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  #1  
Old 09-12-2010, 06:07 AM
colty colty is offline
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Combat Commander 70 series




I just purchased a 70 series combat commander. It is satin nickel and also a redish bluing almost like rose color. Grips are non colt redwood wood grips. My question is has anyone ever seen this color scheme.
thanks
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  #2  
Old 09-12-2010, 06:14 AM
Russell40 Russell40 is offline
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I had one that started to turn that color after alot of wear and exposer to sweat. I carried in a iwb holster while off duty for several years. I kept it clean, but it did start to change on me.
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  #3  
Old 09-12-2010, 06:44 AM
wetidlerjr wetidlerjr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colty View Post
I just purchased a 70 series combat commander. It is satin nickel and also a redish bluing almost like rose color. Grips are non colt redwood wood grips. My question is has anyone ever seen this color scheme.
thanks
Let me be the first to say that Colt never made a Series 70 Commander. It is either a pre-Series 80 or a Series 80. Also, a "70" in the serial number DOES NOT make it a "Series 70". Only full-sized (5" barrel Government/Gold Cup) Colts were made in a Series 70 configuration.
Some blued parts will often have a plum (reddish?) hue that may be due to metal used or temp of bluing solution, etc. I have seen conflicting explanations for the color difference.
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  #4  
Old 09-12-2010, 11:07 AM
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dsk dsk is offline
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Pictures would go a long way to helping to answer your question. Otherwise, (in the words of fellow forum member oldcanuck) you're really just getting a haircut over the phone.
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Try not to fall into the common trap of wanting to replace everything on your new 1911 just to make it "better". Know what you're changing out, and why. You may spend a lot of money fixing things that weren't broken to begin with. Shoot it for at least 500 rounds, then decide what you don't like and want improved. Vintage 1911's should NEVER be refinished or modified because it ruins any value they had as a collectible firearm.

Last edited by dsk; 09-12-2010 at 11:10 AM.
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  #5  
Old 09-12-2010, 03:39 PM
montrose981 montrose981 is offline
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pictures on this form

Quote:
Originally Posted by dsk View Post
Pictures would go a long way to helping to answer your question. Otherwise, (in the words of fellow forum member oldcanuck) you're really just getting a haircut over the phone.
could tell me how to post pictures to this form.....
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  #6  
Old 09-12-2010, 03:43 PM
montrose981 montrose981 is offline
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70 series 1911 colts

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Originally Posted by wetidlerjr View Post
Let me be the first to say that Colt never made a Series 70 Commander. It is either a pre-Series 80 or a Series 80. Also, a "70" in the serial number DOES NOT make it a "Series 70". Only full-sized (5" barrel Government/Gold Cup) Colts were made in a Series 70 configuration.
Some blued parts will often have a plum (reddish?) hue that may be due to metal used or temp of bluing solution, etc. I have seen conflicting explanations for the color difference.
could you tell me what makes a 70 series 1911 a SEVENTY 1911 ?????
not try to pick a fight but what is the differnt?
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  #7  
Old 09-12-2010, 03:47 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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From my Colt FAQ thread at the top of this section:

