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  #1  
Old 05-04-2012, 11:33 PM
SSMOKE SSMOKE is offline
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Disturbing rust on my ivory. (and KOBRA)




I received my never to be carried/target/safe queen blued KOBRA in November 2011. She's a beauty.



Upon arrival I field stripped, lubed and installed Sarge's ivory with a coat of renaissance wax. I shot 100 rounds, removed the grips, cleaned and lubed the pistol.

In December I shot 100 rounds, (100 t0 200) removed the grips, cleaned and lubed the pistol.

In February I did the exact same thing. (rounds 200 to 300) However, when I removed the grips (for the standard wipe down/renaissance wax application) I noticed some orange/rust coloring on the inside of the grips. I thought that that was somewhat bizarre, but wasn't too concerned. Rust never crossed my mind. Maybe lube or whatever changed the color a little bit.

Today I shot rounds 300 to 400, removed the grips, thoroughly cleaned/inspected the frame and saw what I will describe as little veins underneath the bluing. I realized this is rust.

Now, not only am I disappointed in the small front dot sights, accuracy, (I'll accept accuracy as my own fault, but I am more accurate with my Kimber and Colt.) what seems to be VERY fragile bluing but ALSO this rust.

Is this normal? I knew when I ordered that bluing was fragile but since I am a MAINTENANCE FREAK and that this is, more or less, a safe queen, trophy pistol I thought that I would be fine. This is too much disappointment relative to the price.

Thank you for your thoughts.
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  #2  
Old 05-05-2012, 12:22 AM
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thearmedrebel thearmedrebel is offline
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Could the wax be trapping moisture? High humidity in the safe?

I am assuming there is no outline on the front sight, correct? What kind of accuracy are we talking? Could be as simple as lack of focus on the front sight (due to small dot). Try a test, paint it with whiteout or similar (that will come off easily) and give it a go.

Pics of the rust might help. At least we could feel your pain.

Robert
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  #3  
Old 05-05-2012, 05:24 AM
Ditto_95 Ditto_95 is offline
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I also have a blued Kobra. She isn't a safe queen but gets shot seldom.
While doing my semi-annual inventory, I notices some light surface rust on the MSH. A quick wipe with an oily cloth took care if it.

I would be willing to bet Thearmedrebel is correct. Moisture held under the wax is the culprit. Scrub it clean and just keep it well oiled.
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  #4  
Old 05-05-2012, 08:35 AM
Jim Smyth Jim Smyth is offline
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I work with a lot of different metals with cutlery. Stainless, High Carbon, Damascus, Damasteel, Meteorite etc. Almost everything will rust or rust spot if not taken care of or if taken care of incorrectly. I am not saying you did anything wrong BTW, you sound like me with how you take care of your gun.

Any lube is good but all lubrication isnt created equal. WD-40 for example has water in it so its not good for long term rust prevention IMO. I have had problems in the past with Ren wax and rust with Meteorite and High Carbon, Damascus. On High Carbon, Damascus and Meteorite I now use RIG (Rust Inhibiting Grease). I have had good results with it and have had no rust issues.

Since your having these issues I think whatever your doing I would try something different. Instead of Ren Wax try a good gun lube when you wipe it down. I would also make sure if your keeping it in a safe that you either have a heat bar or some type of moisture absorbing material to prevent rust.
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  #5  
Old 05-05-2012, 08:50 AM
Rastoff Rastoff is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Smyth View Post
WD-40 for example has water in it...
I don't want to start a WD-40 war, but this simply isn't true. The very nature of WD-40 is to displace water so, it cannot have water in it.
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  #6  
Old 05-05-2012, 08:59 AM
TTAC TTAC is offline
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I usually keep a thin coat of birchwood casey Barricade under my grips. Spray on and wipe off excess. Repeat once or twice a year. No rust.
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  #7  
Old 05-05-2012, 08:59 AM
TGO TGO is offline
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Taken straight from WD website

Quote:
WD-40 literally stands for Water Displacement, 40th attempt. That's the name straight out of the lab book used by the chemist who developed WD-40 back in 1953. The chemist, Norm Larsen, was attempting to concoct a formula to prevent corrosion-a task which is done by displacing water. Norm's persistence paid off when he perfected the formula on his 40th try. Please see Our History for more information.
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  #8  
Old 05-05-2012, 09:03 AM
castnblast castnblast is offline
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I have a blued ET, a painted Wilson, and a couple of SS pistols. I also have a bunch of nicer shotguns. IMO a softer finished/matte blue is definitely one of the most fragile finishes. Bright, highly polished blue is far more durable. I think of it in this way, the softer/matt finish is actually microscopically rougher that the highly polished finished and therefore has more surface area and more tiny "peaks and valleys". More surface area and more tiny peaks and valleys mean more spaces for contaminants and way more perishable. Looks nice though. Bottom line, have Brown refinish it when it bothers you too much.

I also know nothing about Ivory but could it be that the cellular structure traps/holds moisture?
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  #9  
Old 05-05-2012, 09:18 AM
jst1mortym jst1mortym is offline
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This just might be of some help as they are describing the products that inhibit rust and provide lasting protection!http://sigforum.com/eve/forums/a/tpc...5/m/8960009782
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  #10  
Old 05-05-2012, 09:38 AM
barmandr barmandr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Smyth View Post
WD-40 for example has water in it...
from wd40 website:

What does WD-40 contain?

