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  #1  
Old 06-17-2011, 12:49 PM
FromTheCrypt FromTheCrypt is offline
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Umarex/Colt 1911 .22 Gold Cup vs Sig Sauer 1911-22




Hey guys brand new to this forum and just getting into 1911's. While I am saving up money to buy a real 1911 (.45ACP) I have the current money to buy either one of these 1911 .22's which I would want due to cost of shooting .45ACP vs .22LRs. These two guns in the thread title are what I am currently interested in. I first read about the Sig and figured for around or under $400 MSRP it would be a good introduction to the 1911 format. While doing more research I ran into a few videos from SHOT 2011 of Umarex/Colt teaming up and bringing out 3 models of the 1911 .22 which are the Governent/Rail Gun/Gold Cup. seems like the MSRP on these are stated at $400-$500 which $500 being for the Gold Cup but we all know that MSRP is just that and most likely can be purchased for around $450 hopefully. I know both of these models are new but just looking over the specs and from what a few owners have mentioned from people who currently have the Colt .22 and owners of the GSG 1911 .22 (which seems to be what the Sig is a copy of) I am hearing that the Colt is a tighter fit and that the Colt has a better function with the blowback from the gas of the bullet and the slide is a bit more free which is good for .22LR's in this format. Money not being an issue the only huge different though I live in Chicago and it's almost impossible to get a silencer in this state...Is that the Sig has threading at the end of the barrel and the Colt doesn't not seem to..? Anywho if these two are the comparison what do you guys think. I am not here to start a flame war about brands just looking for opinions from you guys. And I am fully commited to buying a .22 1911 so lets not even get to the "Save the money and buy a 1911 then buy a .22 conversion kit" In due time I will but right now I want a plinker. I am looking forward to hearing what you guys have to say being that I was told to come here for the knowledge that you guys have with 1911's. Let's keep this clean and information and no nonsense please! Thank you guys!

Also if there might be another version/brand of this type of gun I am overseeing feel free to inform me on what else I should take a look at. These two are pretty high up on my list of things I have seen. Thanks again!
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  #2  
Old 06-17-2011, 01:14 PM
scottl scottl is offline
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From pictures I've seen the Sig isn't a copy of the GSG.It's the same gun with Sig rollmarks.
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  #3  
Old 06-17-2011, 01:18 PM
CalWhit33 CalWhit33 is offline
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I was in a similar situation, this is what I ended up doing. I got the ruger 22/45 for familar controls, but a 1911 training aid it is not. Its a great plinker and a awesome pistol and realiable. And can be had cheaper than both the pistols your looking at. Get the .45acp with a conversion kit. The main reason is trigger time and button manipulation on the frame your going to carry. My conversion isnt as accurate as the ruger but its on the gun I carry and am on target faster and points more natural for me. Good Luck!
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  #4  
Old 06-17-2011, 01:24 PM
FromTheCrypt FromTheCrypt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottl View Post
From pictures I've seen the Sig isn't a copy of the GSG.It's the same gun with Sig rollmarks.
LOL. That is what I was trying to get across is that it is the same thing. Good point! I probably will eventually get a Ruger 22/45 but right now I really want a 1911 .22 at this moment. If we could keep it to this type of gun you'd be helping me a bunch on information. Especially between these two posted in the thread title.
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  #5  
Old 07-25-2011, 07:59 AM
ak0ng1911 ak0ng1911 is offline
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Umarex/Colt 1911 .22 Gold Cup vs Sig Sauer 1911-22

I am also wanting and doing the same research as you; here is my opinion and findings. I know I need to do more research:

Sig
- more money than gsg but it is a sig
- thumb safety both sides
- 10 rounds mag


GSG
- cheaper than sig
- some model has treaded barrel w/ fake suppresor
- black
- thumb safety both sides
- 10 rounds mag



Colt
- thumb safety is on left only
- barrel attached to frame like walther ppk/s
- 10 or 12 rounds mag
- rail model available
- skeletonized trigger
- commander hammer

- This is a Colt Umarex 1911 22lr semi auto pistol featuring 5 inch barrel with rail for laser sight or flashlight, low profile 3 dot sight, speed trigger, command style hammer, beavertail grip safety, 12 round magazine. Colt Government model rail gun #2245705, made in Germany by Carl Walther

for now i am leaning to colt since it is ceblerating a 100 years of 1911 design
and 12 round advantage - left safety is okay with me

pls let us know what you are going to buy
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  #6  
Old 07-25-2011, 09:22 AM
crashoverrideplik crashoverrideplik is offline
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GSG and the Sig are the same model. You can get a railed version of the GSG and also get a fake suppressor on it. I've seen it ass 3 different model in different gun shops.

