1911Forum
Forum   Reviews   Rules   Legal   Site Supporters & Donations   Advertise


Go Back   1911Forum > General > General Gun Discussion


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-02-2012, 08:30 PM
jdavism jdavism is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 423
Eye dominance issues




All,

Looking for some advice, I'm a relatively new shooter and recognized early on that I was having eye dominance issues. I've plugged through it using both eyes open. The issue I'm having is, when looking with both eyes open I shoot erratic, today for examples I was lining up the sights and shooting 3 inches left.. Thought my new gun was way off, then closed my right eye and fired sub-quarter groups...

I believe I'm having issues with my dominant eye changing with both eyes open, is that possible? When I shoot with both eyes open I get sort of a double vision weird thing going on.. While shooting right eye closed my marksmanship increased 100 fold.

Any tips? Ideas?
__________________
"A government can't control the economy without controlling people and they know when a government sets out to do that, it must use force and coercion to achieve its purpose. So we have come to a time for choosing." ~ Ronald Reagan.

NRA Life Member

Last edited by jdavism; 12-02-2012 at 08:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-02-2012, 09:09 PM
wccountryboy wccountryboy is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,070
Your eye dominance doesn't change- unless you lose vision in the dominant eye.
I'm assuming that you're left eye dominate. Since you're new to shooting, I would recommend that you learn to shoot left handed. Its defiantly a challange at first, but in the long run you will be a better shooter.
Ive trained and coached hundreds of people in 23 years in the military. I've had dozens that thought that because they were right handed, they had to shoot that way. Once I figured out they were left eye dominate, I had them shoot southpaw. After a little adjustment, there qualification scores improved by 10+ points, every time.
__________________
Slow is smooth, smooth is fast
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-02-2012, 09:36 PM
fadetoblack188 fadetoblack188 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 53
I myself am cross dominant. I am left eye dominat but I shoot right handed. I wanted to learn shooting left handed my self.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-02-2012, 10:52 PM
jdavism jdavism is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 423
Two questions based on your responses. (thank you)

1) lets say I did start training to shoot left handed, would the assumption be that I conceled carry left handed?

2) what is the issue with closing right eye, shooting right handed and aligning sights with my domanent eye?
__________________
"A government can't control the economy without controlling people and they know when a government sets out to do that, it must use force and coercion to achieve its purpose. So we have come to a time for choosing." ~ Ronald Reagan.

NRA Life Member
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-03-2012, 01:30 AM
Preacher1911 Preacher1911 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 225
" The proper way to shoot the M1911-A1 pistol is with both eyes open. It is better to shoot with one eye open then with both eyes closed."
U.S. Army M1911-A1 manual of arms, 1946

It sounds like you're trying to force your right eye to function as dominant when shooting with both eyes open. Why not concentrate on shooting with both eyes using your left eye as dominant?

For the last 25 years my wife has been telling me she is left eye dominant. She just picked up a new Glock G19 at a gun show and was very frustrated with tying to shoot with both eyes open. come to find out she is right eye dominant but her right eye has more vision loss then her left and she was trying to compensate for the lack of vision. Now that we figured that out she does much better. And by the way, she dry fires a lot too.
__________________
American by birth, Patriot by choice!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-03-2012, 02:16 AM
CrackShot! CrackShot! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Silverdale, WA
Age: 24
Posts: 539
Shoot with which ever hand you want if you are cross dominant then you should just tip your head and extra 2" to the right and use your dominant eye to aim...
Or keep practicing with both eyes open and again aim with your dominant eye unless you really want to do some awkward training.
Just my less than humble opinion.
__________________
A fanatic is one who sticks to his guns whether they're loaded or not.
Franklin P. Jones
NRA MEMBER
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-03-2012, 02:59 AM
mark2734 mark2734 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: California
Posts: 3,808
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdavism View Post
Two questions based on your responses. (thank you)

1) lets say I did start training to shoot left handed, would the assumption be that I conceled carry left handed?

2) what is the issue with closing right eye, shooting right handed and aligning sights with my domanent eye?
1. Yes

2. NONE. Some people preach you MUST shoot with both eyes open. BS. Shooting with one eye closed DOES to some degree limit your vision when shooting multiple targets and quickly transitioning BUT being able to actually hit what your shooting at is more important if you ask me.

And you do not need to shift your head 2 inches if your cross eye dominate. More like 3/4 inch.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-03-2012, 03:12 AM
Yuk Yuk is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 468
Once you know your eye dominance, it becomes easier to train, but any combination of hand and eye will work with training and practice. I'm a photographer by trade and left eye dominant. Sometimes I shoot (photography here, not guns) so much that I get eye strain in my left eye, so I'll change to give it some relieve. It feels a little weird at first, but it works. Also, because I do photography with both eyes open I will frequently switch eyes to see the action entering my frame. This is particularly handy when photographing sports.