Quote:
Colt is the original manufacturer of 1911 pattern pistols, having made versions for both the military as well as commercial market since regular production began in January 1912. The commercial versions were nearly identical to the military ones, differing only in markings and finish. Following World War Two military production ended, but the commercial guns remained in production with only minor changes such as deletion of the lanyard loop and a larger thumb safety shelf. These pistols are known to collectors as "pre-Series 70" guns, as they pre-dated the Series 70 guns introduced in 1970. It was during this year that Colt introduced the first major design change to the Government Model in nearly 50 years. In an attempt to improve the accuracy of production guns the barrel bushing was redesigned, along with the barrel. In this system the bushing utilized four spring-steel "fingers" that gripped the enlarged diameter of the muzzle end of the barrel as the gun returned to battery. By tightening the fit of barrel and bushing in this manner Colt was able to improve the accuracy of the average production gun, without going through the expense of hand fitting the older solid barrel bushing to the barrel and slide. Models using the new barrel/bushing setup were the Government Model and Gold Cup, which were designated the "Mark IV Series 70" or simply Series 70 pistols. It should be noted that the shorter 4 1/4" barreled Commander pistols retained the use of the older solid bushing design and thus were never designated Series 70 pistols, although one hears the term erroneously applied to Commanders from time to time. The new "collet" bushing (as it came to be known) generally worked quite well, however it was occasionally prone to breakage so it was eventually phased out around 1988 as Colt reverted back to using the solid bushing in all of their pistols.
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Try not to fall into the common trap of wanting to replace everything on your new 1911 just to make it "better". Know what you're changing out, and why. You may spend a lot of money fixing things that weren't broken to begin with. Shoot it for at least 500 rounds, then decide what you don't like and want improved. Vintage 1911's should NEVER be refinished or modified because it ruins any value they had as a collectible firearm.
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  #8  
Old 09-12-2010, 03:49 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montrose981 View Post
could tell me how to post pictures to this form.....
You first need to upload to a picture hosting website. Then you can post the link in this thread. Also, if the file size is less than 100k you can upload directly here when you create your post.
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Try not to fall into the common trap of wanting to replace everything on your new 1911 just to make it "better". Know what you're changing out, and why. You may spend a lot of money fixing things that weren't broken to begin with. Shoot it for at least 500 rounds, then decide what you don't like and want improved. Vintage 1911's should NEVER be refinished or modified because it ruins any value they had as a collectible firearm.
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  #9  
Old 09-13-2010, 01:21 AM
montrose981 montrose981 is offline
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70 series 1911

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Originally Posted by dsk View Post
From my Colt FAQ thread at the top of this section:
after 1988 when colt stop using the collet... where not the slide still mark with the mkiv 70 series on the slide?
the commander had a differnt slide marking on them from the get go!
i also consider all colt 1911 without a transfer bar ......than is 80 series with extra
parts in the them to be 70 series colts....
you are saying that the collet is the only reason a 1911 is a 70 series 1911?

not try to pick a fight just fishing for facts....
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  #10  
Old 09-13-2010, 05:50 AM
MSgt Dotson MSgt Dotson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montrose981 View Post
after 1988 when colt stop using the collet... where not the slide still mark with the mkiv 70 series on the slide?....
Series 80 was unleashed in 1983-84. some transitional models even with the collet bushing....; I don't think many, if any, of the Series 70 Govts shipped without the collet, but am not certain on this....

Many will mistakenly refer the pre-80 Commanders as S70, but, other than perhaps 'B70' in the SN, there weren't really any so designated.

Last edited by MSgt Dotson; 09-13-2010 at 08:33 AM.
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  #11  
Old 09-13-2010, 08:23 AM
wetidlerjr wetidlerjr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montrose981 View Post
after 1988 when colt stop using the collet... where not the slide still mark with the mkiv 70 series on the slide?
the commander had a differnt slide marking on them from the get go!
i also consider all colt 1911 without a transfer bar ......than is 80 series with extra
parts in the them to be 70 series colts....
you are saying that the collet is the only reason a 1911 is a 70 series 1911?