I held and shot 2 versions of the Colt yesterday, the GI and the rail gun. The build quality is crap IMO, on the same lines as a Puma/Chiappa.Feels like Colt went to Puma/Chiappa and slapped their name on top of it. The lip extension on the magazine is awkward because of the length. The slide release has no pin for the slide release, which if you own 1911's it's a *** is that? moment. The extra 2 rounds are nice but it was a jam-o-matic running CCI Mini Mags. Cleaned it, re-shot it and I'm not impressed.
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  #7  
Old 07-25-2011, 09:27 AM
scottl scottl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ak0ng1911 View Post
I am also wanting and doing the same research as you; here is my opinion and findings. I know I need to do more research:
Sig
- more money than gsg but it is a sig
- thumb safety both sides
- 10 rounds mag
GSG
- cheaper than sig
- some model has treaded barrel w/ fake suppresor
- black
- thumb safety both sides
- 10 rounds mag
As was already stated GSG makes both.If you buy the Sig your paying extra for the name.
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  #8  
Old 07-25-2011, 09:29 AM
scottl scottl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashoverrideplik View Post
.Feels like Colt went to Puma/Chiappa and slapped their name on top of it .
They went to an airgun company.I seen were Umarex has a .45 1911 now too.
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  #9  
Old 07-25-2011, 09:35 AM
Ssanders224 Ssanders224 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashoverrideplik View Post
GSG and the Sig are the same model. You can get a railed version of the GSG and also get a fake suppressor on it. I've seen it ass 3 different model in different gun shops.

I held and shot 2 versions of the Colt yesterday, the GI and the rail gun. The build quality is crap IMO, on the same lines as a Puma/Chiappa.Feels like Colt went to Puma/Chiappa and slapped their name on top of it. The lip extension on the magazine is awkward because of the length. The slide release has no pin for the slide release, which if you own 1911's it's a *** is that? moment. The extra 2 rounds are nice but it was a jam-o-matic running CCI Mini Mags. Cleaned it, re-shot it and I'm not impressed.
This is not a good representation of the Colt/Umarex at all. I own both a GSG, and the Colt. Look through all my posts, and you will see alot of good info. Both pistols shoot great, and both of mine are VERY VERY reliable will several diff ammo brands. After replacing a few parts and such I think I lean toward my GSG, but that is mainly due to the fact that I have done more to customize it. Mags are more available for the GSG as well. The Colt mags are hard to get, and $$$! Also, the slide stop notch on my GSG is wearing quite badly, this does not affect operation of the pistol at all, but sure doesnt look good.

The slide stop on the Colt has no plunger because there is a spring inside the frame that holds it in place. It works quite well.

I will say the finish on the Colt is alot better, silver is showing through all over the slide and frame on my GSG.
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  #10  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:07 AM
crashoverrideplik crashoverrideplik is offline
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@ Ssanders224: Glad you like your Colt. Like I said, I wasn't impressed with either one at the LGS. The OP was asking about the Gold Cup which I'd like to see myself. I hope it is better than the 2 I sampled, maybe they got skipped over on QC. I expected more from Colt and maybe that's why I'm being harsh. My GSG is also modded and IMO a better gun from the factory than the Colts I shot. The slide stop/plunger tube functioned fine, but if you own a 1911, that will throw you off the first time you see it. The gun shop guys actually looked around to see if it was in the box, before it was noticed that it was not like a real plunger tube.
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  #11  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:10 AM
Ssanders224 Ssanders224 is offline
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admittedly I did the same the first time ha. When I took my Colt out the box the first time I though shoot! how have I already lost the slide stop plunger???!!

