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  #1  
Old 03-16-2017, 12:28 PM
scribe556 scribe556 is offline
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What hammer and sear set would you use?

I have a surplus BHP and would like to know which hammer and sear you've used to get an improved trigger from yours?

Thanks!

Last edited by scribe556; 03-16-2017 at 12:41 PM.
  #2  
Old 03-16-2017, 12:31 PM
Tom Horn Tom Horn is offline
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You will have to tighten up on you nomenclature.
There is no such thing as a "Gen 2" Hi Power.
Perhaps a picture?

As for Hi Powers in general, the stock parts are just fine. They can can be smoothed and fine tuned.
Some people like the hardened Cylinder and Slide sears and hammer, but they are pricy.
Doubt you could wear out the FN OEM parts in a lifetime. Better to keep fresh springs in it and that will prevent excess wearing of all the parts.

Last edited by Tom Horn; 03-16-2017 at 12:35 PM.
  #3  
Old 03-16-2017, 12:42 PM
scribe556 scribe556 is offline
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What hammer and sear set would you use?

Fixed the post, I was thinking of something else while I was writing.... meant mkII

Good info on the OEM parts, thanks.

Will try a spring set first

Last edited by scribe556; 03-16-2017 at 02:35 PM.
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  #4  
Old 03-16-2017, 01:03 PM
Tom Horn Tom Horn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scribe556 View Post
Fixed the post, I was thinking of something else while I was writing....
Yes, we know what you were thinking - the G word. For Shame!!!

Avoid Wolff Springs. Too many problems.
BHSpring Solutions are owned by 2 members of this forum. They have been in business for over a year now with zero complaints. Try them instead.
I think you'll be happy you did. www.bhspringsolutions.com

Last edited by Tom Horn; 03-16-2017 at 01:06 PM.
  #5  
Old 03-16-2017, 01:18 PM
jaypee jaypee is offline
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Are you saying that you're replacing the hammer and sear only to get a better trigger pull? Is there anything wrong with the old ones? The reason I ask is that installing a new hammer and sear won't necessarily get you a better trigger pull, and it's kind of pricey to boot. If the existing parts are in good condition, you can usually arrive at a satisfactory trigger pull without going through all the expense of replacing them.
  #6  
Old 03-16-2017, 01:55 PM
dj528 dj528 is offline
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To answer your original question: Garrhwaite or (if still available) Warner.
  #7  
Old 03-16-2017, 02:38 PM
scribe556 scribe556 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaypee View Post
If the existing parts are in good condition, you can usually arrive at a satisfactory trigger pull without going through all the expense of replacing them.


Can you expand on this? I'd like to know more if you're willing...
  #8  
Old 03-16-2017, 04:49 PM
GBertolet GBertolet is offline
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Cylinder and Slide's hammer and sear, are probably one of the best aftermarket parts available. A good trigger is achieved by more than just replacing those two parts. As mentioned previously, if your stock hammer and sear are in decent shape, a great trigger can be obtained using those parts. Your mainspring and sear spring tension, can affect your pull greatly also. Also removing your magazine disconnect will inprove your pull also. You will have to deceide if you want to disconnect this feature. The Cylinder and Slide trigger has no provision for this anyway. I would contact BHSpringSolutions for their advice on which of their performance replacement springs to purchase. It certainly would be a whole lot cheaper.

Last edited by GBertolet; 03-16-2017 at 04:55 PM.
  #9  
Old 03-16-2017, 05:08 PM
jaypee jaypee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scribe556 View Post
Can you expand on this? I'd like to know more if you're willing...

Sure, I'll try. Sometimes fellows new to the BHP get the false impression that the first thing they have to do to get a satisfactory trigger pull is to start replacing parts with expensive new factory parts or custom parts. In fact, it becomes almost conventional wisdom on the internet gun forums that replacing the hammer and sear with custom parts will cure all of the ills in BHP triggers. Neither is necessarily true. If your present parts are in good working order, a good gunsmith can deliver a satisfactory trigger pull without the need to buy expensive replacement parts. And the problem may have nothing to do with the hammer or the sear at all, in which case new ones are a real waste of money. Also, the hammer and sear are not drop-in parts, and simply replacing them without skilled hand-fitting will not usually give you the results you are looking for. So moving directly into an expensive program of parts replacement right from the gitgo may not deliver the results you're looking for. There are some other alternatives you might want to consider beforehand.

Now, if your present parts are serviceable but you're uncomfortable with them and want to buy new ones, then go for it. Your effectiveness with your pistol in a defensive situation can depend on the confidence you have in the pistol, so if the parts in question will have an adverse effect on that confidence, that's plenty of good reason to replace them.

I hope this clarifies things a bit.

