New to forum, Warrior vs. Target Match?

[sprg03-A3]

Hello all: I am new to the forum. As my username indicates my interests lie more in the milsurp long gun area. I have the itch to buy a 1911 style pistol and have decided on a Kimber. I like either the Warrior or the Target Match because I like the internals of these two pistols: ie. no firing pin block safety or external extractor. I am leaning towards the Target Match but would value any input you may have.

Thank you for your input.

[Bullitt5172]

Hey, I just shot my Warrior for the first time this afternoon. I am extremely impressed. It was smooth, accurate and not a single failure in the 100rds (small sample but a good sign). Reminds me a lot of my Les Baer Thunder Ranch when shooting. Not too familiar with the Target Match, but I don't think you can go wrong with the new Kimbers (internal extracter, no Swartz crap).

[STONES_SS]

If it was me, I'd go with the Target Match if you can find one. My wife narrowed it down to the Warrior and Target Match also. For what it's worth, my Dad has owned, built and shot 1911's for the past 40 years and when he finally was able to shoot my wife's TM this past Saturday, he said hands down it was the best shooting 1911 he had ever gotten ahold of.

I do believe this gun, out of the box, ranks up there with the LTP and Super Match.

[Chuck S]

Target pistols are just that, target pistols. Adjustable sights, etc. Usually not designed to work after being dropped or in austere conditions.

The Warrior is a close rendition of the recent small military contract pistol for USMC. Latest update to a long line of M1911 combat handguns.

-- Chuck

[sprg03-A3]

Thank you for the info. As my reply to your reply concerning whether the barrel on the Target Match was stainless or not, I put one in lay-away just yesterday. You are the second person who indicated that the target Match is difficult to find. I found one at each of two gunshops in my immediate area!! I am thrilled to your opinion, and that of your father-in-law. That is lots of dough to spend on a pistol, and I want to make as informed an opinion as possible.

[Sundance]

Consider the intended use for the gun. The Target Match is just that...a target pistol. The Warrior is just that...a fighting pistol. Obviously both could be used for the role of the other, but each one is set up to excel at a specific task. I have my Warrior equipped with a Surefire X200A as my dedicated nightstand gun. It would make an excellent law-enforcement duty pistol. It would also make an excellent pistol to use in the many excellent practical/tactical shooting schools available across the country. The Target Match pistol does not have a rail which makes it much more difficult (although not impossible) to attach a light to the gun. It also has adjustable sights which are nice for the range, but most will agree have no use on a fighting gun. So the question boils down to what you are going to use it for. Figure that out, and your decision will be made as to which gun to pick. By the way, I agree 100% on your choices being based on the absence of an external extractor and the absence of an internal firing pin safety. If it worked without these two modifications in 1911, and continued to work through two World Wars and several other major and minor conflicts, why would it still not work today without them. If you want these features, buy some other gun besides a 1911 that has them, but leave my beloved 1911 alone. Leave well enough alone. If it aint broke, don't fix it. Keep it simple stupid...etc., etc., etc.....

[sprg03-A3]

I wholeheartedly agree with your opinion about KISS!! I cannot say that I have an intended purpose for the pistol, ie. competitive target shooting vs. carry... I am jumping in to the 1911 idea with both feet in that I am buying a high end example. I like to shoot different things (my primary interest is in milsurp long arms, and own a whole slew of different types in order to have the experience of doing so), and I like to see how things operate, how they work and how they fit. For that reason I collect pre WWII South American Mausers, for example. I also love works of craftsmanship. I certainly will not carry the piece, and don't think I will use it as a nightstand gun as I have a 9mm Beretta for such use. I am sure 98% of the time the pistol will be used punching holes in paper for the enjoyment and experience of it, and for the opportunity to spend time with family who have similar interests. However, I think that no matter which one I buy, and I put the Target Match in lay-away just yesterday, it will shoot better than I will!! I like the idea of adjustable sights, but also of illuminated night sights, so you see my conundrum!! I made a decision, and am very happy with it. The last thing I wanted to have to do was to have to send a very expensive pistol back to the manufacturer because it would not operate properly, hence my decision to choose between the Target Match and Warrior.

[fredfellini]

Hey, sprg03:

YOu can add a Dawson rail to the bottom of your new 1911 target pistol. That's exactly what was done on the original Kimber Warrior prototype for the military - it did'nt have an integral rail. BTW, I thought that it looked great with the Dawson add-on. I 'm considering it for one of my 1911's.

[Gary1911A1]

Heck, just buy both.

[sprg03-A3]

I am not really interested in the rail, although the Warrior did feel great with it. I do, however, like Gary1911A1 idea!! Unfortunately that is lots of dough to spend. Maybe some day in the future...

[TLE]

Originally Posted by sprg03-A3

I certainly will not carry the piece, and don't think I will use it as a nightstand gun as I have a 9mm Beretta for such use.

You may re-think using the Warrior for fun and a nightstand gun. Once you get used to the 1911, you will probably chunk that Itallian tomahawk. Plus it has night sights and a rail for your light.

[sprg03-A3]

One thing I have to say about my Italian "tomahawk" is that never, never ever, never ever ever, never ever ever ever never have I had a problem with it; not a ftf, fte, failure of the slide to lock back, misfire, never had pieces flying downrange... It is what it is, a rock solid, dependable sidearm that shoots EVERYTHING I have ever fed it. I believe in giving credit where credit is due. Although I understand why Kimber is having the problems they are, I don't think you can say the same about their products as offered lately, or many other 1911 manufacturers as well. I do realize that many of the issues with 1911 pistols are due to the fact that they are being made tighter and more refined than the original design was intended as it was conceived as a duty sidearm, and not a work of art or a target pistol. This is not to knock the design, as I think it and the Hi Power are the epitome of class when it comes to pistols. I spent quite a bit of time and effort to make an informed opinion as to which Kimber to buy. However, rarely does one have to spend 2X what a perfectly dependable Beretta 92FS costs to have a pistol operate dependably and accurately. Let's give credit where it is deserved.

[STONES_SS]

You won't go wrong with the Target Match!

Here are a few groups my wife shot at 45'.

5 rounds at 45', 1" orange sticky...


15 rounds at 45', 3" shoot-n-c


15 rounds at 45', 3" shoot-n-c (not a good group, but a interesting one)

[TLE]

Originally Posted by sprg03-A3

Let's give credit where it is deserved.

I was just jokeing with you, that's why I put the giggle face in there. Another gun that's a fantastic value for the $$ are the CZ 75's. They are not as refined as some 1911's put they just keep going and going.

[sprg03-A3]

Please understand, I knew that you were not serious. However it seems to me that all too often in these forums, which I believe are an EXCEPTIONAL source of real world info and experience, much of the advise provided is tinted by the notion that 'mine is better than yours'. If you check out almost any thread in other forums in which a person is asking 'should I buy a ______ or an _______' you begin to get into areas of uninformed opion and bias not found in fact or experience. One thread under one of the Springfield forums is just like that. Everyone knows that Kimber is having problems with the external extractor; but instead of the person asking the question getting an answer like "...stay away from the Kimber with _____", he gets ..."I would NEVER buy a Kimber because my friends friends friends Kimber wouldn't operate". That person would probably never discover what a great piece of machinery and craftsmanship the Warrior, or Gold Match is, because he thinks Kimbers are overpriced, tempermental trash. As I said, I believe in giving credit where it is due. My Beretta has run like a Swiss watch, but it is a different animal than a 1911 with a different design philosophy which can be apprecated for what it is. I can't wait to get and shoot my Kimber Target Match because I want to experience a finely put together and fitted classic 1911. Thanks for your time and take care.