While the ingredients in WD-40 are secret, we can tell you what WD-40 does NOT contain. WD-40 does not contain silicone, kerosene, water, wax, graphite, chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs), or any known cancer-causing agents.

http://www.wd40.com/faqs/#a92
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  #11  
Old 05-05-2012, 01:08 PM
BDA45 BDA45 is offline
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Next time you clean your gun, finish it off with Eezox. Wipe down everything. My 1911s are not blued, but Eezox has curtailed some grip rust that appeared on a blued 50 year old S&W revolver.
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  #12  
Old 05-05-2012, 02:11 PM
SSMOKE SSMOKE is offline
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Thanks for the response. I have Birchwood Casey SNO Universal Gun grease that i use on the grip bolts of my other 1911's. I left it off of the bolts on my Ed Brown because of the ivory. I don't know if it is bad for ivory but, would rather be safe than sorry.

I guess that I'll try that. (grease on the frame) I like the idea of grease between the grips and the frame. I wish I wasn't a little too late. At least you can not see the rust, just sucks knowing that it is there.

BTW I don't pictures who show the rust on the frame and i already cleaned the grips.
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  #13  
Old 05-05-2012, 02:45 PM
SSMOKE SSMOKE is offline
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This gun is UNBELIEVABLE and NOT in a good way. I just tried to remove the grips to apply grease to the four month ago rusty frame and one of the nuts came out attached to the screw. UNBELIEVABLE and no I don't wrench them down too tightly. UNBELIEVABLE.
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  #14  
Old 05-05-2012, 02:52 PM
Jim Smyth Jim Smyth is offline
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Another way to see if you can find out whats doing the surface rust under the grips is to put the original grips back on after you clean it next time. If you dont get the rust then, you will know its the ivory thats doing it. I myself am not a fan of Ren Wax even though I still use it on Damasteel Blades only because I can get a slight buff on it.

Sorry if the WD-40 is a touchy issue. I wasn't aware there isnt water in it (which I kinda doubt anyway) but my experience over the last 14 years making cutlery tends to confirm that WD-40 isnt good for cutlery and rust. One of the leading Damascus makers told me about RIG and I now use that exclusively. I also have another 30+ year knifemaker bud that swears by Eezox.

So there's lots of choices. I would experiment and see what does it for you.
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  #15  
Old 05-05-2012, 03:09 PM
tomrkba tomrkba is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSMOKE View Post
This gun is UNBELIEVABLE and NOT in a good way. I just tried to remove the grips to apply grease to the four month ago rusty frame and one of the nuts came out attached to the screw. UNBELIEVABLE and no I don't wrench them down too tightly. UNBELIEVABLE.
Not so unbelievable. I've had that happen on many of my 1911's. Just fix it.
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  #16  
Old 05-05-2012, 03:22 PM
SSMOKE SSMOKE is offline
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Yeah maybe I over reacted. I just applied blue loctite.
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Old 05-05-2012, 03:35 PM
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Been using RIG for about 25 yrs with perfect results. You might want to get a tube and place about 2 teaspoons on a regular size micro fiber shop towel. Fold it up and place in a plastic bag for about a week and it will be totally distributed and good for about 5 years.
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  #18  
Old 05-05-2012, 06:21 PM
jbar1tex jbar1tex is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSMOKE View Post
Yeah maybe I over reacted. I just applied blue loctite.
#10 O-Rings from Home depot also help with grip screws. Something like $1.69 for a package of 10. They are in the plumbing section. FWIW.
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  #19  
Old 05-05-2012, 06:58 PM
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JimF4M1s JimF4M1s is offline
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Is it #10 or is it #60 O rings?
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  #20  
Old 05-05-2012, 09:44 PM
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Are you sure it's rust and not left over bluing salts? It takes wiping the gun down quite a number of times to get that reddish tint off. I have a blued kobra that took 3-4 times to get the red to stop showing up on a patch.

Are you storing it in foam or in a high humidity area?
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  #21  
Old 05-05-2012, 11:44 PM
jbar1tex jbar1tex is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimF4M1s View Post
Is it #10 or is it #60 O rings?
It's #60, I stand corrected, but there is 10 of them in the package. My bad.
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  #22  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:44 AM
kb58 kb58 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Smyth View Post
Another way to see if you can find out whats doing the surface rust under the grips is to put the original grips back on after you clean it next time. If you dont get the rust then, you will know its the ivory thats doing it...
This.
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  #23  
Old 05-06-2012, 06:14 AM
ma1cyr ma1cyr is offline
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I have the same thing going on with my EB Centennial that I spent 3k on (I ordered it with a bunch of extra features). EB wants 300 to refinish it with GEN III. I am not impressed.
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  #24  
Old 05-06-2012, 06:32 AM
castnblast castnblast is offline
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A true highly polished blacking, like a London Black or some near equivalent will be the longest lasting rust bluing. Don't know how it compares to hot bluing.
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  #25  
Old 05-06-2012, 01:45 PM
jbar1tex jbar1tex is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ma1cyr View Post
I have the same thing going on with my EB Centennial that I spent 3k on (I ordered it with a bunch of extra features). EB wants 300 to refinish it with GEN III. I am not impressed.
Just inspected mine - no signs of any rust or any dis-coloration. I keep it well oiled and although not shot alot - its not a true safe queen either (BBQ gun that I carry when going out to someplace nice). It sits in a gun cabinet (not a safe) and certainly not humidity controlled either. I am in Texas (DFW). So not alng a sea coast or an area of "great humidty" but certainly gets humid here (its not Arizona for example).

This is my first blued gun with another on order so this thread has peaked my interest. Sorry to hear about the guys having issues.
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