Shooting a Wet Pistol

[dsk]

Originally Posted by 1saxman

The movie did me good, though. I resolved to try to not be as easy to kill as most of his victims.

I agree with that part..... there sure seemed to be an awful lot of gullible victims in that movie.

[greco]

It was common in SE Asia, or any extremely wet environment to pull the bolt (slide) back a bit to break the seal and let water drain out of a barrel with a chambered round on an M16. People may still do this out of habit, or from something they heard over the years. Who knows what the diretor was thinking, other than enhance the drama.

[richpetrone]

Action movies are entertaining, but being a bit more gun savy then the average movie watcher, we "firearms guys" pick up on a lot of errors in gun fights.......shooting a revolver 10 times without a reload, using a sub machine gun and spraying an area for 30 seconds with a 20 round mag, when it would only take less than 5 seconds of sustained fire....suppressed semi auto weapons that have no noise, guys that get shot and fly about four feet backwards from the impact..... It's all Hollywood, but it can be entertaining if it is not too "over the top."

The worst thing is the poor tactics always shown by good guys chasing bad guy, war movies and mobster movies where the bad guys always stand out in the open to fire, and always get put down with one shot....etc. The problem is many people are so innundated with Hollywood special effects and drama, some think it only takes one shot to stop a bad guy, and they think the BG will be on the ground and dead! Ofentimes Hollywood effects are bad for the unknowing gun owner!

[sunnymw]

Originally Posted by frankmmiii

Real quick question/observation.
I watch some shooting programs on the Sportsman Channel like
"Guns&Ammo TV", "Handguns", "Tac TV". I always see the shooters after they load a new mag rack the slide. Me, I usually just press the slide lock down releasing the slide and chambering the new round. Any thoughts on this?

As my instructor explained to me, racking the slide is a gross motor skill and easier to do with adrenaline pumping while pressing the slide lock down is a fine motor skill.

I practice both, although I have only ever used the slide stop method during the night match when I had a flashlight in my other hand.

[WalterGC]

Originally Posted by Brian R.

He had a while in the water to think about it and this was his best call. I think I'd do the same thing.

JHC, guys! It was an actor following a script! Don't try to insert logic into that equation! You think Jack Bauer was really good enough with his HK to always prevail in the face of multiple professional operators armed with machine guns?? Whaddaya think Jack was thinking about tactically?? The answer, of course, was "nothing!"

[CavCop]

Originally Posted by frankmmiii

Real quick question/observation.
I watch some shooting programs on the Sportsman Channel like
"Guns&Ammo TV", "Handguns", "Tac TV". I always see the shooters after they load a new mag rack the slide. Me, I usually just press the slide lock down releasing the slide and chambering the new round. Any thoughts on this?

The slide lock is limiting the pressure the slide goes forward with, and could be doing wear to the slide lock. The slide lock is ment to hold the slide to the rear, when you press down on it, the catch is scraping the side, and the recoil spring is at say about 80% when chambering the round.

With residue build up and about only 80% use of the recoil spring might cause a jam as it is not getting the full force of the recoil spring. When racking the slide you are doing the same cycle the gun does when shooting (going a little farther back), and giving a better chance for the round to be seated at the top of the magazine, the slide lock to drop with out force, the recoil spring to work at 100% picking up the next round, the slide to catch and strip the next round and enough force to chamber the round.

Racking the slide is the best way vs using the side lock.

[BillD]

Originally Posted by sunnymw

As my instructor explained to me, racking the slide is a gross motor skill and easier to do with adrenaline pumping while pressing the slide lock down is a fine motor skill.

I practice both, although I have only ever used the slide stop method during the night match when I had a flashlight in my other hand.

What would you call pressing the trigger while keeping the sights on target, fine or gross?

[sunnymw]

Originally Posted by BillD

What would you call pressing the trigger while keeping the sights on target, fine or gross?

Way fine! But something I've done so often it is like riding a bike.

To me, also, I have to change my.entire grip on the gun to press the slide stop. Small girly hands and all.

[153]

Originally Posted by Tim Burke

He may have thought he needed to let the barrel drain.

In the context of the film's reality the right answer is above.

With respect to the use of pistols in the "real world" this is just another example of cinema b.s. to make the charecter appear "gunwise" and add a little more tension to the scene.

[MrMike]

Originally Posted by PolymerMan

I found a 9mm 124 grain Golden Saber in my washing machine. Obviously I left a round in my shirt pocket and it went through at least one wash, possibly many cycles before I found it.

I saved it in a baggie for my next trip to the gun range. I was curious as to whether this would ignite or not.

It fired just fine, and the brass was shiney too!

Twice I've run speed strips of 6 rounds of Gold Dots .38+P thru the clothes washer. All 12 rounds went bang on the next range visit. Have yet to run my j-frame through the wash.

[BillD]

Originally Posted by sunnymw

Way fine! But something I've done so often it is like riding a bike.

To me, also, I have to change my.entire grip on the gun to press the slide stop. Small girly hands and all.

You hit the slide release with the thumb of your left hand as you are reaquiring the grip after you have reloaded the gun.

