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-   -   Chen/Legacy Custom Magwell (https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=171007)

Stan Chen 04-19-2007 04:46 PM

Chen/Legacy Custom Magwell
 
It's pretty much a given to most serious practical/tactical shooters that an enlarged mag well funnel of some sort gives a serious boost in the speed and/or consistency of the shooter’s reloads under stress. No less authority than The Great One himself, Rob Leatham, has written that he considers it the most important modification after good sights and trigger. This is especially true of the single stack 1911’s, as they do not benefit from the tapered magazine tops of the double stack designs.

These benefits are not just limited to the competition realm, but apply to fighting pistol applications as well. Single stack 1911’s, while arguably the most inherently shootable fighting pistol platform, do not hold that many rounds. Having to reload under stress, while engaging better armed/ multiple threats is a distinct possibility. Recent active shooter incidents, such as the one in the Salt Lake City mall, illustrate this well. Our local rural LEO’s are often 30 miles or more from the nearest backup. Let it be said, however, that no modification or gizmo can replace dedicated training and practice of weapon manipulation fundamentals.

Nonetheless, we can all use whatever edge we can get. To date our choices in enlarged mag wells/funnels have been

1.) A simple mag well bevel of the existing frame. This should be considered a minimum. It can be made much more effective by beveling back into the mainspring housing, done most effectively using a Legacy Custom MSH (shameless plug), which allows this modification without a knife edge at the rear of the well that can catch on mags and get beat up over time. This is a noticeable help, and a viable option for many users. However, we can do better, performance wise….

2.) S&A/ Wilson, etc. extended add on mag funnels. These are effective, relatively inexpensive, and easy to install. Their major disadvantage is that they extend below the frame of the 1911, adding unnecessary bulk, compromising concealability, and requiring the use of extended base pads. These pistols are big enough as is.

3.) Weld on/bolt on horseshoe shaped mag funnels, as installed by many of the modern master pistolsmiths. These are fantastic in that they give a very large opening, and add no length or width to the pistol. Their major disadvantage is that the horseshoe in the front prevents the shooter from stripping out the magazine, using the front lip of the base pad, in the event that the magazine becomes stuck in the pistol. They also require skilled installation.

So, if we could spec out the perfect mag well/funnel for the single stack 1911, the list might look like this:

1.) Dramatically increases mag well opening for speed and consistency while reloading under stress.
2.) Adds no length or width to the pistol, so that concealability is not compromised.
3.) Allows access to the magazine lip, so that the magazine can be forcefully extracted in the event it becomes stuck in the pistol.
4.) Be machined entirely from bar stock for strength, durability, and overall quality of final fit and finish.


(I suppose to be perfect, it would cost $15 and anyone could install it 5 minutes with a screwdriver. That’s not gonna happen, so let‘s not even consider it. :wink: )

We have a solution. I’m excited to introduce the Chen/Legacy Custom Magwell, designed from the ground up to meet ALL of our criteria outlined above (no snazzy name yet, but we're working on it!). It represents a tremendous amount of R&D and design work on my part, with the initial design concept beginning in 2003. It became quickly apparent to me that traditional machining techniques would not be adequate for bringing my vision to being in metal, as the machining of the required geometry and surfaces could not be done in the traditional manner. So I utilized solid modeling CAD/CAM technology to design the part and generate the required toolpaths in order to CNC machine the part using multiaxis interpolation (a fancy way of saying turning all the handles on the machine at the same time). This was all done completely in house, in my shop.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...6341384504.jpg


The entry angle was CAD/CAM’ed to be optimized at every point along the contour of the magwell; that is, it allows for the easiest insertion angle at any given point. Traditional magwells maintain a constant angle at all points along the contour, as they are cut with some form of a chamfer mill or countersink that is only capable of cutting a fixed angle. As illustrated with an original Brown magwell, one of the excellent long time standards in weld ons:.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...6341384505.jpg

As you can see, the front of the Chen/Legacy horseshoe has a geometry that is considerably reduced compared to traditional weld on magwells. As such, a single entry angle along the entire contour will not work, IF we want an optimized entry angle. On our magwell, the entry angle constantly changes, and is optimized, at every point along the contour of the front of the horseshoe. (I have pictures of this being machined, but don’t want to tie up more bandwidth, unless requested)

As installed, after some machining, TIGing (or you can just as easily braze), and blending. 0.300” is machined off the bottom of the frame and it is installed in the traditional weld on manner by a competent 1911 smith. After cutting several prototypes, we found it was necessary to go to 0.300" in order to accomodate the mag stripping feature.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...5941644861.jpg



http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...5941644862.jpg

The inside geometry was carefully designed to give the very maximum amount of funnel surface.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...5941644863.jpg

Of course, a Legacy Custom MSH is used..... :wink:

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...5941644864.jpg



Note the access notch in front. A stuck magazine can be forcefully extracted. The radius of the cut was designed so that the baseplate of a spare magazine can be used for extra leverage in ripping the sutck mag out. Simply cutting this notch in an existing magwell design is not totally satisfactory, as it does not blend with the inside contour that is already cut into the existing magwells. A totally new contour is needed, which is what we’ve done.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallf...6341384503.jpg




For the time being, these will be machined on a limited basis by me in my shop, until we get a shop on board to do production. As they are done on a more or less one off manner, they unfortunately won’t be inexpensive. Eventually I'd like to also offer the magwell packaged in a "suite" with my mainspring housings, with the rear bevel of the MSH already machined to match the contours of the magwell perfectly.

