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  #1  
Old 03-23-2019, 06:55 AM
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Johnny handgun Johnny handgun is online now
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Indiana Teachers Say They Were Shot “Execution Style”

OMGosh, you can’t make this stuff up!!!

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...-training.html
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Old 03-23-2019, 07:22 AM
Timbo3 Timbo3 is offline
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What a bunch of sissies!
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Old 03-23-2019, 07:48 AM
The War Wagon The War Wagon is offline
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[QUOTE=Johnny handgun;12779932]Indiana Teachers Say They Were Shot “Execution Style”/QUOTE]



NOT if they lived to TELL about it... duhhhh...
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  #4  
Old 03-23-2019, 07:52 AM
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Exposure to reality can be intimidating to snowflakes; what they should have learned, instead of indignance, is that reality is not always fair and to never give up the fight in a REAL life or death situation.
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  #5  
Old 03-23-2019, 08:06 AM
Plantar5 Plantar5 is offline
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Think they learned anything??....nah.
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  #6  
Old 03-23-2019, 08:23 AM
FightinTXAggie FightinTXAggie is offline
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Realistic active shooter training...

I think what these sheltered folks were expecting was for the training officers to realistically act out an actual school shooting by hand-delivering Starbucks coffee to each teacher, while asking them if there was anything they could do to make them more comfortable while they waited for the 'authorities' to arrive to save them, and thus complete the training...


Seriously, though. If there were four of us against this wall, and one cried out in surprise and/or outrage at getting shot with a painful projectile, I would think that instant anger would lead to immediate retaliation against the shooter by the others, before the same thing happened to them---that's just a normal response, right? Not to mention, the missed opportunity to rush the shooter 4-on-1 before kneeling at the wall to begin with. Isn't that what training should be about?

It's no wonder our country is in such trouble, with these sheltered misfit idiots having brought up and taught the last generation or two of our youth.
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Old 03-23-2019, 08:47 AM
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tgt_usa tgt_usa is offline
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Shot four!!! times

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny handgun View Post
OMGosh, you can’t make this stuff up!!!

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...-training.html
Arriving home after a force-on-force class, I recall counting: 36 welts on my torso; six bleeding scratches on my support hand; and a bruise under a finger-nail. The welts were where a plastic AirSoft BB hit the breathing holes in the body-armour. The scratches a BB hitting skin with bone right underneath. Until writing this post I’d tell interested students this, considering these minor injuries a significant part of the learning process (and bragging - “You oughta seen the other guys.”). The most valuable lesson being:

It’s more important not to be shot than to shoot.

Seeing this in writing, I see it may not have been the most effective sales pitch.

:- j
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Old 03-23-2019, 08:51 AM
Nitro.45 Nitro.45 is offline
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Originally Posted by Plantar5 View Post
Think they learned anything??....nah.
Unfortunately, I think they just hate guns more. Especially the wussy that “complained”. Just more of the “run away from the bully” crap. What level of altercation does it take to make these pansies fight back? Or isn’t there a level? They should be asked the question before they even start the exercise, “do you intend to just die quietly curled up in a ball of snot”, or is your intention to at least TRY and fight back? Pick up a damn desk, use it as a shield and rush the guy, throw staplers, shoes.........something!
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  #9  
Old 03-23-2019, 09:11 AM
scw2 scw2 is offline
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Originally Posted by FightinTXAggie View Post
Seriously, though. If there were four of us against this wall, and one cried out in surprise and/or outrage at getting shot with a painful projectile, I would think that instant anger would lead to immediate retaliation against the shooter by the others, before the same thing happened to them---that's just a normal response, right? Not to mention, the missed opportunity to rush the shooter 4-on-1 before kneeling at the wall to begin with. Isn't that what training should be about?
What are the teachers supposed to do?

Pick up a chair and gently attack a police officer, who is posing as an assailant, with the chair, to make it more realistic? Could that get even more out of hand in a hurry???????

Knock a fake assailant down???????

