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  #1  
Old 03-13-2012, 03:21 AM
1903 1903 is offline
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WWB fmj flatnose




Had the chance today to shoot the WWB FMJ flatnose. Only 50rds, but not real sure about it. Had a couple of FTRB's with it. I think it might be the mags, but then again I think I need a couple more boxes to be sure. Has anyone else tried this ammo? What did you think? It looks brass coated, not copper. Could be wrong.
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Old 03-13-2012, 09:10 AM
SkippySanchez SkippySanchez is offline
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Haven't had any experience with the product but would be interested in others' experience. Wondering why one would shoot flatnose over regular hardball -- is it considerably cheaper?

Here's an excerpt from an excellent post on another site:

"Hollow points that feature a rounded, hardball-type ogive are far more feed-reliable than bullets that have flat-nose, truncated-cone or semi-wadcutter shapes. The.45 ACP is a short, fat, wide cartridge, which is not the most feed-reliable cartridge profile in the world to start with. Aggravate that problem by getting too far from the reliable hardball shape in a gun that was designed from the ground up to feed hardball, and you're just begging for jams."
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Last edited by SkippySanchez; 03-13-2012 at 09:13 AM.
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:06 AM
SRJim SRJim is offline
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What Skippy said.

I'm always amazed at what people try to make things do, that they know (or should) are most likely to not work well. Like taking a Corvette to the deer stand, or using a butter knife as a screw driver.

There's ammo that the 1911 is most likely to run well, yet people sometimes seem to want to create their own grief. The world does that well enough.
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:15 AM
SRJim SRJim is offline
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Never mind. I tried to see if there might has been something else posted that explained why. No, but it's an interesting read.

What was most interesting was what you called stovepipes, which were extraction problems you were having. The interesting part was what no one else caught in that thread, how you load 7+1.

You never, ever, ever, manually feed a round into the chamber and drop the slide on it, then insert a mag. The extractor is not designed to be slammed over a case rim, it's designed to be fed by cycling from a magazine. To load +1 you'd feed 1 round from the mag, drop the mag, top of the mag and reinsert it.

Without knowing how often you do that, it's highly possible you've damaged the extractor which could possibly cause feeding issues.
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Last edited by SRJim; 03-13-2012 at 10:18 AM.
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:23 AM
BillD BillD is offline
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Lotsa folks believe a FP has greater wounding potential than ball.

I feed my 1911's thousands of semi wadcutters which has a vastly different profile than ball and mine run just fine.

A good gunsmith could help make your gun feed FP, if you feel you must feed it FP.
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  #6  
Old 03-13-2012, 11:14 AM
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Rifter Rifter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkippySanchez View Post
Haven't had any experience with the product but would be interested in others' experience. Wondering why one would shoot flatnose over regular hardball -- is it considerably cheaper?

Here's an excerpt from an excellent post on another site:

"Hollow points that feature a rounded, hardball-type ogive are far more feed-reliable than bullets that have flat-nose, truncated-cone or semi-wadcutter shapes. The.45 ACP is a short, fat, wide cartridge, which is not the most feed-reliable cartridge profile in the world to start with. Aggravate that problem by getting too far from the reliable hardball shape in a gun that was designed from the ground up to feed hardball, and you're just begging for jams."
For the most part, I agree with what you quoted. However, he doesn't say a few things that should've been in there. For a FN type bullet to work, the edge of the meplat should be radiused so that it presents a rounded edge to the feed ramp, and even more important, the place where the meplat edge lines up is critical. It should be positioned so that it contacts the feed ramp at the same point that the ogive on standard FMJ-RN contacts, or nearly so. That allows the nose of the round to 'bounce' the same way RN does, and facilitates going into the chamber. The Hornady FMJ-FN is designed that way, and is just as reliable as standard hardball when seated correctly.

The other thing is that plated FN bullets are generally not hard enough to work as well as a full on FMJ FN like the Hornady. I have not yet seen or tried any of the Winchester stuff, but from what I've heard about it so far, I'm not real impressed. Time will tell, I guess.
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  #7  
Old 03-13-2012, 12:33 PM
NewGuy1911 NewGuy1911 is offline
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Pay attention to what SRJim said,"
What was most interesting was what you called stovepipes, which were extraction problems you were having. The interesting part was what no one else caught in that thread, how you load 7+1.

You never, ever, ever, manually feed a round into the chamber and drop the slide on it, then insert a mag. The extractor is not designed to be slammed over a case rim, it's designed to be fed by cycling from a magazine. To load +1 you'd feed 1 round from the mag, drop the mag, top of the mag and reinsert it.

Without knowing how often you do that, it's highly possible you've damaged the extractor which could possibly cause feeding issues."


My Kimber Super Match 1911 45 acp worked for a while, then I bought snap-caps. Some how the pistol just started jamming. Found a great pistolsmith, paid him a lot of money; Some things I learned, never hand feed the 1911, always magazine feed. Loaded rounds drop down through the magazine well. My Kimber probably had other problem too but I set the failure in motion (Clocking extractor and timing). Before returning the pistol to me he ran 1000 rds throught it.
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Old 03-13-2012, 03:14 PM
eljay45 eljay45 is offline
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Winchester makes 2 FN 45 rounds. The WNUSA45A 185 gr fmj is a very mild shooting round. It barely, but consistently, made IDPA PF for me. The price used to be just slightly higher than the 230gr ball, now it's almost double.

