; 02-28-2020 at 05:08 PM.
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Old 02-28-2020, 05:45 PM
jamiesaun jamiesaun is offline
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Man, that paper is right on the money. That's exactly the kind of stuff I'm finding while gathering info for my own dissertation. They think everyone, meaning everybody except white males, has the right to happiness, not the pursuit of happiness. The white males among them, which is almost all of them by the way, will escape the wrath because they atone sufficiently.

Coincidentally my window got bigger, but then I went to facebook Jail again. I just have a few more questions I need answered, so gotta pretend like i care for now.
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  #5  
Old 02-28-2020, 05:58 PM
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I quote the above from the article:
"Proponents of socialism are not thinking on economic terms, they’re thinking on arbitrary
terms of universal equality; a seemingly empathetic goal with drastically unempathetic means."


They ARE NOT thinking on terms of universal equality - that is only their propaganda line; they are thinking (like all would be dictators in history) of an elite ruling class, either on person, or a single controlling party, or some controlling group that mandates what equality is for the rulers and is FAR different for everyone else. This has been around since man was thrown out of the Garden of Eden, and has not changed since. It is completely founded in "coveting they neighbors wife, and everything that is thy neighbors" - very, very, simple really.
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  #6  
Old 02-28-2020, 06:09 PM
combat auto combat auto is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpas50AE View Post
I quote the above from the article:
"Proponents of socialism are not thinking on economic terms, they’re thinking on arbitrary
terms of universal equality; a seemingly empathetic goal with drastically unempathetic means."

They ARE NOT thinking on terms of universal equality - that is only their propaganda line; they are thinking (like all would be dictators in history) of an elite ruling class, either on person, or a single controlling party, or some controlling group that mandates what equality is for the rulers and is FAR different for everyone else. This has been around since man was thrown out of the Garden of Eden, and has not changed since. It is completely founded in "coveting they neighbors wife, and everything that is thy neighbors" - very, very, simple really.
Quote:
Originally Posted by combat auto View Post
Yes, agree with above post...I think whoever wrote the article is quite naive. Socialism is about control plain and simple, control by government and other ego-manics who get their rocks off on control, of individuals.

Socialist leaders are not altruistic, it is merely a facade. Just examine what they say vs how they live their lives.

Why young want to be part of it: free stuff, and wanting to be part of their crowd. Peer pressure at that age is a very strong force. They have an Internet Mommy in AOC who tells them how to act, look, and think. They have a Granddaddy in Bernie who is going to pay for everything.
Well put G50, we have a match. They are so full of crap it isn't hard to figure them out.
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  #7  
Old 02-28-2020, 06:17 PM
jamiesaun jamiesaun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpas50AE View Post
I quote the above from the article:
"Proponents of socialism are not thinking on economic terms, they’re thinking on arbitrary
terms of universal equality; a seemingly empathetic goal with drastically unempathetic means."


They ARE NOT thinking on terms of universal equality - that is only their propaganda line; they are thinking (like all would be dictators in history) of an elite ruling class, either on person, or a single controlling party, or some controlling group that mandates what equality is for the rulers and is FAR different for everyone else. This has been around since man was thrown out of the Garden of Eden, and has not changed since. It is completely founded in "coveting they neighbors wife, and everything that is thy neighbors" - very, very, simple really.
Well it depends on who we're talking about, the sheep or the wolves. In other words, the idiots that are for this crap have no idea that it won't go well for them. They also have no idea that they will be the first ones loaded on a train.
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Last edited by jamiesaun; 02-28-2020 at 06:29 PM.
  #8  
Old 02-28-2020, 06:39 PM
The War Wagon The War Wagon is offline
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  #9  
Old 02-28-2020, 06:40 PM
Sistema1927 Sistema1927 is offline
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Here is another two word description for this scourge: Sanctioned Theft.

We started down this rabbit hole when schools stopped teaching history. Even a tiny bit of knowledge regarding the results of Socialism would have kept us from getting to the point we have reached.
  #10  
Old 02-28-2020, 06:49 PM
nod nod is offline
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^^^^^ Correct...
  #11  
Old 02-28-2020, 07:26 PM
1970MP 1970MP is offline
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I find it funny that people hate European socialism, but fully embrace European fascism.

You do know that America has socialism in spades, right? What about taxes, public school and the BIG ONE corporate socialism.

Sanders and Warren are not talking about government taking over businesses, restocking with fed or nepotistic employees. They are talking about reversing some (not all) of the corporate socialism.

So, my opinion is that the real difference between the parties is that Republicans embrace corporate socialism (in the hope of trickle down.) We have seen the rich get a 20% increase, while the rest of us only average 2%. And, Democrats believe that billionaires don't make their fortunes in a vacuum. They either should have paid employees more, or should give more back (taxes.) Some Democrats go too far ..... forgiving student debt (which would never pass) is one example. The answer, my friends, is in the middle.