Do it often enough and it will become like riding a bike too.

[dakota1911]

Again, it is Hollywood.

[sunnymw]

Originally Posted by BillD

You hit the slide release with the thumb of your left hand as you are reaquiring the grip after you have reloaded the gun.

Do it often enough and it will become like riding a bike too.

Not if you're competing in a match where you're required to carry a 30+lb ammo can in your left hand as part of the course of fire :P

[dakota1911]

You know, I have have never fired a 1911 .45 ACP under water. That might be an interesting experiment.

[Brian R.]

Originally Posted by WalterGC

JHC, guys! It was an actor following a script! Don't try to insert logic into that equation! You think Jack Bauer was really good enough with his HK to always prevail in the face of multiple professional operators armed with machine guns?? Whaddaya think Jack was thinking about tactically?? The answer, of course, was "nothing!"

Of course, but the writer would have used this logic to dictate the action of the script.

[PolymerMan]

Originally Posted by MrMike

Twice I've run speed strips of 6 rounds of Gold Dots .38+P thru the clothes washer. All 12 rounds went bang on the next range visit. Have yet to run my j-frame through the wash.

At gun shows, I often kid with the vendor's if the gun they are showing me is dish washer safe.

Some guys look at me like I am crazy and some snicker and suggest the top rack only.

[BillD]

Originally Posted by sunnymw

Not if you're competing in a match where you're required to carry a 30+lb ammo can in your left hand as part of the course of fire :P

How did you manage to reload the mag if you can only use one hand?

I've been to quite a few matches over the last 15 years, can't remember a stage that didn't allow you to reload your gun, or that made you do it one handed.

[sunnymw]

Originally Posted by BillD

How did you manage to reload the mag if you can only use one hand?

I've been to quite a few matches over the last 15 years, can't remember a stage that didn't allow you to reload your gun, or that made you do it one handed.

No, we could reload with both hands. There were designated spots where we could set the can down. But, I recall trying to hit the slide release with my right thumb a few times because I was already picking up the can to run to the next stage at that point of the reload. My next run through I just racked the slide because finding the slide release with the left hand just seemed too tedious of a process. (It's amazing how such small details get amplified when you're being.timed!!)

[USMM guy]

Originally Posted by dakota1911

You know, I have have never fired a 1911 .45 ACP under water. That might be an interesting experiment.

But I would not recommend doing it while your head is also under water in the immediate vicinity.

Just sayin.

[Mike'sgooddeal]

Originally Posted by USMM guy

But I would not recommend doing it while your head is also under water in the immediate vicinity.

Just sayin.

WHAT??? I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!! YOU SHOULD HAVE SAID SOMETHING SOONER!!!


I'm still waiting for one of those M-4 magazines that are shown in all the movies that hold like a bazilliion rounds and never need reloading. Or that pump shotgun that holds like 25 rounds. Or that handgun that magically blows up cars and makes them roll over when they are chasing you. Or how about that hot chick in Kill Bill that wears those lovely pants and somehow hides like 20 spare magazines in them...but I digress. Everything on T.V., in movies and on the internet is real.

No offense meant to the OP, no really, I'm just kidding.

[WalterGC]

Originally Posted by Brian R.

Of course, but the writer would have used this logic to dictate the action of the script.

Yeah, like the logic they use when they're flicking of those Glock thumb safeties, etc. etc., ad infinitum

[RapidFire101]

Originally Posted by dsk

I guess about the only thing that can be said is that the character (played very well by Josh Brolin, BTW) apparently decided he had only one chance to get a shot off and kill that dog, and he didn't want to risk a misfire or jam so he took the extra seconds to clear the weapon and reload it first. Makes perfect tactical sense if you look at it that way. Had he tried to fire first and the weapon malfed he'd have had a face full of pit bull before he could get it back up and running again.

A tap and rack would still have been faster...

[FORCE RECON MARINE]

Interesting question. When I saw this post, I thought to myself that the answer is a no brainer but then I realized that most people in this forum probably don't perform SCUBA insertions. The answer is the weapon should perform fine after being submerged. I can't count how many times we've gone weapons hot coming out of the water.

[BlueOvalBandit]

Originally Posted by USMM guy

But I would not recommend doing it while your head is also under water in the immediate vicinity.

Just sayin.

Dont worry thanks to the wonderful invention of youtube... guys like these do all the questionable things for us

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ue69HqrLpDY

Seems to work quite well underwater, JMB probably thought about aquaman needing a sidearm when he designed it.

[TEA]

1. Drama vs practicality = drama wins for Hollywood - dropping the mag, racking the slide and reloading was for drama.
2. It would have been quieter and just as easy to drown the dog. Not wanting to sound cruel or anything, but dogs are not very good swimmers compared to humans and lose any advantage they have in terms of ability to lunge and bite once their paws leave the ground. You wouldn't give up your position to the bad guys that way, so would be much more likely to escape. FWIW, if you are ever at a lake, river or the beach and a dog attacks you when you are near the water, try and get to the water to neutralize the dog's advantages on land. You don't have to drown the dog, but you can dunk it a couple of times to get the message across.