STI Trojan in .40 or 9mm for IDPA?

[8theburger]

I'm set on .45s for the CDP class in IDPA, but I wanted to see if an STI Trojan would be better than my Kimber Aegis Custom II in 9mm from their Custom Shop for IDPA ESP. It's quite accurate, but I think the alloy frame is slowing me down because of muzzle flip.

I've read some favorable things here and elsewhere about the Trojan, and I've picked up that the .40 cal is favored by some. I've ordered a Dawson Precision Competition Ready .40, but would appreciate opinions and information as to whether it's a good choice, e.g. .40 vs 9mm, and Trojan vs something else like an Eagle.

TIA
Gary

[Nick]

Wow you should have asked BEFORE you bought the 40 cal trojan..... for IDPA, steel, 3 gun the 9mm is the only way to go. Even a downloaded 40 is still whippier than a 9mm.
the eagle gives you more options esp steel and 3 gun due to it's capacity but it's also almost double the price. If you can afford the Eagle buy it, you'll never be sorry for buying higher end but I have regretted buying the lower end when I've done it...... my friend has a saying buy cheap, buy twice.

BEFORE everyone gets mad at me there's nothing wrong with a Trojan for an entry level gun, I'm feeling the poster is into higher end guns .....NOT disparraging the trojan in any way.

[8theburger]

Thanks, Nick. I just ordered the Trojan .40 a week ago, so I have plenty of time to change my order, especially since it's going out for hard chroming. I thought there must be some technical, mechanical, or ammo performance attributes that underpinned the choices of some to favor the .40 over the 9mm in the Trojan for competition. And, it seems there are reasons some favor the STI Trojan for competition-- I assume they would include match grade barrel and bushing, good parts, accuracy, quality builds, etc. But, I haven't read details of their rationales.

Yes, I do favor the higher end guns, i.e. Nighthawk Custom and Ed Brown for CDP. But, I'm hoping that an STI will be a tack driver for ESP--either in .40 or 9mm.

Opinions?
:

[Quack]

For IDPA, get the 9mm.

[2MoreChains]

The popularity of a 1911 in .40SW for competition is more for those who wish to compete in both USPSA and IDPA with the same gun. USPSA allows .40SW to be scored major power factor if it is moving fast enough, but you can also download it to run very soft minor loads in IDPA or Steel Challenge. IMO, a downloaded .40SW is much softer shooting than a 9mm at the same power factor. But you need to reload to this.

The choice of caliber for gun games comes down to what you intend to shoot. If you're primarily interested in IDPA, Steel Challenge, and 3-gun, get the Trojan (or Eagle) in 9mm. Not only does it meet the divisional requirements, but you can get more 9mm capacity in your mags than .40SW. Plus 9mm is generally cheaper to reload for than .40SW.

Since you already have a 1911 in .45acp for CDP, you're already setup to run Single Stack Div in USPSA and can be scored major PF. So no sense in getting a 1911 in .40SW to do dual purpose IMO.

[2MoreChains]

Originally Posted by 8theburger

would appreciate opinions and information as to whether it's a good choice, e.g. .40 vs 9mm, and Trojan vs something else like an Eagle.

TIA
Gary

Trojan vs Eagle is an interesting question. I have both, but they are for different purposes.

I use my Trojan in .45acp for USPSA's Single Stack Division and IDPA's CDP division. My 2011 Eagle is chambered in .40SW because I got it to shoot USPSA's Limited Division and as mentioned before .40SW allows you to be scored major PF. But I also use the Eagle for IDPA's ESP division, Steel Challenge, and 3-gun. I download it to a very soft minor PF round when shooting those three, but load major PF for USPSA's Limited. I do change my recoil springs when I switch loads... 12.5 lb for minor loads, 14 lb for major loads.

The advantage of a 2011 double stack over the 1911 is a) capacity and b) reloads. The extra capacity of the 2011 mag is more of an advantage in Steel Challenge and 3-gun than it is in IDPA. However, it is far easier to load a tapered double stack mag into the big opening of the 2011's grip frame than trying to shove a skinny mag into the skinny hole of a 1911.