Many people switch eyes out of necessity, like Hickock45. He is naturally right eye dominant and right handed. His right eye's sight has deteriorated to the point that he actually now shoots with his left eye, but still holds with his right hand. His shooting doesn't seem to have suffered!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-03-2012, 07:51 AM
anowal01 anowal01 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 121
I am cross eye dominant. I asked a lot of questions about it when I first started shooting. I tried a lot of different "solutions". Shooting with one eye closed, eye patches, shooting left handed. I finally learned that eye dominance isn't the problem, it's all about pulling the trigger. The best cure for cross eye dominance? Dry firing. Once you build the muscle memory of pulling a trigger without moving the hand or flinching, the rest has a way of mostly taking care of itself.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:06 AM
jjfitch jjfitch is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 1,057
Unless you have a physical impairment that causes the dominance you can train your brain to switch eyes. Assuming that keeping both eyes open is important to you, ie. LEO's.

It is just stupid to attempt to change strong sides. (Repeat this statement three times to make sure you get it!)

I had a significant eye injury as a teenager. Cross eye dominance really showed up training for competitive trap shooting. My coach provided the solution as follows:

The fix is to train your brain to switch dominance and I train this on a regular basis since I see this syndromn frequently as a Certified LEO firearms instructor.

Place a piece of tape or even opaque "Scotch tape" on your lense so that it obscures the front sight on your "wrong" side. Don't cover the entire lense just where you obscure the front sight. Keep both eyes open while shooting so that you don't loose your periferal vision.

Eventually your brain will change dominance and you will be able to remove the tape and keep both eyes open.

It worked for me I have trained many new shooters to overcome their cross eye dominance.

Cheers,

John
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:24 AM
Denver1911 Denver1911 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,908
What John said. Also, take up sporting clays. You'll quickly see how few problems cross-dominance causes in pistol shooting
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:29 AM
rs00956 rs00956 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: west milwaukee,wi
Posts: 1,091
Try canting your gun towards your left eye or turn your head to the right.Then shoot and dry fire to train your eyes after awhile they won't cross.
__________________
I have a strict hands on policy concerning my firearms.When they are loaded only my hand are allowed to touch them.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:38 AM
MustanGrande MustanGrande is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 963
Being cross-dominant, I shoot in whatever way works. when i'm using a scoped rifle, I can shoot with both eyes open, but trying to do so with iron sights results in some severe double-vision. If you're comfortable shooting left-handed, with both eyes open, do so.

That said, when it comes to concealed carry, I would say that confidently and accurately neutralizing the threat in front of you would take priority over a wide field of view. You've got a target front and center; take it out before worrying about looking all over creation for more bad guys.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-03-2012, 10:52 AM
al45 al45 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Bismarck, ND
Posts: 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjfitch View Post
Place a piece of tape or even opaque "Scotch tape" on your lense so that it obscures the front sight on your "wrong" side. Don't cover the entire lense just where you obscure the front sight. Keep both eyes open while shooting so that you don't loose your periferal vision.

Eventually your brain will change dominance and you will be able to remove the tape and keep both eyes open.

It worked for me I have trained many new shooters to overcome their cross eye dominance.

Cheers,

John
+1, John.

I've used this method myself and also to help train new shooters. Now I just use a flip down opaque blinder and shoot with both eye's open.

Yuk mentioned the eye strain briefly. If you shoot with one eye closed (for any extended range session), your dominant eye gets very tired and strained. Keeping both eye's open will help your eyes as relaxed as possible.

FWIW
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-03-2012, 11:00 AM
mikeg1005 mikeg1005 is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Illinois
Posts: 6,480
Put a piece of tape on your shooting glasses over your non-dominate eye. This has helped every new shooter I ever taught who couldn't close their non-dominate eye correctly.

With both eyes open, the tape will obsure your left eye, and give your right eye the crisp sight picture.

Me personally? I slightly squint my left eye, just enough to get dominance in my right eye.... This allows for a good sight picture, and still using my left eye to see around me... comes in handy when shooting on the move at matches and such.

Mike.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-03-2012, 12:14 PM
dakota1911 dakota1911 is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: The Great American Desert
Posts: 13,710
I almost think I mentioned this before. I am right handed and right eyed. When I shoot with my weak left hand and want to use my left eye I have to close my right eye or put black electrical tape over the right lens on my shooting glasses.
__________________
NRA Life Member
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-04-2012, 06:16 PM
michaelgee michaelgee is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Statesboro,GA
Posts: 1,006
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdavism View Post
All,

Looking for some advice, I'm a relatively new shooter and recognized early on that I was having eye dominance issues. I've plugged through it using both eyes open. The issue I'm having is, when looking with both eyes open I shoot erratic, today for examples I was lining up the sights and shooting 3 inches left.. Thought my new gun was way off, then closed my right eye and fired sub-quarter groups...

