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80 series with collet bushing

6K views 38 replies 19 participants last post by  Chris D B 
#1 ·
does anyone know how many 80 series were sent out the door with the Collet bushing?
 
#5 ·
BTW, I have a '87 CE with the collett.
At least one :D

If Colt is like any other manufacturer they wouldnt likely leave old new stock on the shelves.

For example Ford let 65 mustang parts dribble into the 66 model year.
 
#7 ·
Colt made a mistake in using that bushing which is why they stopped using it. I changed mine out. If you are only going to the range no big deal but for self defense it is a NO.

Colt made a mistake using a MIM extractor and when they started breaking in large numbers Colt stopped using them. They should have known a part that needs to flex is not a part that should be made by MIM. It cost Colt way more than they saved by going to MIM.
 
#25 ·
Colt made a mistake in using that bushing which is why they stopped using it. I changed mine out. If you are only going to the range no big deal but for self defense it is a NO....
I don't carry my S80 w/collet bushing (I prefer my CCO) but I wouldn't be adverse to doing so simply because of the bushing. I have no intention of changing mine despite your (more than dramatic) warning.

 
#8 ·
The Series 80 models were introduced in 1983, but Colt didn't phase out the collet bushings until around 1988.
 
#10 ·
I have two 1988 Gold Cup National Match pistols. Both have a Collet bushing. On the other hand remember Colt had a serious union strike from about 1985-1990, and a lot of pistols were assembled by temp workers. Prices went up. My 1978 Gov. was about $260 or so as I recall. My 1977 GCNM was $349.
 
#11 ·
My stainless GCNM, made in 1986, came with a solid bushing. I also had a Series 70 Combat Government Model I bought new, in 1983, and it had a solid bushing.

Seems like Colt was not the model of consistency.
 
#13 ·
Seems like Colt was not the model of consistency.
Colts have always been like a box o' choc-olates. You never know what you're gonna get!
 
#18 ·
Mike the OD of your barrel and the ID of your slide, and select a bushing that's .001" smaller in each dimension. You may still have to do some slight fitting however. Otherwise just get a factory-spec Colt or Springfield bushing and call it good.
 
#16 ·
Pborgia, I have a Series 70 Gold Cup National Match that still has a collet bushing. This pistol has tens of thousands of rounds through it. I did replace the bushing with a new part along the line but the old one never failed. It has been said that it is prudent to never remove the bushing from the barrel since that induces considerable stress on the "fingers" when they are forced over the muzzle. I also lubed the barrel and bushing with high temp grease to reduce friction.
 
#17 ·
Thanks! I just got this pistol, and have had to restake plunger tube, and front sight ( as soon as new one arrives). Bushing looks ok, haven't shot it yet. Just fit brown wide thumb safety, new recoil spring, stainless mainspring housing, Wilson hammer and sear, sear spring. It needed some work. Next is polish flats on frame, bead blast rounds.
Fun project, learning alot from this forum.
 
#22 ·
Wilson drop in is way too tight. Barely can get it on barrel, not even going to force it into the slide. thinking about trying
Ed brown drop in. My gun is from 1987 (Combat Elite). Not sure I want to try and fit and ruin this bushing, can't find my micrometer. Is it wrong to use sandpaper to fit inside diameter? How about outside?
 
#23 ·
No sense in spending money on a drop in when you can get a well fitting bushing for the same or slightly more money. Borrow/buy a quality dial caliper and measure your slide bore ID/barrel OD. Call EGW with your accurate dimensions. They will cut one just for you. Very minor fitting required.
 
#26 ·
I am just trying to understand here a little. I see in your picture above you were willing to change the sights and the grips. The grips are somewhat stunning by the way. Why the reluctance to change the bushing?
 
#29 · (Edited)
wetidlerjr Quote:
Originally Posted by OJK
...I doubt anything I say will change your mind (my attitude before my breakage) but hope when yours breaks (and it will if you shoot it enough times -took several hundred rounds to break mine) , no further damage will be the result.

That pistol has more than "several hundred rounds"through it. But thanks for the extra drama.
I'm really sorry if I sounded like I was producing "extra drama" - surgeons are better known for their down to earth attitudes - I was hoping I might save you from my experience of continuing to shoot - for no good reason other than I could do it despite reports from guys with experience - I knew best and hadn't had it break and knew it wouldn't happen to me. My Colt was made in 1970 and, while some weeks didn't get as many, I generally shoot about 50 rounds per week through it.