That stinks you had bad luck with the Colts, I know of mine, and a buddies that run very well.

The GSG just feels more like shooting my Centerfire 1911s I think.
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  #12  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:14 AM
crashoverrideplik crashoverrideplik is offline
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Yea I had very high hopes since it was coming from Colt. I think the magazines must be made out of gold for the prices they are getting for them, maybe because they are Walther made magazines that's the reason for the expense. The LGS has a Browning on the way and I'm going to look hard at it but the price is scaring me away.
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  #13  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:19 AM
Ssanders224 Ssanders224 is offline
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Yep, the mags are ridiculous. Im hoping they come down soon.

Im not really up to speed on the brownings, but I dont think they are full size?? I believe they are scaled down a bit. Im 6'6" 275lbs with bear claws for hands, a full size 1911 is just barely big enough as is!

I have however been seriously looking at picking up a sig 226 classic .22. I guess thats kinda blasphemous in this thread.
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  #14  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:40 AM
crashoverrideplik crashoverrideplik is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ssanders224 View Post
I have however been seriously looking at picking up a sig 226 classic .22. I guess thats kinda blasphemous in this thread.
Own one of those also, and a 9mm, .357 and .40 conversion kit for it. LOL
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  #15  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:01 AM
Ssanders224 Ssanders224 is offline
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How does it run with the .22 conversion on it??
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  #16  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:23 AM
dakota1911 dakota1911 is offline
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I never got into the .22 only 1911 type guns. I remember when Kimber made them. I decided to go with conversion units. Like a Kimber .22 conversion unit for a Kimber Target Elite II.



Of course I can use that Kimber unit on a Colt bottom also, but for Colt only I have a Colt Ace .22 conversion unit with a Colt Gold Cup in .45.



The Kimber package ended up being just under $1K several years ago with a new Kimber .45 and new conversion unit and the Colt package was a little over $1K a few years ago with a used Gold Cup and used Ace conversion unit.

I have other conversion unites also like Ciener and Marvel and they are O.K. I wish Colt would come out with a .22 that could be upgraded to a centerfire like 9mm, .45ACP, etc. keeping the .22 slide. Right! Colt already did that many years ago. Maybe the time is now right to try it again.
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  #17  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:25 AM
crashoverrideplik crashoverrideplik is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ssanders224 View Post
How does it run with the .22 conversion on it??
PM sent.
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  #18  
Old 07-25-2011, 03:22 PM
hdfb910 hdfb910 is offline
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I picked up a Sig 1911 22 this past weekend at a big show we had in town. I looked at the GSG's and they looked the same for the most part.
I was looking for the model with the threaded barrel. The Sig I ended up with had the threaded barrel ambi safety and came in "OD Green" and "Earth" (tan). I got the OD Green.
Had to order the thread adaptor in order to use with a suppressor so waiting on that to show up now.
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  #19  
Old 07-25-2011, 04:26 PM
Mags Mags is offline
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Looked at the Sig 1911-22 in thier pro shop last week. I know from following threads on here that the gun is a GSG. I asked the guy running the shop if Sig would warrenty any issues. They said "NO". They might be able to take care of some parts by mailing them to you, but they will not take the gun back for any modification or repair. I asked if it was GSG product and they said it was. I didnt ask if GSG would take the gun back for any repair work.
Just something to consider.
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  #20  
Old 07-25-2011, 07:45 PM
WESHOOT2 WESHOOT2 is offline
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left field

The Kimber 22LR 1911s I've shot were superb.
Superb.
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  #21  
Old 08-06-2011, 08:56 PM
Buzi Buzi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ssanders224 View Post
Yep, the mags are ridiculous. Im hoping they come down soon.
Heck, someone must be buying them.
I just checked their site, umarexusa, for either mag, 10 or 12 round.
All on backorder.

I'd be glad to order just one even at the absurd price of 38 each.

I just picked up today at a local gun show a Colt 1911 22 'Rail Gun' as I
decided I could not live without it.

I plan to go shoot it till I cant' stand it any longer tomorrow, barring heat stroke. (cheeses it is nasty hot in Texas these days.)