Ms Ahlgren has both missed the point as well as reported fallacies as fact and represented assumptions as truth.

You should also realize that if you are a Trump loyalist, you are the minority. What makes your ideas any more valid than that of the majority, except gerrymandering?

I think we would all be better off to discuss issues. The 2nd Amendment and immigration are two things that can cross lines. Bill Maher owns a gun, for pete's sake.
Remember that Obama deported a record number of illegals. Illegals make it more difficult for American minorities than for the majority. Rich business owners want the cheap labor that will not complain about horrid conditions, and the wealthy want inexpensive, easy child care, lawn work, etc.

So, lets talk about things we have in common, and work like a "free" people on our differences? Thanks for reading.

Last edited by 1970MP; 02-28-2020 at 07:30 PM.
  #12  
Old 02-28-2020, 07:43 PM
1970MP 1970MP is offline
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I think some have confused socialism with specific governments. Most failed governments lost validity due to tyranny, greed, mismanagement, etc. These are things that you should see, very clearly, in America, today. It has been growing for decades. Please read "Predator State," by James K. Galbraith.

Socialism, on its face, is nothing more than a philosophy. Socialism is certainly not a dynamic force for production, like capitalism. But, who are we to tell a people that their laid back lifestyle is wrong? Please equate socialism with our failed welfare policies.
  #13  
Old 02-28-2020, 08:10 PM
jamiesaun jamiesaun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1970MP View Post
I think some have confused socialism with specific governments. Most failed governments lost validity due to tyranny, greed, mismanagement, etc. These are things that you should see, very clearly, in America, today. It has been growing for decades. Please read "Predator State," by James K. Galbraith.

Socialism, on its face, is nothing more than a philosophy. Socialism is certainly not a dynamic force for production, like capitalism. But, who are we to tell a people that their laid back lifestyle is wrong? Please equate socialism with our failed welfare policies.


Socialism is a philosophy that kills incentive, period, and that's before it gets bad. Not to mention power always corrupts, always. It's the antithesis of what America is. Even having this conversation is insane. Our founders gave us a brand new political system that exploded and in some 250 odd years has become the best country ever, by far. Actually took way less than that amount of time. So, now that this experiment has worked...let's change it! Yeah. Let's change it for a system that fails time and time again! Super smart.

Also, i don't want to pay for some lazy ass deadbeat. They want to be laid back and not work? Fine. Let em starve.

Agreed our country already has too much socialism though. We agree on that much at least.
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Last edited by jamiesaun; 02-28-2020 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 02-28-2020, 08:15 PM
jamiesaun jamiesaun is offline
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LOL!


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  #15  
Old 02-28-2020, 08:17 PM
jamiesaun jamiesaun is offline
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Got em for days. Days and days. I could fill an entire thread with these. Always gotta be ready, just waiting to pounce on any opportunity to use them.

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  #16  
Old 02-28-2020, 08:18 PM
jamiesaun jamiesaun is offline
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From the Bernie Bros themselves. This is how they justify they're crap.

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  #17  
Old 02-28-2020, 08:29 PM
random425056 random425056 is offline
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I know I'm going against the popular opinion here, but doesn't Bernie support a lot of what FDR pushed for in the 1940s? Weren't they also calling FDR an evil socialist? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6bQg8J0TPQ

We had a sitting president 80 years ago pushing much of the same ideas. I really don't see what's so radical, unless you just don't want change. It seems a good idea to me to rebuild our broken infrastructure, stop the endless wars we've been in for a generation, adopting a successful healthcare system like they have in Scandinavian countries, etc.

Additionally, he's been consistent on the issues and doesn't take bribes from donors like most other Democrats and Republicans do. Sure, you can disagree with him on policy but to say that's he's the next Hitler or Stalin is just downright silly.
  #18  
Old 02-28-2020, 08:37 PM
Welder Guy Welder Guy is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justjed View Post
I can describe socialism in two words: Ignorant jealousy.
Two more words: Government slavery.
Thats what people become under socialism. Slaves. The government tells you where to live, what job you can have, what you drive, when you can get healthcare, where your kids will go to school and what they “learn”, etc. And when you’re no longer useful to the state, you get shipped of to the gulag or worse.
  #19  
Old 02-28-2020, 08:39 PM
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This morning a news article on CNN said that 54% of Americans under the age of 30 had either a favorable view of socialism or identified as socialists themselves. Something to think about, especially with a major election coming up.

Beyond that, this is off-topic as it's not about guns or the Second Amendment.
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