not try to pick a fight just fishing for facts....
"Series 70" originally meant a 5" barreled Government or Gold Cup (5") with a collet bushing and an "Accurizor" barrel. It had NOTHING to do with any safety system or lack of one. A "Series 80" pistols means it has the firing pin block safety system. Some "Series 80" pistol also had the bushing/barrel system of the "Series 70" pistols. Presently, Colt makes a "Series 70" pistol that does not have a collet bushing or "Accurizor" barrel and it also does not have the "Series 80" safety system which adds to the confusion. No Colt Commander OF ANY type was ever a "Series 70", now or in the past including any that had a "70" in the serial number. Over the years, it has become the habit of many to refer to any 1911 style pistol without the firing pin block safety system as "Series 70" and one with it as "Series 80". Again, I realize this is confusing but just remember one thing: There are NO (meaning NONE) "Series 70" Colt Commanders.
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  #12  
Old 09-13-2010, 12:02 PM
DPris DPris is offline
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Transfer bar?
No 1911 by any maker has a transfer bar.
Denis
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  #13  
Old 09-13-2010, 02:27 PM
pippibenz pippibenz is offline
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Trying to get back to the original question and without having seen the pistol, the color you describe may be the copper base under the electroless nickel. I believe that such a copper base is deposited before the nickel and injudicious attempts at removing scratches from the finish may have resulted in removal of the nickel down to the copper which would show as a rosey color.
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  #14  
Old 09-13-2010, 03:04 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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Only the Government Model and Gold Cup models were ever marked Series 70, as only they used the collet bushing. The Commanders all retained the early pre-70 style rollmarks through the 1970's into the early 80's.

When the Series 80 firing pin safety was introduced in 1983 all of Colt's 1911 pistols, including the Commanders recieved it and were rollmarked Series 80. However the collet bushing remained in use in all the 5" guns until around 1988.

The new Series 70 Reproductions really confuse the issue, as they are rollmarked "Series 70" yet they use the standard solid bushing, not a collet one. Apparently Colt has changed their own nomenclature for the "Series 70" designation to mean any of their 1911-pattern pistols that lacks a firing pin safety. For example, in their advertising they state that the WW1 Replicas feature a "Series 70 firing system". Therefore, assuming Colt eventually resurrects the Commander Model sans firing pin safety I'd expect them to call them Series 70 pistols.
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Try not to fall into the common trap of wanting to replace everything on your new 1911 just to make it "better". Know what you're changing out, and why. You may spend a lot of money fixing things that weren't broken to begin with. Shoot it for at least 500 rounds, then decide what you don't like and want improved. Vintage 1911's should NEVER be refinished or modified because it ruins any value they had as a collectible firearm.
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  #15  
Old 09-13-2010, 07:21 PM
colty colty is offline
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Picture of Combat Commander

Here is a picture

serial is 70SC63419

Says Colts Combat Commander Model
Attached Thumbnails
45.jpg  
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  #16  
Old 09-13-2010, 08:10 PM
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dsk dsk is offline
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It looks to me like somebody had the nickel stripped off the slide and then had it blued. Colt's slides are quite hard, and a small shop might have had trouble getting it to blue correctly.
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Try not to fall into the common trap of wanting to replace everything on your new 1911 just to make it "better". Know what you're changing out, and why. You may spend a lot of money fixing things that weren't broken to begin with. Shoot it for at least 500 rounds, then decide what you don't like and want improved. Vintage 1911's should NEVER be refinished or modified because it ruins any value they had as a collectible firearm.
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  #17  
Old 09-13-2010, 08:29 PM
montrose981 montrose981 is offline
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plating

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Originally Posted by pippibenz View Post
Trying to get back to the original question and without having seen the pistol, the color you describe may be the copper base under the electroless nickel. I believe that such a copper base is deposited before the nickel and injudicious attempts at removing scratches from the finish may have resulted in removal of the nickel down to the copper which would show as a rosey color.
you are correct in that you much lay down a very thin covering of copper before you plated nickel or hard crome ..... if the bluing tank chemical made up does not have enough phosphite acid in the tank you will get that rose color blue on the finish...... also can happened if you try to plated with high current... you burn your metal
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  #18  
Old 09-13-2010, 08:34 PM
montrose981 montrose981 is offline
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wrong word

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Originally Posted by DPris View Post
Transfer bar?
No 1911 by any maker has a transfer bar.
Denis
sorry.. incorrect term... in more like a block to stop the firing pin from hitting the primer
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  #19  
Old 09-13-2010, 09:01 PM
wetidlerjr wetidlerjr is offline
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It appears to have the "plum" color that some Ruger revolver collectors like.
Since it seems to have been redone anyway, I'd have it stripped and refinished in whatever finish you like.
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