Winchester also makes the 185gr FN Winclean ammo, I have no experience with it.
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Old 03-14-2012, 04:26 AM
1903 1903 is offline
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Well, I didn't buy those. My FIL bought them at wally world. My guess is that these are what Winchester is now putting in the white box ammo now. At least the 50 round box. I opened the box expecting to see the familiar copper colored round bullet, but instead I see this flat nosed brass colored bullet. It shot ok, and except for the FRTBs that the gun had, seemed ok. Might just switch to Federal FMJ. I just don't know. Need more trigger therapy I guess.
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Old 03-14-2012, 04:32 AM
1903 1903 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SRJim View Post
You never, ever, ever, manually feed a round into the chamber and drop the slide on it, then insert a mag. The extractor is not designed to be slammed over a case rim, it's designed to be fed by cycling from a magazine. To load +1 you'd feed 1 round from the mag, drop the mag, top of the mag and reinsert it.

Without knowing how often you do that, it's highly possible you've damaged the extractor which could possibly cause feeding issues.
You're right. I should have known better than to abuse my pistol in that manner. My error. I usually do not do that. I honestly have no idea why I did that. Thank you for pointing that out. Next time I clean it I'll pull the extractor and check it. Again thanks for pointing that out.
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Old 03-14-2012, 10:28 AM
SRJim SRJim is offline
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Originally Posted by 1903 View Post
Well, I didn't buy those. My FIL bought them at wally world. My guess is that these are what Winchester is now putting in the white box ammo now. At least the 50 round box. I opened the box expecting to see the familiar copper colored round bullet, but instead I see this flat nosed brass colored bullet. It shot ok, and except for the FRTBs that the gun had, seemed ok. Might just switch to Federal FMJ. I just don't know. Need more trigger therapy I guess.
That would be like Coke putting sprite in coke 12 pack boxes. They may use the same box, but it's stamped or marked with what ammo is in the box whether it's FMJ or SWC or JHP or ***.
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  #12  
Old 03-14-2012, 10:35 AM
YrllowDog YrllowDog is offline
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Flatnose

I`m another old man who is a big fan of the flatpoint in .45ACP, especially the Speer loads.

Ammoman is running a sale on the Speer Lawman .45 ACP in 185 Gr. TMJ and the hard to find 200 Gr.+P TMJ.

http://www.ammoman.com/c/20/45-automatic

( I have no relationship other then a happy buyer )
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  #13  
Old 03-14-2012, 01:54 PM
Black Jack Black Jack is offline
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In some cases the manufacturer will make a flat nose FMJ round for training so that you can practice with the same bullet shape and ballistics as the JHP that is used for carry. A good example of this is the Winchester SXZ round sold thru Bass Pro Shops.
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Old 03-14-2012, 02:29 PM
NonHyphenAmerican NonHyphenAmerican is offline
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MY SA Loaded Stainless Trophy Match is a really NICE pistol to shoot.

One thing I found was that it really is picky on what it'll feed.

A buddy has one that's stainless, but not Trophy Match.

It's also had a ton more ammo shot through it.

He reloads, and often shoots lead SWC's through his.

Mine will not feed those.

His feeds them just fine.

He offered to trade!

I told him not only No, but SHOOT NO!
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Old 03-15-2012, 04:36 AM
1903 1903 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SRJim View Post
That would be like Coke putting sprite in coke 12 pack boxes. They may use the same box, but it's stamped or marked with what ammo is in the box whether it's FMJ or SWC or JHP or ***.
I looked at the box. all it said.... IIRC.... was 230gr FMJ...... IIRC. I've slept since then.

Just checked the Winchester site. The USA45AVP was what I shot. But, what I usually shoot is the Q4170. Intersting thing is on the site they only list a 100rnd box available for the USA45AVP, but it was a 50rnd box that my FIL bought.

As I said.... More trigger therapy needed. LOL
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:42 PM
Ronnielee54 Ronnielee54 is offline
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Originally Posted by 1903 View Post
I looked at the box. all it said.... IIRC.... was 230gr FMJ...... IIRC. I've slept since then.

Just checked the Winchester site. The USA45AVP was what I shot. But, what I usually shoot is the Q4170. Intersting thing is on the site they only list a 100rnd box available for the USA45AVP, but it was a 50rnd box that my FIL bought.

As I said.... More trigger therapy needed. LOL
Just bought 2 100rnd boxes that were labeled USA45AVP. According to Winchester website that is a FMJ flat nose. Opened them up and luckily they were round nose.
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Old 03-19-2012, 03:19 PM
eljay45 eljay45 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1903 View Post

Just checked the Winchester site. The USA45AVP was what I shot. But, what I usually shoot is the Q4170. Intersting thing is on the site they only list a 100rnd box available for the USA45AVP, but it was a 50rnd box that my FIL bought.
"VP" stands for value pack, meaning 100 round boxes.

You were probably shooting Winclean.
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