Granted, with enough practice, reloading a 1911 can be extremely quick, but all things being equal, I reload a 2011 faster.

But if you don't intend on shooting USPSA, I'd seriously look at the Eagle in 9mm if you're contemplating getting a 2011. But get the one with the bushing barrel to be compliant with IDPA.

[8theburger]

Good info, Chains. Is a 180 gr. .40 less whipper than a 124 or 147 gr. 9mm; therefore, in IDPA with multiple shots at a target, allowing quicker reacquisition?

I'll never learn all this stuff.

[kaiserb]

In IDPA you can not go wrong with a 40. We have several folks in our club that prefer 40 over 9mm for IDPA.

I prefer 40 S&W and shoot an STI chambered in 40 caliber for ESP.

[2MoreChains]

Originally Posted by 8theburger

Good info, Chains. Is a 180 gr. .40 less whipper than a 124 or 147 gr. 9mm; therefore, in IDPA with multiple shots at a target, allowing quicker reacquisition?

I'll never learn all this stuff.

I think it is. Look at it this way: a 180 gr .40SW Bullet only needs to be moving a measly 694 FPS to make minor PF. In contrast, a 9mm 124 gr bullet needs to be moving at 1,008 FPS. I've compared the felt recoil of a 9mm 1911 with minor PF 124 or 147 gr bullets with a .40SW 1911 with 180 gr bullets downloaded to the same minor PF and can tell the difference.

The downloaded .40 feels more like a soft pop than the slightly snappier recoil of a 9mm to me. However, it took some testing with various loads and springs for me to get the slide to cycle the way I like it. At 125 PF, the .40 slide was sluggish, and I couldn't get the gun to eject reliably even with 11 lb recoil spring, so I ended up bumping the load up to about 135 PF (plus it helps with taking down steel poppers more reliably).

However, the truth of the matter is, a 9mm in a 1911 or 2011 is still pretty soft recoiling and is a pleasure to shoot. So as I've mentioned before, if I was just getting a gun for IDPA, Steel Challenge or 3-Gun, I'd probably go with an Eagle in 9mm. But for USPSA, .40 is the way to go.

[RH45]

I shoot both an Eagle .40, and a Trojan .40 in ESP.
Reloads are easier with the Eagle, but, being slightly lighter, it has a tad more felt recoil.

[Aircooled6racer]

Hello: An STI Eagle in 9mm is a sweet shooter for IDPA. The 9mm 2011 I built for IDPA has a lightened 5" slide(legal) and uses a aluminum Briley guide rod. I use 121 grain Montana Gold bullets with a 8lb ISMI recoil spring. It feels like a 22 but loads faster than a single stack. I also have another top end for it that has a bull barrel and is 4.180" long. I am not sure which one I like better yet. 9mm is great for ESP. Thanks, Eric

[8theburger]

2MoreChains:

When you use the .40 180 gr. loads in the Trojan, what weight spring did you go down to?

Thanks, guys, for the helpful info. Talked to Dawson today, and left my order as a .40. I have the 9 and 45 for IDPA in match grade 1911s, so I'm thinking a .40 would cover the range, including recoil and muzzle flip.

Shot the new Nighthawk Custom Talon 5" yesterday for the first time in an IDPA Classifier after a five month lay off, and it was butter smooth and recoil w/ 230 gr FMJ was decent. Dead nuts accurate and made me a lot better. Must post pix.

Gary

[2MoreChains]

8thBurger,
My Trojan is chambered in .45acp, loaded to about 172 PF. I use a 14lb recoil spring.

My Eagle is the one that is chambered in .40SW. I use two loads in that gun, major and minor. With the 172 major PF rounds I use a 14 lb recoil spring, and a 12.5 lb spring with the 135 PF minor loads.

Have fun with you new Trojan! Get ready for condom jokes...