I believe I'm having issues with my dominant eye changing with both eyes open, is that possible? When I shoot with both eyes open I get sort of a double vision weird thing going on.. While shooting right eye closed my marksmanship increased 100 fold.

Any tips? Ideas?
and as you get older you will be happy to see over 60 yards with either. My eye situation is that I wear tri-focal glasses, I'd be happy for either eye to volunteer to be dominant
__________________
http://www.sgmgrips.com
-=- COTEP CBOB0611 -=-
GeorgiaCarry.Org Life Member
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-04-2012, 08:10 PM
Freakdaddy Freakdaddy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Missouri
Age: 47
Posts: 448
I'm a cross dominant shooter (RH / LE) that also has a "lazy eye" that turns slightly inward when trying to focus on an object. It will acutally get to the point if I try to focus on a sight and target for too long, it starts blacking out so shooting right handed is not an option. I shoot all long guns left handed and have since I was 8 years old and all handguns right handed using my left eye to aim. I also always shoot with both eyes open regardles whether it's handguns, long guns or bows as I like the wider field of view. This is especially true if you ever find yourself in a defensive situation where you would want to be able to see as much of your surroundings as possible so it would be best to start training yourself this way from the start. Once you start using your dominant eye to aim, the double vision issue should go away when having both eyes open and shooting. If you're going to conceal carry, there will be a much lesser learning curve to moving the gun slightly to the left and moving your head slightly to the right to aim with your dominant eye down the sights as opposed to develop and train your weak hand to perform all the functions necessary with any kind of fluidity. Although some handguns can have their controls swapped for either right or left hand manipulation, most pistols are set up with controls designed for right handed individuals since this is the majority of the populace. I will say it's important to have the weak hand skills and it should be practiced regularly so you have some degree of profeciency should your strong arm get injured for whatever reason (why my guns have ambi safetys) but personally, I wouldn't rush out and start buying left handed holsters.
__________________
If you have the organ donor box marked "Yes" on your concealed carry permit, you may want to consider more training.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-04-2012, 08:39 PM
mrerick mrerick is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: SE North Carolina
Posts: 293
The main reason to shoot with both eyes open relates to what happens to your iris when you close one eye.

The iris of eye that remains open will dialate and open up, reducing the depth of field of focus for that eye.

It's a good idea to practice with a translucent occlusion covering your open non-dominant eye. You can buy flip down white translucent occluder that mounts on you hat.

This article has a good description of finding out which eye is dominant...

Marc

Last edited by mrerick; 12-04-2012 at 08:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-04-2012, 09:15 PM
xdjyo xdjyo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 806
If it were me, I wouldn't try to switch from right handed to left handed. Think about it. You've had a lifetime of practice with your right hand of manipulating everything and all of your fine motor skills are placed in your right hand. I'm not saying you can't change, but it's the rare individual who can easily pinch-hit so to speak. Changing which eye you focus on the front site is much easier. I recently did this myself. I would NOT trust myself handling a firearm with my left hand as my primary hand. I am right eye dominant, but I can't focus on the front sight with it. The left eye focuses on it naturally-even without glasses. All it took was about 15 minutes in figuring out how to hold my gun, how I cant my head and angle my chin. About 30 minutes of dry firing like that and learning how it felt to do it and I was in business. Sure, occasionally, I go back to right eye focusing, but it isn't nearly the disaster it would be if I tried to switch to shooting guns with my left hand/weak hand/uncoordinated hand. And yes, I do know that there is weak hand shooting, but it's just that...your weak hand.

Hopefully, the OP can find a quick and easy solution.

Happy shooting and be safe.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 12-05-2012, 12:35 PM
guysmith guysmith is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 3,676
If I may ask a question. Which shooting stance are you using? Weaver or Iso? If you are using Weaver try using the Iso-stance. google it. Much easier for a beginning shooter. Always shoot with both eyes open. Closing one eye reduces your range of vision by 50%. Which is not a good thing in a S.D. scenario, not as bad if you are just plinking or target shooting. Most new shooters place far to much importance on precision shooting at close range, which is a mistake, as long as you can maintain a 4 to 6 inch group at 15 yards you are doing good. Precision isn't usually required until you get out to 20 yards and beyond. Lets face it most shootings happen much closer than most of us practice, and beyond 20 yards it is hard to justify of your life really being in threat of physical injury or death by a bad guy spraying and praying. While possible just not likely.
__________________
Be safe and shoot straight.
D&D Bren Ten M&P 45 acp, Mitchell Gold Series '95, S/A Champion SS Loaded, Sig P228, S&W 657 41 Magnum.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:26 PM.


NOTICE TO USERS OF THIS SITE: By continuing to use this site, you certify that you have read and agree to abide by the Legal Terms of Use. All information, data, text or other materials ("Content") posted to this site by any users are the sole responsibility of those users. 1911Forum does not guarantee the accuracy, integrity, or quality of such Content.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 2011 1911Forum.com, LLC. All Rights Reserved