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  #1  
Old 04-07-2012, 08:21 PM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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Tac Ops shooting high and left.




I took my tac ops out to an outdoor range the other day to shoot with a friend, and was getting a little perturbed when I wasn't seeing hits when I was pointing the gun at 25 yards (the shortest range at this outdoor range) I mean Im not the best off hand shooter but 25 yards isn't that far. I was shooting at some 8" targets from that distance...and I started to notice when I was shooting at the lower target I was seeing hits high left. Thinking it was just me I decided to go to a local indoor gunrange with a rest and see whats up.

At the indoor range off a rest it was hitting 3" to the left and 2" high with an over all spread of about 2" total. So thats pretty consistent.

At 7 yards even it was hitting 1 full inch left and center on the up and down plane. The group was barely bigger than 1/2" as well so that is pretty tight.

Over all what do you think I should do? I dont like the idea of drifting the sight the amount it would need to be correct and I feel like the front sight would need to be pretty dang tall to be correct.

Should I ask Sig to basically replace the slide and barrel with one that hits POA POI at 25 yards? I'm not a wealthy guy and this gun is pretty up there as far as anything that I own. I want it to hit right at 25 yards since I feel like that is a pretty good standard.

Any help and advice would be much appreciated.

Oh and I LOVE this gun! I'm not sig bashing at all! I just wanna know I'm gonna hit what I'm pointing at haha.
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  #2  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:20 PM
FrontRangeFuzz FrontRangeFuzz is offline
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What kind of rest were you using? Same ammo? Did you let anyone else shoot it to see if they would hit POA/POI with it? Using a rest doesn't *always* eliminate the human factor, so Ive found letting someone else have a crack at it is usually a good idea before sending anything in.

I can't imagine that this is a barrel/slide issue. If its holding groups that tight then it's either your sights or human error.
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  #3  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:02 PM
SmurfHunter SmurfHunter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrontRangeFuzz View Post
What kind of rest were you using? Same ammo? Did you let anyone else shoot it to see if they would hit POA/POI with it? Using a rest doesn't *always* eliminate the human factor, so Ive found letting someone else have a crack at it is usually a good idea before sending anything in.

I can't imagine that this is a barrel/slide issue. If its holding groups that tight then it's either your sights or human error.
What was the wind like outdoors?
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  #4  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:28 PM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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I did let someone else shoot it and they were hitting in the same spots I was across the board, up close and a ways out. I was using a rest that would rest the gun on the dust cover and also rest the back part of the grip on the rear with adjustable up and down on the front. I know that human error could still be in there, but I know what a sight picture looks like. I took my time making sure everything was lined up before shooting and it was just still shooting high and left.

I did groups with WWB ball ammo and Federal ball ammo as well. Both groups were very very similar with the Federal being a little bit tighter.

I know I could put a taller front sight on and adjust the windage, but seriously? This is not a cheap weapon. I dont want the rear sight as far to the right as I would need to adjust it to get it to shoot. Every other fixed sight gun I own shoots straight. To me its totally unacceptable to have to adjust the rear almost 1/8 of to 1/4 of an inch to fix the problem. Having it be offset that much would just drive me bat sh!t crazy!

I'm just wondering now if the bushing was fitting wrong making the barrel point off wrong.

Also when I was outside it was dead calm but I wasnt shooting off a rest then. Just running rounds to get the break in period past.
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I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #5  
Old 04-08-2012, 12:30 AM
FrontRangeFuzz FrontRangeFuzz is offline
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1/8 to 1/4 of an inch ajustment at 25 yards would put your rounds into the next county!

I'm assuming that you have a 5" model TacOps, with a (roughly) 6.5" sight radius. You are trying to zero at 25 yards. To determine your radius multiple, you divide your zero range in inches by your sight radius.

25 yards = 900 inches
900/6.5 = 138.5

So, 138.5 is your radius multiple. To figure out how much to move your rear sight, divide how much you want to move the group by your radius multiple. You said you were off by 3", so:

3/138.5 = .021" <---- this number is how much you need to drift your sights to move your grouping 3" at 25 yards. That is a far cry from 1/8", or even 1/64". It's almost insignificant.

Granted it's late and I'm at work right now, so if any of my numbers are off then change them and recalculate - but the formula is sound.
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"We must carry arms because we value our lives and those of our loved ones, because we will not be dealt with by force or threat of force, and do not live at the pleasure and discretion of the lawless." - Jeff Snyder

Last edited by FrontRangeFuzz; 04-08-2012 at 01:18 AM.
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  #6  
Old 04-08-2012, 12:48 AM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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I suck at math, but that seems reasonable haha. I'll give it a shot after tomorrow and see. If the number you posted are right then its about .55mm when I plugged in the number for how far off it was at 7 yards it was about .66mm or so.

