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-   -   Tactical Shotgun Education Needed (https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=994980)

Autonomous 07-02-2019 12:52 PM

Tactical Shotgun Education Needed
 
We are planning on spending some time camping in brown bear country and I am exploring my defense options.
I need to learn about modern tactical style shotguns. There is a lot of new stuff on the market. I like the idea of magazine feed though I understand the top round in the mag can deform if it is left in the gun against the bolt.
The semi-auto feature is compelling as long as it is reliable.
Now, a fly in the ointment. I am right handed but have glaucoma in my right eye. With handguns I simply turn my head to the right to line my left eye up with sights. I'm skeptical this will be practical with a long gun.
Thoughts?

blastjv 07-02-2019 01:15 PM

Though a slug gun might be just the ticket to have in your hands when fighting off a brown bear, I think a better strategy might be to have a powerful handgun on you at all times. You won’t be carrying a shotgun around all day, and bad luck would dictate that you wouldn’t have it at hand at the moment you need it.

Having said all of that. There a great, reliable semi auto shotguns these days. I would not hesitate to call on my Beretta 1301 Tactical. Though people tend to think of pumps as so much more reliable than semis, the truth is that people jam their pumps up all the time by short stroking them while trying to go fast, which can’t happen w a semi. It’s all a balance.

HarryO45 07-02-2019 03:33 PM

I would focus more on what shotgun you can shoot and hit quickly. I wouldn’t worry about “tactical” (whatever that means). I would focus on guns that have a safety location that you have the most experience with, a gun that is most natural ~ “mindless” operation. Me, I would get a proven tube fed auto shotgun that is short and light. I would mount a sling so that you have the least amount of excuse not to carry it.

I don’t know how your vision problems will affect you, but maybe an RMR or other Reflex sight?

All that said, I do a fair amount of fishing in AK and I have seen bear pretty close. I just back away and give them space the moment I see them. If I have fish I leave them (sometimes :)...). I am really more worried about the bears I don’t see... in that case a gun won’t help me. We have guns nearby, but I don’t always carry one. I rely on situational awareness and the bears good nature.

Autonomous 07-02-2019 05:09 PM

Oh, I agree about the situational awareness. My wife was telling someone that because of our plans I wanted to buy a gun. I told them a gun was 4th on the list.

Situational awareness.
Intelligence. Easy to get at National parks, not so easy off the beaten path where we want to go.
Bear spray.
Have weapon within reach, not put away somewhere.

HarryO45 07-02-2019 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autonomous (Post 12873182)
Oh, I agree about the situational awareness. My wife was telling someone that because of our plans I wanted to buy a gun. I told them a gun was 4th on the list.

Situational awareness.
Intelligence. Easy to get at National parks, not so easy off the beaten path where we want to go.
Bear spray.
Have weapon within reach, not put away somewhere.

An excuse to buy a new shotgun? Maybe really a number one? I won’t tell her... your secret is safe with me.

jjfitch 07-02-2019 08:52 PM

Google:"Steve Nelson, self defense in bear country"

Good stuff there…..

Smiles,

USMM guy 07-02-2019 09:31 PM

I would focus more on what measures that you can take to avoid contact with them.
 
This is best for you and for them. They are magnificent animals that deserve to have their own space. It is not all that difficult to avoid chance encounters with them. Additionally it is not all that difficult to have a positive outcome if you do happen to encounter one. Education is the key. I encounter bears on a pretty frequent basis on my property. Not Brown bears to be sure. But large Black bears nonetheless.

Most encounters are non events as they will generally run away when yelled at, but not always. Some encounters can be a bit unnerving in this regard. I have been running into them on a regular basis for about twenty years. They are magnificent beasts, and I would be very reluctant to kill one of them for any reason. Educate yourself and you might find that it is not that difficult to coexist with them.

"However goes the beast shall also go man." Chief Joseph.

Doctor481 07-02-2019 10:16 PM

“Might I suggest the Benelli M4.”
I am also right handed with a vision issue in the right eye. I have the factory mag tube extension, a Vortex red dot sight and have switched the safety to left hand orientation.
I shoot left handed with no issues.

Autonomous 07-03-2019 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryO45 (Post 12873198)
An excuse to buy a new shotgun? Maybe really a number one? I won’t tell her... your secret is safe with me.

LOL. Potentially two guns. A 10mm and the 12 gauge.
It all depends on where my research takes me. I have a .44 mag but it does not fit in the Console Vault lock box in the tow rig. I'm anal about security and if a gun is not on my person or at hand it is locked away.

Autonomous 07-03-2019 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor481 (Post 12873506)
“Might I suggest the Benelli M4.”
I am also right handed with a vision issue in the right eye. I have the factory mag tube extension, a Vortex red dot sight and have switched the safety to left hand orientation.
I shoot left handed with no issues.

I'm thinking the Mossberg semi-auto 930 with it's ambidextrous safety is looking good right now. I want to handle a pistol grip and conventional stock version.
https://www.mossberg.com/product/930...ol-grip-85223/

US1911 07-03-2019 08:36 PM

Let’s break this down, shall we. Perhaps consider the Remington V3 Tac-13 semi-auto 12ga with 5+1 capacity, it’s classified as a firearm, not a shotgun.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autonomous (Post 12872996)
I need to learn about modern tactical style shotguns.

Check, has Tac in its name, so it’s tactical. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autonomous (Post 12872996)
There is a lot of new stuff on the market.

Check, the Tac-13 is relatively new to the market as of last year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autonomous (Post 12872996)
The semi-auto feature is compelling as long as it is reliable.

Check, tis indeed a semi-auto and reliable.
-Gas piston design is very similar to Benelli’s.
-Feeds 2-3/4” “full power” slugs, 00 buck and target loads. Note my emphasis on “full power”. From my limited experience of just 88 rounds thus far, the Tac-13, much like my Benelli M4, doesn’t cycle some reduced power loads rated at <1200 fps.
-Save the reduced recoil loads for your pump action shotguns. Besides, if you encounter a bear, full power loads are an ideal way of introducing yourself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autonomous (Post 12872996)
Now, a fly in the ointment. I am right handed but have glaucoma in my right eye. With handguns I simply turn my head to the right to line my left eye up with sights. I'm skeptical this will be practical with a long gun.
Thoughts?

Check, firing from a normal cheek-weld position, or just higher than a low-ready position, or from the hip, the shells wont eject anywhere near your face.

Add an SB Tactical Brace (double check for the use of tactical in SB Tactical ‘s name :D ), and you’ll have a highly functional, very compact firearm, capable of quickly and accurately delivering six 1oz slugs. Travel with no NFA restrictions. Also, a one or two point sling could easily be attached.

Say hello to my little tactical friend. :eek:

Without brace.
https://i1232.photobucket.com/albums...psiemsu5h9.png

With brace extended (13” Tac-13 is pictured above the 14” Benelli M4)
https://i1232.photobucket.com/albums...pskmfcethg.png

With brace folded. Since it’s a piston gun, if desired/needed, you can fire all the rounds in the mag tube with the brace folded.
https://i1232.photobucket.com/albums...psibf5lahl.png

Capt. Methane 07-12-2019 02:35 AM

For bears, I would recommend something like this...

http://www.milweb.net/classified_images/img_21566.jpg


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