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  #1  
Old 11-27-2009, 05:21 PM
OFT OFT is offline
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Why the aluminum feed ramp in the Kimber Pro CDP II?




I took my CDP Pro II to the local gunsmith and requested that he polish the ramp and do a “reliability tune-up”. He told me that as the frame is anodized aluminum, so was the ramp. He said that by polishing the ramp, it could/would remove some or a considerable amount of the anodizing which could cause the aluminum to soften.

As a smooth feed ramp is important for the reliability of a 1911 and especially one built and marketed as a "carry/defense gun", I'm curious as to why Kimber would build a gun with a aluminum feed ramp that should not be polished. Why not build it with a ramped barrel?

Am I crazy or is this a major flaw in the design of this gun? Am I missing something?
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  #2  
Old 11-27-2009, 06:47 PM
baer383 baer383 is offline
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Allot of manufacturers have 1 or 2 aluminum frame guns.
I have a CDP 2 and after only 750 rounds my feed ramp needed to be replaced,sent it to EGW w/barrel George called me back and said he can fix it with a steel replacement,he also commented on the reason i had this problem was the stock feed ramp angle was to steep.
After i got it back and comparing it to my other Kimbers & Springfield's only the Kimbers ramps were too steep my Springfield's were at the same angle as my new and improved CDP.
The ending to this story is a CDP that is remarkably reliable and will feed everything from 230gr hardball to swc to empty shell casings

Go figure

Last edited by baer383; 11-27-2009 at 06:49 PM.
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  #3  
Old 11-27-2009, 06:47 PM
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Kruzr Kruzr is offline
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All aluminum frame guns are the same. It isn't a design flaw, it's the nature of an aluminum frame. How many types of "defense" ammo did you try?.

Last edited by Kruzr; 11-27-2009 at 06:50 PM.
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  #4  
Old 11-27-2009, 10:28 PM
OFT OFT is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kruzr View Post
All aluminum frame guns are the same. It isn't a design flaw, it's the nature of an aluminum frame. How many types of "defense" ammo did you try?.
Not true, not all aluminum frame guns are the same. SA EMP has an aluminum frame, but it has a ramped (stainless steel) barrel…. not an aluminum ramp.

Baer383 said that he had to replace his (after 750 rounds) with a steel ramp and that the aluminum feed ramp angle from the factory was too steep. Sounds like a design flaw to me.

I don’t recall how many types of “defense” ammo I tried, but I fired enough to know that I wasn’t going to trust this gun if and when I need to defend myself.

I did not do a great deal of research before I purchased that gun and that is/was my mistake. I bought it for carry as it was light and I liked the look of the gun and respected the Kimber name. Caveat emptor.
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  #5  
Old 11-28-2009, 12:51 AM
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Kruzr Kruzr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OFT View Post
Not true, not all aluminum frame guns are the same. SA EMP has an aluminum frame, but it has a ramped (stainless steel) barrel…. not an aluminum ramp.

Baer383 said that he had to replace his (after 750 rounds) with a steel ramp and that the aluminum feed ramp angle from the factory was too steep. Sounds like a design flaw to me.

I don’t recall how many types of “defense” ammo I tried, but I fired enough to know that I wasn’t going to trust this gun if and when I need to defend myself.

I did not do a great deal of research before I purchased that gun and that is/was my mistake. I bought it for carry as it was light and I liked the look of the gun and respected the Kimber name. Caveat emptor.
Don't forget that there are tens of thousands of Kimber Pro's out there that function just fine. There isn't a design flaw in the gun that has been produced for 10 years now for all those (including mine.) Yours may have had a problem but since you didn't let Kimber have a go at it, we won't know what the issue was.

We assume you changed the recoil spring when you were supposed to at 800 rounds.
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  #6  
Old 11-28-2009, 01:42 AM
DirtyRod DirtyRod is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kruzr View Post
Don't forget that there are tens of thousands of Kimber Pro's out there that function just fine.
Agreed. My Pro has just under 5k rounds through it now and, after the initial 500 rounds, has been flawless.

Did you request the ramp work because you were having feeding issues?
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  #7  
Old 11-28-2009, 07:07 AM
baer383 baer383 is offline
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Then i guess George @ EGW was wrong when he said that the feed ramp was to steep
I have 6 1911's 4 are Kimbers 1 being a tactical custom 2 (aluminum 5 in ) this gun is strictly a range gun with 230gr fmj only,in the beginning i have shot some federal hydro-shock thru it and it started to do the same thing so from then on i stick with fmj but after 1500 rds (and yes all springs are changed at the proper time)the ramp works but does not look like my Raptor pro(steel)Pro carry HD(steel)it looks a little abused.These guns have the Wolff xp spring like my CDP.