I didn't prove anything except my evaluation of me we misplaced - when it broke, I wished I had benefited by others experience and realized it would eventually break. I felt lucky that, when it broke - it didn't damage other parts.

In retrospect, I wished I had just replaced it - the Brown produced equal performance - and, had I just changed it out - I could have a collet in my parts both to show to other "junior" shooters -

However, YMMV , if you persist in shooting it until it fails - and it will if you shoot it long enough, my hopes are that it doesn't do any other damage to other parts in your 1911.

This is intended in the most friendly attitude - I hope you regard it that way - I kind of wish I had had such help in my past -





The broken collet arm was stuck between the barrel and the slide - very tightly - In retrospect, I wished I had listened to those with experience - I could have had a collet to show and no problems with my pistol - Live and learn.
 
#30 ·
From another thread.

Collet bushings


L- standard solid bushing, R- Colt collet bushing

I often see threads started by members asking about so-called "collet" barrel bushings, usually in reference to Colt pistols. The collet bushing was introduced by Colt in 1970, and is easily identified by being made of spring steel with four "fingers" at the rear. The last batch of standard commercial Governments in 1970 incorporated the new barrel bushing and matching barrel (which has a slightly belled muzzle) as a test run. These pistols (approx. 1500 made) had conventional post-war commercial markings, but had a special "BB" marking underneath the serial number. Later that year the new system was formally introduced as the "Accurizor barrel and bushing" with the new Mark IV/Series 70 models later that same year, which included all 5" barreled pistols (Government Model and Gold Cup). The shorter 4.25" Commander models continued to use solid bushings. How they worked was that the spring "fingers" of the bushing were pushed out by the belled end of the barrel during lockup, and wedged between the barrel and inside surface of the slide to tighten the fit and improve accuracy. For the most part it worked great, as the accuracy of a typical box-stock Series 70 usually exceeded that of earlier commercial pistols with standard bushings. It was basically a means of improving out-of-the-box accuracy on production pistols without going through the expense of hand-fitting match bushings like those used on custom accurized pistols.
The collet bushings remained in use past the the introduction of the Series 80 models in 1983, but were eventually phased out around 1988 or so when the solid bushings were reinstated. The reason for them being discontinued was due to a rare but potentially serious issue with the bushings. During the manufacture of any mass-production item the matter of keeping within allowable tolerances is always an issue, and in the case of the Series 70 bushing system it was critical. As mentioned in Jerry Kuhnhausen's excellent book The Colt .45 Automatic, a Shop Manual Vol.1, if the slide inside diameter (ID) was machined too large the fingers of the bushing couldn't wedge between the slide and barrel snugly, and accuracy would be lackluster. If the slide ID was machined too small then the fingers would have insufficient room to expand during lockup, causing them to flex and buckle at a point just ahead of the pads that contacted the belled end of the barrel. Other contributing factors could be a slightly oversized bushing (creating the same clearance problem) or a lack of squareness at the front edge of the slide. Eventually one of the fingers could break off due to being overstressed, with the broken piece floating around inside the weapon. Since the pistol would continue to operate normally it would likely go unnoticed by the user, at least until it jammed somewhere inside the pistol, possibly locking up the pistol while it was still loaded. Gunsmiths weren't usually too happy to receive a still-loaded Colt that was jammed up in this fashion, especially given the fact that freeing it up usually involved putting the pistol in a vice, taking a rawhide mallet and banging the slide back and forth until things came loose. It wasn't healthy for the gun, and it wasn't healthy for the gunsmith either if there still was a round in the chamber.
There are many owners out there who say they've already put thousands of rounds through their pistols without experiencing a broken bushing. Odds are they won't, because the vast majority of pistols were manufactured within tolerances. It's just that hypothetical "one in a thousand" that may end up having a problem if the pistol was slightly out of spec and fired enough to overstress the bushing. But that is why I usually tell people to replace the collet bushing with a solid one anyway just to be on the safe side. Your pistol will probably never have a problem, but the fact is you really never know when it'll fail. It may a long time before the fingers finally succumb to fatigue and break off. Maybe after 5,000 rounds, maybe after 50,000. I've kept the one in mine simply because it's more a safe queen than a shooter, but if it were being used for competition or defense I'd replace the bushing with a standard solid unit.
One frequently-heard comment is that you should never pull the collet bushing off the barrel, otherwise you may stress the fingers further and cause them to break. Just my opinion, but I feel that this is not really the case, as you can be rest assured there are far greater stresses imparted on the bushing during actual firing than if you simply popped it off the end of your barrel! However it is true that when disassembling a Series 70 you should retract the slide at least 1/4" when trying to rotate the bushing, as you'll be releasing the bushing from engagement with the slide/barrel and thus making it a whole lot easier to turn.
And yes, to answer another frequently-asked question, a standard non-oversize solid bushing will work on an early Series 70 or 80 pistol. The belled muzzle on a Series 70 barrel is still the same outside diameter as a conventional "straight" barrel, so a factory Colt solid bushing should drop in without fitting. Aftermarket oversized units (Wilson, Brown, etc.) will of course require gunsmith fitting to the slide and barrel as with any other type of 1911 pistol.
Once again, the only factory pistols you're likely to see them in are Colt's Government Models and Gold Cups made from 1970 through 1988. Commander and Officers ACP models never used them nor did any of the so-called "clone" makers, although I am aware of some aftermarket companies (such as Bar-Sto) who offered collet bushings for Commander-sized pistols for a short time during the 1970's.
As I have ALREADY said, I do not carry my Govt. Model S80/w collet bushing so anyone concerned needs to calm down about it's imminent disintegration. I am aware (and have been for some time) of the legitimate possibilities of the collet bushing failing. Being old enough to know better (but too young to resist), I think I can handle it.
I carry a late model TALO COLT CCO which has NO collet bushing and an alloy aluminum frame which is much lighter thus making it easier for the long haul.
 