Of course, all this assumes the article is correct and the picture is real, which is a big assumption considering that reporters are on a deadline and often screw up stories.
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  #10  
Old 03-23-2019, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Nitro.45 View Post
Unfortunately, I think they just hate guns more. Especially the wussy that “complained”. Just more of the “run away from the bully” crap. What level of altercation does it take to make these pansies fight back? Or isn’t there a level? They should be asked the question before they even start the exercise, “do you intend to just die quietly curled up in a ball of snot”, or is your intention to at least TRY and fight back? Pick up a damn desk, use it as a shield and rush the guy, throw staplers, shoes.........something!
Yes, that is reality. Children's desks would be around and available. But is that too realistic?
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  #11  
Old 03-23-2019, 09:15 AM
YVK YVK is offline
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You all look so tough behind your keyboards.


Every single credible FOF class not only informs participants if sims or AS guns will be used ahead of the time that but also tells you to wear protective gear and what gear to use. Every single participant gets this info conveyed to, before every single class. If this was not done and teachers were allowed to participate unprepared, that speaks for unprofessional attitude of trainers and teachers have every right to complain. Reading the article, I dont have a good understanding what went to the prep, so I'll won't get into my tough internet gun armchair guy posture just yet.
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  #12  
Old 03-23-2019, 09:28 AM
UncleEd UncleEd is offline
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Yeah, too bad one of the teachers didn't have
the guts to grab a pencil and jam it through
the eye of one of the trainers.

Or as has been suggested grab a desk and
brain one of the trainers or maybe even two
of them.

Now those would be real training experiences!
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  #13  
Old 03-23-2019, 09:58 AM
FightinTXAggie FightinTXAggie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scw2 View Post
What are the teachers supposed to do?

Pick up a chair and gently attack a police officer, who is posing as an assailant, with the chair, to make it more realistic? Could that get even more out of hand in a hurry???????

Knock a fake assailant down???????

Of course, all this assumes the article is correct and the picture is real, which is a big assumption considering that reporters are on a deadline and often screw up stories.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleEd View Post
Yeah, too bad one of the teachers didn't have
the guts to grab a pencil and jam it through
the eye of one of the trainers.

Or as has been suggested grab a desk and
brain one of the trainers or maybe even two
of them.

Now those would be real training experiences!
How about just show a little gumption?

It is a training exercise; everyone present, officers and staff, are well aware of that...I bet someone just standing up, turning around, and getting pissed---you know, standing up for themselves and starting to protect themselves---would get a big 'ol round of applause from the officers, and a Gold Star for the day.

Nobody is trying to be an internet Tough Guy. Nobody trying to be Bruce Willis here. I doubt it would be necessary to kill one of the training officers in order to get their point across, that they were willing/going to fight, not just give up and get 'executed' (like what happened, apparently, to all involved).

Come on, guys...use your heads a little. Or, tell us what YOU think the training is attempting to accomplish. Just a great opportunity to pelt the local teachers with Airsoft, "Execution Style", then go out for a beer?
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  #14  
Old 03-23-2019, 10:14 AM
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If they hadn't been shot without warning the trainers would've never gotten the point across. And the point is that life isn't fair and you don't get to be prepared for it when it happens for real.
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  #15  
Old 03-23-2019, 10:18 AM
UncleEd UncleEd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FightinTXAggie View Post
How about just show a little gumption?

It is a training exercise; everyone present, officers and staff, are well aware of that...I bet someone just standing up, turning around, and getting pissed---you know, standing up for themselves and starting to protect themselves---would get a big 'ol round of applause from the officers, and a Gold Star for the day.

Nobody is trying to be an internet Tough Guy. Nobody trying to be Bruce Willis here. I doubt it would be necessary to kill one of the training officers in order to get their point across, that they were willing/going to fight, not just give up and get 'executed' (like what happened, apparently, to all involved).

Come on, guys...use your heads a little. Or, tell us what YOU think the training is attempting to accomplish. Just a great opportunity to pelt the local teachers with Airsoft, "Execution Style", then go out for a beer?
The main question is did the trainers need to actually shoot the
teachers with pellets which the trainers probably knew WOULD
HURT the teachers?

Perhaps a loud "gun noise" would have been sufficient or even
a tap on the shoulder of a teacher to let them know they were
failing the exercise by being submissive.

But shooting them multiple times with the pellets, what nonsense!