JayPee

Last edited by jaypee; 03-16-2017 at 05:11 PM.
  #10  
Old 03-16-2017, 06:26 PM
jmstr jmstr is offline
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I have had stock and unmodified hammer/sears- with both crisp [heavy-7lbish] or gritty [heavy- 7lbish] triggers.

I have modified stock hammer/sear/springs and had the factory stuff be reliable with a trigger pull around 4.75lbs and crisp- but longish [BHPesque] reset.

I have had Garthwaite trigger and hammer with EGW sear and liked it.

I have had C&S trigger and hammer/sear and liked it.

I now have Warner hammer/sears and like them even more.

The Warner hammer/sears required the least stoning to get a trigger pull I was comfortable with [as in, I didn't stone anything], but it isn't as light as I was able to get with Gartwaite/EGW combo or C&S combo [when I stoned the sear and hammer hooks for smoothest engagement].

I'd say the Warners feel about 1lb heavier than my 'best' job with either of the two aftermarket companies listed. And about 1.5-2lbs heavier than my 'best' job with factory FN hammer/sear parts.


I just got the SFS system, but haven't installed it yet. Looking forward to it.

I will convert a 9mm and a .40 to SFS. I will leave the Warner parts in a 9mm and .40, and leave a set of factory parts in a third pair.


The moral of all of this? There is not a necessity to change any parts for a great trigger. Stoning the parts and adjusting springs is all that is needed for smooth/crisp BHP trigger feel. But it is SURE FUN to try!

However, if you do NOT understand sear/hammer break angles, stoning, or any other gunsmithing processes, you shouldn't fool with the parts. Have a 'smith do it.

If you are used to the drop-in reliability of a Ghost connector [and all you did was plug/play], I'd avoid having the work done. Heck, with my Ghost connector, I not only had to adjust the length and angle [Spiegel cut?], but I had to polish/tweak the engagement surface of the striker foot so that it was smooth but created full engagement of the striker foot as well. The Ghost part wasn't lined up right and created about 40% engagement due to the angles.

If what was said is confusing- have another repair it/adjust it. There are some great 'smiths around.



That said, for someone with good technical understanding and skills, and who has patience, doing it yourself can be rewarding.

The above were my experiences. If you want 'plug and play', you aren't likely to find it in a BHP or 1911- that is for plastic framed wonders [and I have a few of those too.]
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Last edited by jmstr; 03-16-2017 at 06:28 PM.
  #11  
Old 03-16-2017, 07:46 PM
sanguo sanguo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scribe556 View Post
I have a surplus BHP and would like to know which hammer and sear you've used to get an improved trigger from yours?

Thanks!
Dropping in an SFS kit in addition to removing the mag disconnect and installing a 2 coil trigger return spring (if it doesn't already have one) will improve the trigger pull on a surplus gun.

If the trigger feels gritty, you might also might try taking a file to the part of the frame where the trigger bar contacts it, as well as the trigger bar, to smooth that contact area, and lube it. That's only necessary if the takeup is gritty.

I've tried it on two - it improved the trigger of both a stock BHP, and it improved the trigger of an Arcus.
  #12  
Old 03-17-2017, 12:53 AM
Che Che is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scribe556 View Post
I have a surplus BHP and would like to know which hammer and sear you've used to get an improved trigger from yours?

Thanks!
Removing the magazine disconnect was the only thing I did on my BHP when I got it 35 years ago. The High Power trigger is its own entity and with practice you will master it.

"Amateurs Practice Until They Get It Right; Professionals Practice Until They Can’t Get It Wrong."

-or- "Beware the Man that owns One gun"
  #13  
Old 03-17-2017, 05:59 AM
Bob Reed Bob Reed is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguo View Post
If the trigger feels gritty, you might also might try taking a file to the part of the frame where the trigger bar contacts it, as well as the trigger bar, to smooth that contact area, and lube it.
Sanguo - with all due respect, please do yourself and everyone else a favor by learning and using the correct names of the parts.
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  #14  
Old 03-17-2017, 07:34 AM
VIS35 VIS35 is offline
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My Hi Powers all have the stock trigger assembly. I learned years ago, when shooting bulls-eye to concentrate on nothing but the sights. I still ( even at 70 ) try to do the same. So IMHO, I'd leave things alone.
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Last edited by VIS35; 03-17-2017 at 07:36 AM.
  #15  
Old 03-17-2017, 09:17 AM
sanguo sanguo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Horn View Post
You will have to tighten up on you nomenclature.
There is no such thing as a "Gen 2" Hi Power.
Perhaps a picture?

As for Hi Powers in general, the stock parts are just fine. They can can be smoothed and fine tuned.
Some people like the hardened Cylinder and Slide sears and hammer, but they are pricy.
Doubt you could wear out the FN OEM parts in a lifetime. Better to keep fresh springs in it and that will prevent excess wearing of all the parts.
Why so salty? OP doesn't 'have' to tighten up on anything.
Gen 2, Mark 2, we know what he's talking about.