Drawings are already done for a Slim version, for use with thin grips or those who prefer the more low profile of a magwell tucked up under standard grips. Also, if there is sufficient demand, I might be talked into a bolt on version, for those who prefer not to weld.

Thanks for looking!

LW McVay 04-19-2007 05:39 PM

Mr. Chen,

Beautiful!! I've long wanted something like that. It is a true innovation that answers a lot of the questions.

How much $$ do you expect this mod will run?

Dave Berryhill 04-19-2007 05:42 PM

That's good stuff!

Bob Rodgers 04-20-2007 08:16 AM

Stan, my friend,

Multiaxis interpolation!!!

We have GOT to get you out of the shop for a while.

Come on over to Arkansas and we'll work on some single axis file manipulation. :p

It's a stunning piece of work!

blindhogg 04-23-2007 08:55 PM

Stan
Wow I am impressed, thats one sweet looking magwell. Far better than any alternatives out there IMO.
Keep up the good work.
Chris AKA Blindhogg

pistolwrench 04-23-2007 09:23 PM

As I stated on another forum.........
:confused:.....
these magwells are the new 'Gold Standard' in premium kit.
Stan has raised the bar once again.
:)
Form follows function, but an artist can seamlessly blend the two.

kel 04-24-2007 09:00 AM

Out of curiosity, how does this compare to Caspian's integral magwell? I have never seen one and that was the solution I was thinking of going with when the full custom day comes.

I am very impressed with the blending.

MiniDevil 04-24-2007 09:06 AM

I want one :mad:

Stan Chen 04-24-2007 10:30 AM

Fellas, thanks to everyone for the compliments, it's really appreciated!:)

Hey Bob, I'm gonna have to take you up on that offer, because having seen how YOU run a file, I've got a lot to learn from ya!

Blindhogg, thanks a bunch for encouraging me to explore new ways of doing things...it really had an effect on how this turned out.

Thanks Chuck, you know you'll always be my magwell hero....:)

I sincerely hope 1911 shooters will enjoy the function of this magwell.

bjg-1911 04-26-2007 07:16 PM

EB magwell-lol
 
Hey Stan,
Looks like you put the EB magwell I sent you to good use. The changing of the front radius was a very creative way to help getting hold of the mag when jammed or stuck,which in my opinion was the only drawback to the elegant design of the EB weld-on magwell :):):)...very nice solution.
Sincerely-Barry

Webbo 04-26-2007 10:50 PM

So when do you start accepting work orders? Because that is gorgeous!

RMPSTRAT 04-27-2007 12:01 AM

That is a nice piece of work, beefy as well.

TGR 04-28-2007 06:51 PM

I like it a lot. Very cool and well thought-out design. Beautiful install!!!!!!!!!!!

Alston 04-29-2007 12:14 AM

Wow- I'd like to buy 3 of those right now, along with a Legacy Custom housing.

How much, sir? This is really the nicest I've ever seen, the geometry of the changing angle as it changes from 'side' to 'front' is awesome, and make the well much more accessible than any others I've seen.

Alston

dubb-1 04-29-2007 01:11 AM

I've admired your quest for perfection since the "Lightspeed" days. Guys, this isn't lip service, that is THE WELD ON MAGWELL!

Be well!

greco 05-01-2007 09:49 AM

Another masterpiece of the gunsmith's art. Congratulations.:)

ddt944 10-20-2009 08:43 AM

Hey Stan I went to your website and wanted to know like everyone else how much is the housing and magwell and what is turn around time. Beautiful stuff! Thanks!

Ricky T 10-20-2009 09:10 AM

As this thread is over two years old, you should probably direct your question to Stan via email or phone.

DGI 05-15-2012 09:15 AM

Im bringing this thread back from the dead for those who dont know this product exists...

I just ordered mine from Brownells (as instructed to do so by Stan's site) and cant wait to get it installed... Finding this product has decided the direction of a project!!!

Greg Derr 05-15-2012 09:59 AM

Stan's magwell's are the industry standard for weld ons.

railin93 05-15-2012 10:43 AM

Looking to get one of these. Gonna try the EGW weld on as well on a lesser pistol to see how I like them. Chen's magwell is like the grail of the magwell world. Does anyone know a smith in the Georgia state lines that is experienced and very familiar with install requirements for them?

6285108 05-15-2012 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by railin93 (Post 3871304)
Looking to get one of these. Gonna try the EGW weld on as well on a lesser pistol to see how I like them. Chen's magwell is like the grail of the magwell world. Does anyone know a smith in the Georgia state lines that is experienced and very familiar with install requirements for them?

Super old thread...In GA John Harrison

Tim Burke 05-15-2012 05:04 PM

That's who installed mine.

hooks 05-15-2012 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGI (Post 3871196)
Im bringing this thread back from the dead for those who dont know this product exists...

I just ordered mine from Brownells (as instructed to do so by Stan's site) and cant wait to get it installed... Finding this product has decided the direction of a project!!!


I'm ordering one too ...:D

rdinak 05-15-2012 08:07 PM

and who says an old thread can not still make a meaningful contribution?


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