Now some of you guys may have had good success with aluminum i have not but with that said i would still buy another one but like George told me when he was done he said aluminum guns are better off not shot as much as steel.
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  #8  
Old 11-28-2009, 08:00 AM
OFT OFT is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baer383 View Post
Then i guess George @ EGW was wrong when he said that the feed ramp was to steep …………………………………. Now some of you guys may have had good success with aluminum i have not but with that said i would still buy another one but like George told me when he was done he said aluminum guns are better off not shot as much as steel.
Our local gunsmith told me something very similar; “don’t shot it a lot and just run ball ammo through it”.

Maybe it is not a design flaw and perhaps baer383;2415642 and I are the only ones to have this experience with the CDP II.

As far as the performance of the gun, it ran mostly fine at the range, with only an occasional FTF. As for me, I choose not to rely on a self defense gun with that particular performance.
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  #9  
Old 11-28-2009, 08:02 AM
Chuck S Chuck S is offline
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You don't need need a polished feed ramp. It must be reasonably smooth to be sure, but polishing the ramp is not necessary.

USGI M1911s have a Parkerized feed ramp and the process requires sandblasting the surface first.

The ramp in the frame of your pistol is just probably just fine.

-- Chuck
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  #10  
Old 11-28-2009, 06:02 PM
DirtyRod DirtyRod is offline
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To be honest, the feed ramp in my PRO does not look great but it feeds everything. Early on, It was definitely going back to Kimber. After a couple of thousand rounds down the pipe it looks a little better but, more importantly, it feeds JHPs from Federal, Speer, Hornady, Winchester, etc from 165 to 200gr. Another member was told by Kimber that what we were were seeing was normal for an aluminum frame.

I doubt I will put more than 20k rounds through it but I'm definitely comfortable enought at 5k rounds to use it as primary carry.
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  #11  
Old 11-28-2009, 10:36 PM
2nd4ever 2nd4ever is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OFT View Post
... it ran mostly fine at the range, with only an occasional FTF. As for me, I choose not to rely on a self defense gun with that particular performance.
Your choice. Just went ahead and tweaked my PCI bought new 2000. 100% zero FTFs over 8 years with JHP and Ball and never an issue related to that so-called-piece-of-crap alloy feed ramp. The PCI is my only carry

Just my "particular performance"
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  #12  
Old 11-29-2009, 12:27 PM
CoastieN70 CoastieN70 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baer383 View Post
Then i guess George @ EGW was wrong when he said that the feed ramp was to steep
I have 6 1911's 4 are Kimbers 1 being a tactical custom 2 (aluminum 5 in ) this gun is strictly a range gun with 230gr fmj only,in the beginning i have shot some federal hydro-shock thru it and it started to do the same thing so from then on i stick with fmj but after 1500 rds (and yes all springs are changed at the proper time)the ramp works but does not look like my Raptor pro(steel)Pro carry HD(steel)it looks a little abused.These guns have the Wolff xp spring like my CDP.

Now some of you guys may have had good success with aluminum i have not but with that said i would still buy another one but like George told me when he was done he said aluminum guns are better off not shot as much as steel.
George is in the business of selling EGW products and services. This is not to say he's a bad person or he lied but he has a job to protect.

I have been shooting Kimber aluminum framed guns for 10 years without any problems related to their feed ramps. I learned early on that hollowpoint ammunition does not mar or nick feed ramps, magazine followers do. They nose dive into the feed ramp after feeding the last round if they are of the original Colt and subsiquent copycat design. Wilson's, Tripp Research and KimPro's to name a few do not do this because of a redesigned follower.

Even with the older Colt style followers doing their nose dive and maring the feed ramp, it is the lower lip of the follower doing the deed and this is BELOW where the bullet nose impacts the feed ramp and should have no effect on feeding. Now if that same magazine has a week spring or funky feedlip then you have a whole diffenernt feed problem.
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  #13  
Old 11-29-2009, 02:42 PM
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Kruzr Kruzr is offline
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Quote:
George is in the business of selling EGW products and services. This is not to say he's a bad person or he lied but he has a job to protect.
I wouldn't necessarily go that way here. The ramp spec for the 1911 is 31.5°. and professional Gunsmiths will look for that angle. That's not to say any specific gun won't work with a slightly different angle and if you start measuring guns, you'll find many that vary from the spec. but will still feed fine.

If George said the ramp angle wasn't to spec, I don't doubt it. But as we know, a spring change or an extractor adjustment may have also solved the issue. There may have been more than one way to "skin that cat" but it's pure speculation. In any event, if the ramp angle change fixed the issues, then all is well and the gun is now "to spec." and better off for it.
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  #14  
Old 11-29-2009, 04:38 PM
SRJim SRJim is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OFT View Post
Am I crazy or is this a major flaw in the design of this gun? Am I missing something?

Ya, that's probably why Kimber can't sell the alum framed guns and the 6 that got sold, don't shoot well.

Talk to a pistolsmith to learn what makes a 1911 run reliably. 9 chances out of 10, it's not what "the internet" says it it.
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