Regarding OP's question, all the things are true. If you want a prefitted drop in that is good value, my experience is that the SFS system is the best 'deal.'
Or, buy a $25 sear and put it in a vice and start practicing to see how altering its geometry alters your pull!

Last edited by sanguo; 03-17-2017 at 01:23 PM.
  #16  
Old 03-17-2017, 01:25 PM
sanguo sanguo is offline
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Originally Posted by Bob Reed View Post
Sanguo - with all due respect, please do yourself and everyone else a favor by learning and using the correct names of the parts.
How can I call something a lever that's not a lever? It's not applying leverage. It's being pushed to actuate the sear lever.

That's a bar.

Perhaps the most correct name for it is the trigger transfer bar?

Yeah, that makes sense.
  #17  
Old 03-17-2017, 03:46 PM
scribe556 scribe556 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguo View Post
Dropping in an SFS kit in addition to removing the mag disconnect and installing a 2 coil trigger return spring (if it doesn't already have one) will improve the trigger pull on a surplus gun.

If the trigger feels gritty, you might also might try taking a file to the part of the frame where the trigger bar contacts it, as well as the trigger bar, to smooth that contact area, and lube it. That's only necessary if the takeup is gritty.

I've tried it on two - it improved the trigger of both a stock BHP, and it improved the trigger of an Arcus.

Thanks Sanguo, I think this solution gets me a long way without doing the hammer and sear.
  #18  
Old 03-17-2017, 04:34 PM
Burgs Burgs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguo View Post
How can I call something a lever that's not a lever? It's not applying leverage. It's being pushed to actuate the sear lever.

That's a bar.

Perhaps the most correct name for it is the trigger transfer bar?

Yeah, that makes sense.
Sanguo,

You need to stop giving answers. In less than one month and 159 posts you've gone from "I'm an new guy who just bought my first gun" to mister wise ass/instant expert with all the answers.

Just above you're giving SFS advise. Based on what? Based on all your extensive SFS experience?
Because you bought one and might install it one day???

You know nothing. All of your answers are PLAGIARIZED from other members.
You've read no books, you've done no study, you just steal answers previously offered by other members, just so you can hear yourself type - 159 posts worth in a little over 3 weeks.

Some members, those who are not posers, like to think of this forum at THE paragon of Hi Power facts and truthful information. Facts such as correct nomenclature and what laws impact our hobby are important. These subjects require specific questions and even more specific and truthful answers. Sloppy responses, incorrect facts, and smartass retorts to those who provide the correct facts - as in your infamous Hi Power Butt Stock thread, help nobody.
If you yourself don't know know what the nomenclature should be, why are you giving smartass answers to those who use correct terminology? Are the rest of us supposed to devolve into your vacuum? Adapt to you own personal language? Perhaps you haven't stole the correct answer yet?
Yet, you love to give "authoritative" answers to almost each and every thread.

And, as for your objection to what you do or don't like about other people's responses, I would again like to draw the forum's attention to your punk replies to all of the established members who tried to point you in the legal direction regarding your illegal Hi Hi Power stock.
I would also like to point out to the members how you went back and edited the worst of your responses, which is too bad because you would have likely been banned for them. Have you ever apologized to all the members that tried to help you, after you finally took their recommendations? NO. You erased the most ignorant comments and acted innocent.

You have NO business telling anybody here how to behave. Your continued presence on this forum is becoming an insult to anybody who values genuine knowledge and truthfulness. You sir, are nothing less than a poser and a troll.

Furthermore, stop plagiarizing my postings. The photo of the serrated 1946 Danish contract front sight that you are so fond of using at every opportunity was originally posted by me in the "Old School Front Sight Question" thread, back in December of 2016. The only thing is that I honestly attributed it to its source, Anthony Vanderlinden's book, "FN Browning High Power Pistols". When you steal peoples prior posts, almost word for word, many of us who pay attention recognize them:

https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=704097

Here's your Prewar Belgian thread, where you asked the members to help you.
I invite the forum's attention to the OP's "courteous" answers. Keep in mind that just about every response made by the OP has been heavily edited:

https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=754650

Sangou, you have been found. It's time for you to bow out. Of course you won't.
Posers, trolls and instant experts never do. They can't help themselves. It's a sickness.
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"I've been up early my whole life, and all that ever did was increase the amount of time during the day something could go wrong." ~ Inspector O

Last edited by Burgs; 03-17-2017 at 08:16 PM.
  #19  
Old 03-17-2017, 08:08 PM
submoa submoa is offline
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^^^ THIS X ∞ ^^^

Mr. Burgs is expressing EXACTLY the conclusion arrived at by the established and well respected members here.