Either way I kind of expected more from Sig. Even more so since my para GI expert shoots 1 3/4" groups dead center at 25 yards off the same rest with all the sights set to center with calipers.
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I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #7  
Old 04-08-2012, 01:11 AM
FrontRangeFuzz FrontRangeFuzz is offline
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Yeah, it sucks having to dial a gun in to get it "just so", but I'm sure Sig has a spec/tolerance for factory builds. Your particular gun might be on the ragged edge of that tolerance, or even slightly outside of it by a hair for one reason or another. At any rate, I hope you get it squared away. Good luck!
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"We must carry arms because we value our lives and those of our loved ones, because we will not be dealt with by force or threat of force, and do not live at the pleasure and discretion of the lawless." - Jeff Snyder
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  #8  
Old 04-08-2012, 01:18 AM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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Thanks! I'm sure I'll get it all squared away. This gun is such a smooth runner I just want it to be accurate!

Thanks for all your help. I might still call Sig on monday and see what they say.

Happy Easter!
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I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #9  
Old 04-08-2012, 01:30 AM
FrontRangeFuzz FrontRangeFuzz is offline
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Same to you! Let me know what they tell you if you decide to give them a ring.
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"We must carry arms because we value our lives and those of our loved ones, because we will not be dealt with by force or threat of force, and do not live at the pleasure and discretion of the lawless." - Jeff Snyder
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  #10  
Old 04-08-2012, 01:44 AM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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Will do! From what I hear they are pleasant to deal with.
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I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #11  
Old 06-01-2012, 01:24 AM
stephansnow stephansnow is offline
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So what ended up happening here? I think my tacops might be having the same problem but Im not really sure yet if its me or the gun.
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  #12  
Old 06-01-2012, 08:42 PM
Rides Alone Rides Alone is offline
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I was shooting high and right--I am left handed. To eliminate shooting right, I practice dry firing and altered my two hand grip. I pulled firmly back with my off hand on the grip and finally shot P.O.A.
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  #13  
Old 06-04-2012, 01:08 AM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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Funny thing. Ive been way out of touch because of my job, and just got back a few days ago. Dusted off the sig and took it to the range. I rested it again and shot it. Had a lefty rest it and shoot it, and had a former marksmenship unit member rest it and shoot it and guess what? Still shot left. The high part I'm not to worried about but the full inch left at 7 yards worries me. Ive also been having repeated false lock backs even after getting it past the break in point. All in all I am pretty disappointed in this gun. My frist high end 1911 is turning out to be a bust and way way more problematic than my Para.

So I'm calling Sig in the morning and getting this sorted out.
__________________
I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #14  
Old 06-12-2012, 11:54 PM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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Well. I just got my shipment notification that my TacOps will be back on the 14th. That is pretty dang fast if you ask me. We will see if they fixed the issues! That makes it 9 days from shipping it out to getting it back. So far Sigs customer service is pretty good. They don't ever reply to emails, but besides that there turn around is pretty quick haha. I'll update in a few days.
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I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #15  
Old 06-14-2012, 11:25 PM
BigAm BigAm is offline
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Well got the Sig back today. They fixed the issues and it only took 10 days from when I shipped it out to them getting it back to me.

Great job from Sig, and an awesome turn around time.

Funny thing though they sent me the targets from before and after, and I WASNT crazy. The first set at 15 yards was at least 2" to the left and 1.5" high. The second after they replaced the front sight and drifted it a lil was spot on less that 1" group at 15 yards.
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I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
COTEP# CBOB0669 Dan Wesson Valor, Dan Wesson Heritage, Springfield Range Officer 9mm, ParaUSA GI Expert, Sig P229r Dark Elite, Sig P220 Dark Elite Carry
http://martialarmsconcepts.com/
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  #16  
Old 06-15-2012, 12:03 AM
CoolBreeze1911 CoolBreeze1911 is offline
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Good for Sig on this one it seems and good for you! I love my TacOps and hope you will also.
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  #17  
Old 06-15-2012, 09:54 AM
majortoo majortoo is offline
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Nice to hear that some people still have good customer service. Also nice to hear about groups less than one inch at 15 yards! (Oh, to have young eyes again!:-)
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