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  #1  
Old 04-22-2012, 02:38 PM
SeamusP13 SeamusP13 is offline
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Para P13 +p?




So I took my CC class yesterday and had a question about ammo. According to my instructor you should never use +p or +p+ on a pistol if it does not say on the pistol or in the owners manual. I looked through the 2002 version of the owners manual online and I did not see anything stating you could use it. Anyone want to chime in on if you can?
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  #2  
Old 04-22-2012, 02:43 PM
45shtr 45shtr is offline
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Having just recently rebuilt my P14-45, after only 5 or six rounds of +P... I would say it is probably not rated for it.
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  #3  
Old 04-22-2012, 02:45 PM
supervel supervel is offline
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Is it an alloy frame?I ruined a P-12 and did not even shoot many hot loads.If it is alloy I would not recomend it.This is a quote.Can you verify it?

Last edited by supervel; 04-22-2012 at 02:47 PM.
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  #4  
Old 04-22-2012, 02:46 PM
supervel supervel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 45shtr View Post
Having just recently rebuilt my P14-45, after only 5 or six rounds of +P... I would say it is probably not rated for it.
Dam,did you mean 5 or 6 hundren rounds?Here's a quote.Can you verify it?

Last edited by supervel; 04-22-2012 at 02:48 PM.
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  #5  
Old 04-22-2012, 02:50 PM
SeamusP13 SeamusP13 is offline
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I have one in alloy and one in steel. Neither have markings stating if they can use it or not. And like I said the owners manual I was using was from 2002 not 1995 when the gun was built.
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  #6  
Old 04-22-2012, 04:27 PM
uponthestair uponthestair is offline
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Here are some comments about +P that appeared in this forum in 2003-2004.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=53564

YMMV
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  #7  
Old 04-22-2012, 05:04 PM
corvettezo6 corvettezo6 is offline
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I have a P13 from the nineties. I put a stronger recoil spring in it even for non + P ammo. I would say if you want to use more + P you get a stronger recoil spring and use one of those little buffers that go onto the base of the guide rod. Some say the P13 is too short for a buffer, but I have had no problems.
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  #8  
Old 04-23-2012, 03:17 AM
SMMAssociates SMMAssociates is offline
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I always tell people to run away from those buffers, but....

If the gun's not marked (at least in a proper manual) for +P, it's probably not a good idea to use them. Nobody should use +P+.... There are no specs for that stuff, and "Fred's" +P+ might be a lot stiffer than "Jack's", resulting in nothing special for one, and a kaboom for the other....

Just IMHO, it's a bragging rights thing anyway.... Ordinary JHP's, when not dealing with winter clothing, will do what's needed. If you're concerned about winter clothing, go with the stuff with plastic in the hollow area. You really don't need the extra power....

Regards,
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  #9  
Old 04-23-2012, 10:12 AM
flintknapper flintknapper is offline
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Quote:
According to my instructor you should never use +p or +p+ on a pistol if it does not say on the pistol or in the owners manual.
It was not common practice in the industry at that time to mark pistols with any ammunition data aside from the proper caliber.

I have a complete set of the literature shipped with my P-13 (1996) and it says nothing that excludes +P ammo. The ONLY mention of ammo...is in the warranty/liability section of the owners manual where Para requires that clean, factory loaded, correct caliber for pistol, ammo be used.

If you stop to consider that the Para was originally designed with Law Enforcement and Competition shooters in mind, it is easy to surmise...they were built to take some rigorous use.

The Para frame (P-12, P-13, P-14) have a wall thickness (at the slide stop hole) that has been increased over standard specs for the 1911. Also, the ramped barrel used...supports the cartridge as much as is possible. Both of these things are mentioned in the literature.

I've shot plenty of +P pressure rounds through mine over the years and aside from more "felt recoil" have had no issues. It should go without saying...that a steady diet of +P/+p+ ammo will naturally result in accelerated "wear" on any pistol, but I would not expect a "failure" from any early model "P" series Para.

Personally, I wouldn't run +P though a Para with an aluminum alloy frame, just because its bound to wear more than the Carbon Steel or Stainless Steel models.

Another thing to look for, is whether or not your pistol was factory built (in its entirety) or if it was built from one of the Gunsmith Frame Kits that were available at the time. The Gunsmith frames were available in both Series 70 and Series 80 configurations.

Last edited by flintknapper; 04-23-2012 at 05:17 PM.
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  #10  
Old 04-23-2012, 03:35 PM
davidkachel davidkachel is offline
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Here's a message from thousands of dead Japanese and German soldiers...

'You don't need +P .45 ACP ammo. The plain Jane variety does the job just fine! You can't get any more dead than dead.'
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  #11  
Old 05-03-2012, 10:42 PM
SeamusP13 SeamusP13 is offline
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Thank you Flint. And yes I forgot I had the original owners manual from the steel '96 one. and yes there is no verbage on whether or not to use it. The main reason I ask is because I have 4 or 5 boxes of mainly Corbon +p.
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  #12  
Old 05-04-2012, 06:26 AM
flintknapper flintknapper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeamusP13 View Post
Thank you Flint. And yes I forgot I had the original owners manual from the steel '96 one. and yes there is no verbage on whether or not to use it. The main reason I ask is because I have 4 or 5 boxes of mainly Corbon +p.
Go for it.

If mine (same pistol) will handle it, yours should too.
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  #13  
Old 05-06-2012, 09:56 PM
G. Freeman G. Freeman is offline
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IIRC, Massad Ayood wrote in the 90's that he finally cracked his aluminum framed P-12 after close to 10K rounds of mostly +P ammo. He was praising the durability of this pistol.

+P's should be fine occasionally. Just make sure your recoil springs are not worn out.
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  #14  
Old 05-10-2012, 12:14 PM
Keith_J Keith_J is offline
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Steel frames are fine, even with .45 Super (if properly converted). I've fired hundreds of .45 Super in a converted P14 with no damage
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  #15  
Old 05-21-2012, 09:27 PM
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kvtcomdo kvtcomdo is offline
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P13-45

Quote:
Originally Posted by corvettezo6 View Post
I have a P13 from the nineties. I put a stronger recoil spring in it even for non + P ammo. I would say if you want to use more + P you get a stronger recoil spring and use one of those little buffers that go onto the base of the guide rod. Some say the P13 is too short for a buffer, but I have had no problems.
Have had one for nearly 2(two) decades.

One of my untouchables (will never get rid of it).

Agree with the above post sans buffer. If your pistol is for range work only a buffer is fine. If one plans to EVER use it for self defense the buffer WILL fail at the most critical moment.

Don't do it if you plan on the gun for personal defense. Get a stronger recoil spring and -- good hunting.
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  #16  
Old 05-22-2012, 02:05 AM
SMMAssociates SMMAssociates is offline
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kvtcomdo:

I'm still not about to endorse +P ammunition in anything I like, but gotta +1 the plastic buffer.

I had one self-destruct (fortunately, on the range) and take out an extractor.

Some of the newer vinyl versions might be safer (this was rubber), but they also muck up the gun's timing and change the recoil spring's function. Put the whole concept into the "really know what you're doing" category. Bubba-R-Us....

(Besides, recoil springs are cheap, and running a few pounds over the "suggested" weight may not function, but you won't hurt anything, nor be surprised two weeks later.)

Regards,
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