He speaks the truth PRECISELY...not a single word or thought out of place, and every word is fully justified…in spades.

If anything, Mr. Burgs is too kind to this…uhmmm, individual. An individual who started his very first thread 3 whole weeks ago asking for help and in the course of it stating he bought his very first firearm 3 whole months before. Yet within days he was already dispensing advice based upon his non-existent experience, insulting established members who were trying to help him, generally acting the arrogant fool and then going back and cleaning up his posts with the Edit function. Troll is fully descriptive.

I’ve avoided my beloved 1911/BHP for a week and a half now because this troll was turning it into his own little glockomania. Now I return and find him insulting 2 more extremely well respected members with his moronic statements.

ENOUGH…..
  #20  
Old 03-17-2017, 10:31 PM
Warthogge Warthogge is offline
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And the crowd roars.
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  #21  
Old 03-17-2017, 11:27 PM
Jäger Jäger is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burgs View Post
You have NO business telling anybody here how to behave. Your continued presence on this forum is becoming an insult to anybody who values genuine knowledge and truthfulness. You sir, are nothing less than a poser and a troll.
HA hahhahahaaaaaa... I knew you had less patience than I do!

Oh... and thank you! Somebody had to do it!

  #22  
Old 03-18-2017, 06:42 AM
sanguo sanguo is offline
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Wow, look at all the butthurt on here. I haven't seen old timers embarrassing themselves this much since I saw that awful movie with Jane Fonda and J-Lo.

A. Burgs, I never saw your post. Your plagiarism accusations are laughable. Also, I don't think you've ever *done* that to a firearm. I've done it to 3. If you have? Post the pictures. Put up, or shut up.

B. I've learned a whole lot here, indeed, and I've got helpful answers to my questions from a lot of people. As you can see on that prewar Belgian thread, people jumped in with responses to questions that I didn't have, people aligned with a certain 'set' that you seem to participate with. That's called hijacking.

C. You've got your couple of pals on here, but you've used someone else's thread to axe grind instead of actually bothering to try to help the OP. Again, hijacking.

D. I've now installed SFS in 4 different BHP platforms. How many have you installed it in?

E. The behavior patterns of the 'well respected' members here are rather obviously childish. It's the behavior of men who get no respect in their lives who try to search for a community to 'big dog' on others. I'm here to play and tinker with classic firearms, not to feed the egos of forum losers.

Burgs, the time for you and your fellow flying monkeys is over. Your self-superior, smug attitude is a disgrace to the platform, and attitudes and out-of-the-blue hostility like yours and Tom Horn's are going to be what, if anything, ever does finally kill the BHP market.

I do indeed think better of my posts sometime, and edit them, since they are not allowed to be burned in the Twainian fashion. This one, however, shall not be.

Last edited by sanguo; 03-18-2017 at 07:07 AM.
  #23  
Old 03-18-2017, 07:35 AM
ToddSig ToddSig is online now
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Thank you Burgs, your post was greatly needed and I would think supported by many on this forum.

Although, it is obvious he still does not get it or understands what a disruptive force he has become on the 1911 forum. I dont post often, preferring to listen and learn (and I have learned much from you, and nothing from this new member), and try to always be respectful, but I refuse to respond or participate to any of his posts or threads.

Last edited by ToddSig; 03-18-2017 at 07:38 AM.
  #24  
Old 03-18-2017, 07:44 AM
sanguo sanguo is offline
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Originally Posted by ToddSig View Post
Thank you Burgs, your post was greatly needed and I would think supported by many on this forum.

Although, it is obvious he still does not get it or understands what a disruptive force he has become on the 1911 forum. I dont post often, preferring to listen and learn (and I have learned much from you, and nothing from this new member), and try to always be respectful, but I refuse to respond or participate to any of his posts or threads.
Let's see.

I write posts, about my personal firearms, and offer advice based on my own admittedly small experience.

None of Burgs' complaints had anything to do with what I actually said, intending to help the OP.

None of you are interested in helping the OP.

This makes it pretty clear what you are all about here.

Good luck with your big dogging!
  #25  
Old 03-18-2017, 08:49 AM
BHP BHP is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanguo View Post
How can I call something a lever that's not a lever? It's not applying leverage. It's being pushed to actuate the sear lever.

That's a bar.

Perhaps the most correct name for it is the trigger transfer bar?

Yeah, that makes sense.
Perhaps you should take the nomenclature of the part up with FN/Browning. I'm sure they would be impressed with your expertise on the subject.

If you really came to this place originally looking for help/advice, which I'm beginning to doubt, I think that pool of information may be drying up very quickly. Talk about someone shooting them self in the foot.
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