I have upwards of 3k rounds of 22 LR laying around. Some recently acquired, most of it dates back as much as 30 years ago. So I have a goodly mix of 'high powered' LR ammo to burn up.

I'll post up my results later.

I think I got the only one any dealer had at the entire show. Saw lots of ATI's and the Chia Pet ones and the Sig labeled version ATI (GSG) aka (GERG).

As I type this I'm not looking forward to jamming 3k rounds into the one measly 12 round mag I have.
I may fail to burn all that ammo up in one day........
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  #22  
Old 08-07-2011, 04:50 PM
Buzi Buzi is offline
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Back from my shoot fest

Just wanted to pop in again on this thread with a update.

I shot upwards of 800 rounds thru that new Colt 1911 22LR Rail Gun.
A mix of ammo, most of it was stuff I had laying around since the late 70's.
Some old Remington, Winchester, and Federal CCI LR ammo. Some of it
was raw lead non coated. I shot it all up.
(well not all, I still have a good 800 plus more rounds of ancient 22lr to chew up but at a later date).

There were a number of booboos but I can attribute every one of them
to ancient ammo. There were 2 misfires that didn't go pop that I ejected and rejected.

There were like 3 incidents of rounds not firing nor ejecting when I pulled the slide back. In each case I removed the mag and let the slide slam home on the round that failed and then it went pop.

In each of these I didnt' blame the gun, I'm going to blame ammo that dated from sometime in the 1970's.

I did have a box of new stuff and I put 4 magazines of that thru the gun with no issues what so ever. Cheap 'Wal Mart ' Winchester 555 LR 'Hi Velocity' stuff. Worked fine.

I also drug along my old Star 45 ACP compact to fire that some.

I can't comment with certitude how accurate this 22 is compared to others as I've not shot a 22 LR pistol like this since the 80's when I had a Ruger Mark 2 (or was it a 1, i forget).

I do know I wasn't as accurate with this gun as I am say with my Norinco model 1911 45 ACP nor my 4inch 357 Smith and Wesson 4 inch revolver, nor even my stubbie 45 ACP Star.
I don't know if it was the ammo or me, or the gun.
It is fun to shoot though.
I ended up shooting less at targets and more at clods of this n that on the range berm which is about at 30 yards. Far more satisfying to send a 'accidentally ' tossed empty bottle cap or splinter of wood flying that shooting paper.
Once some amazingly brave sparrow flew in on the range and was obviously thinking about landing on one of the target frames. I waited with baited anticipation but the bird changed its mind at the last moment. Oh well.

I plan to go to the range later in the week and pump another few hundred rounds thru it.

Last edited by Buzi; 08-07-2011 at 04:52 PM. Reason: doh, forgot to add..
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  #23  
Old 08-07-2011, 06:56 PM
BuckshotEsq BuckshotEsq is offline
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I went to a LGS looking for a nice .22 pistol a few months ago. I was considering the GSG, the Colt/Umarex and the Ruger 22/45. This is a nice shop (their selection of high end 1911s is amazing), and the salesman was very knowledgeable, but after handling the Colt/Umarex gun I could not understand why he was pushing me towards it. It just didn't feel good to me. I got a GSG with an OD Green frame and have since replaced the guide rod with one that a forum member had made and did a group buy. The gun really puts a smile on my face. Yesterday I was at the range and not having my best day performance-wise, but at the end of the day I put everything else away and just blasted through a couple boxes of CCI Mini-Mags, and it basically salvaged the day for me.

Being a bit of a Sig fanboy, I would have paid a little extra to get the gun with the Sig grips and rollmarks on it (I recognize that this is arguably silly), but it was not yet available when I made this purchase. I will probably still get the Ruger eventually. I feel that it's a higher quality firearm, but it didn't really feel as close to a 1911 as I had hoped.
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  #24  
Old 08-07-2011, 11:41 PM
Ssanders224 Ssanders224 is offline
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Quick pic of my GSG and Colt beside each other.

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  #25  
Old 08-25-2011, 09:34 AM
pacevette pacevette is offline
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get the .45

You say you want a 1911 .45. Spend another 100 over any of the .22s and buy a Rock Island Armory .45. I own a RIA Nickel 38 super and couldn't be happier with it and spent $425 NIB.
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