Last edited by UncleEd; 03-23-2019 at 10:21 AM.
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  #16  
Old 03-23-2019, 10:26 AM
HT77 HT77 is offline
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They prefer to live in snowflake fantasy land where they ban guns and put up signs and that makes everyone safe.
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  #17  
Old 03-23-2019, 10:32 AM
earlwb earlwb is offline
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I am sure that the communists are proud, they are turning the people into cowards and weaklings who will do nothing but stand or cower there and die for them.
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  #18  
Old 03-23-2019, 11:24 AM
USMM guy USMM guy is online now
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You can not make this stuff up.

And there ain't no fixin stupid.
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  #19  
Old 03-23-2019, 11:48 AM
YVK YVK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsk View Post
If they hadn't been shot without warning the trainers would've never gotten the point across.
Being told to wear heavy protective clothing, cups, gloves etc because you're likely to get hurt, even if a little, not only doesn't prevent getting the point across, it actually starts delivering the point before exercises begin.
I've seen cops and retired military dudes gear up for FoF sim training in motorcycle leather and soft IBA. Must've been pussies who didn't measure up to the toughness of 1911forum crowd.
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Old 03-23-2019, 11:51 AM
scw2 scw2 is offline
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The story said that the teachers did not know they would be shot.

The picture of the supposed police officer/trainer looks like they trained on doughnuts and could be taken out with a mean stare in their direction. The picture looks like a fake.

I would not like anybody pointing something that looks like a weapon at me as a surprise. Real police have shot people for less.

Looks really stupid.

I probably would have gotten off the floor and said hey mother****er, don't do that again and point that somewhere else.
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Old 03-23-2019, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by YVK View Post
Must've been pussies who didn't measure up to the toughness of 1911forum crowd.
You have to remember, forums are social media. Social media is........
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  #22  
Old 03-23-2019, 01:57 PM
PolymerMan PolymerMan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandpas50AE View Post
Exposure to reality can be intimidating to snowflakes; what they should have learned, instead of indignance, is that reality is not always fair and to never give up the fight in a REAL life or death situation.
Setting aside the sheer seriousness of those active shooter drills... they look like they could be fun. Air-soft, laser-tag and paintball teams would jump at a chance to play role an active shooter scenario at some school facility.

... and the school authorities could possibly learn something as well from those play-role teams.
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  #23  
Old 03-23-2019, 05:08 PM
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Based on responses I'm familiar with from many years as an NTI practitioner, getting "executed" is traumatic, even in a FoF exercise, and even for people that are trained. Most of the people attending the NTI could be safely described as serious students of the art. I'm not surprised that teachers getting their first exposure were stressed.
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Old 03-23-2019, 05:30 PM
Vern Humphrey Vern Humphrey is offline
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They -- they disproved my imaginary universe and FORCED me to face reality!!
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  #25  
Old 03-23-2019, 07:13 PM
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The picture on the story shows two guns, one on the floor. So someone else was armed and got shot in the picture. That is not in the drill mentioned. Why was this fake picture included in the story?

Reality might be a bunch of twelve year old students around the teachers and teachers bravely trying to protect them and the students getting in the way of a rush by one or two teachers that would not work.

Reality would be the chance that the active shooter would not waste time lining anybody against a wall, keep some distance, and just keep quickly firing at one victim at a time until a pause took place to reload or pull out another weapon. Isn't this the likely scenario? Surprise, the shooter did not attend the drill and is not cooperating.

Reality might be that the school security guard might hide behind a pole and joke beforehand that if he pulled for his gun, french fries would come out of his holster? Parkland?

The drill was idiotic. If the shooter was going to give me the time at close quarters and this were not a drill, I hope I would have picked up a chair and not waited to get three other teachers moving. You might die either way. Do nothing or do something.

If someone charged the trainer with swinging chair unrehearsed in a training exercise, there is a chance that somebody would get hurt or things would spiral totally out of hand. The drill is fake there. If it is just a known drill, nobody is going to charge the trainer with a swinging chair and possibly get things really teats up with the police, the School Board, the teacher's union, etcetera all involved. Whose career is going down the tubes with this one?

This whole thread is a waste of my time. Goodbye.
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