#31 ·
I had a stainless Series 80 with the collet bushing, I punished that pistol with neglect, never had a problem.

I often find it interesting that Colt chose to continue the use of the collet bushing for as long as they did if it really was that prone to failure. But whats more interesting is that it was phased out at a time coinciding with the UAW strike.

A lot of experience was lost during that strike.
 
#32 ·
Here is the thing, its not drama. The function of the collet bushing is when the slide goes into battery, the bushing hits the muzzle end of the barrel which is a bigger ID than the shaft of the barrel, this causes the bushing finger to expand to the ID of the slide, giving better lockup.

What happens when a metal is flexed back and forth over time, it breaks.

I do believe that Colt consider the collet bushing a serviceable part (like a spring)

Do what you will.

Thanks
 
#33 · (Edited)
wetidlerjr Quote:
Originally Posted by OJK

That pistol has more than "several hundred rounds"through it. But thanks for the extra drama.
Well - yes - I really intended to say "hundreds of thousand rounds".

It is an original Series 70 made in 1970 as the serial number proves - I bought it used in mid 70s - as I recall (I should say my memory center in my brain will be 87 years old in less than two weeks and - as the saying goes amongst us more seniors "I can't remember what I forgot yesterday - but I can recite my WW II Army serial number - 17147374 - and my Korean War serial number - O 530250 Navy Medical Officer - see" - it impresses my wife -now the dark side - after 3 years in the Navy, I transferred to the Air Forcr and my serial nimber was AO - ??? ??? - well - it was top secret and if I told you, I'd have to kill you -)

It is top of the list for me - #2 being my "repro" - low serial number suggests first year production - an identical twin to older one as far as I can see.

From DSK - Whose knowledge of 1911s I have much respect for:

Since the pistol would continue to operate normally it would likely go unnoticed by the user, at least until it jammed somewhere inside the pistol, possibly locking up the pistol while it was still loaded.

Mine was empty since the slide locked back before loading another round -



As can be seen - WAY BACK Took a couple - well several - sharp taps with the rubber mallet to break loose.
 
#34 ·
Getting back to the op's question, I'm going to extrapolate and say:

100,000 to 150,000.

That is an extrapolation from their annual GM production numbers in the late 70s (no data for the 80s), and the number of years making 80's with collet bushings (four to five). Production estimates are from '70s data available on Sam Lisker's colt page.
 
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