Help me find one of these...

[warrior1st]

So, this is the first thread I have ever started here. I will try to keep it well-structured, but I'll start with a short description of myself/guns to establish that I am not a retard.

I have been shooting since I was only five years old and growing up in Texas. I moved out here to California and continue to promote the availability of guns as they are being, more and more, restricted here. I own a few 1911s (as well as other pistols and many rifles and shotguns), but I found something that struck my attention (even though I do understand it's danger).

So, I was looking through a book about the evolution of the assault rifle today (don't get me started on how many of the shooters (mostly people who wrote it and their kids) did not have eye or ear protection), but I came accross a picture of a 1911 with the trigger guard removed (supposedly a custom ordered by some general to allow him easier access to the trigger).

Now, I need one of a few things:
1. Help me find a picture of this type of setup
2. Help me find out where to buy one
3. Help me find out who can modify one of mine like this if it isn't available

And, yes, I understand the risks associated with this, but I won't be carrying it, and it will be mainly a novelty piece (resale value isn't an issue because I don't tend to sell my guns, but I definitely do not want a "bubba job").

[BanditSRT8]

Any competent gunsmith should be able to remove a trigger guard.

Now most with ethics would probably refuse to do such a job I think, but I might be wrong.

[warrior1st]

Originally Posted by BanditSRT8

Any competent gunsmith should be able to remove a trigger guard.

Now most with ethics would probably refuse to do such a job I think, but I might be wrong.

I understand that most would rather not do it, but I equate it to a derringer in terms of safety (not very safe, but acceptable if not carried). Since I don't plan on ever holstering it or storing it loaded/chambered (or even cocked), I think it could be fun.

I immediately worried about safety when I read the article (especially after reading that he had a special holster for it (meaning that he carried that thing which I think is ridiculous!)), but it's been growing on me (and it had a very unique, clean look).

His had a lip below the trigger, on the front strap, but I would rather it look as if it was never designed with any form of trigger guard (clean).

[Dwight55]

While I don't know that this is the scenario, . . . being an old military guy, . . . I can easily see myself carrying that weapon with no questions asked.

You take the trigger guard off if you are in a unit/MOS where your weapon is the hand gun, . . . and where you are more than likely to have gloves on when you need that hand gun.

My black leather gloves with green wool liners were wonderful to keep my fingers warm (sorta anyway), . . . but I couldn't shoot anything infantry other than a grenade or claymore

Once that dude is C&L, . . . put it in a regular issue US leather 1911 holster, . . . I don't see a problem if I am earning my hostile fire pay.

May God bless,
Dwight

[johna]

It was a Texas Ranger thing and was carried without a holster. I believe the owner died of natural causes , not from removing the trigger guard.

http://www.sightm1911.com/1911pix/hi...anger_1911.jpg

[Garand_1947]

I suspect the "lip" below the trigger is necessary to support the trigger (?), although the trigger bows might provide that support.

It wouldn't be too difficult to do it yourself with a hacksaw, some files, a Dremel and some sandpaper..but you would have to have the piece refinished (or use a shake-n-bake finish).

Personally the whole idea looks like an accident waiting to happen to me. Texas Rangers or no, if you are trained to rest your trigger finger forward along the trigger guard when not addressing a target, where would your finger naturally go if the guard were missing?

Nope, not for me.

Dave in Memphis

[Red Dirt Dave]

If memory serves me correctly, one such piece exists in the National Firearms Museum in Fairfax, VA. I think it was fully engraved (I haven't been there in some time.)

Another may be in the collection of the J. M. Davis Arms Museum in Claremore, OK. That sounds like a good excuse for me to go there again!

I can remember thinking that whoever had such a modification made is either extremely slow or has sausage fingers.

I do not believe that this modification make a 1911 unsafe, or safe. But it is not for me.

[Stormin'N]

Originally Posted by johna

It was a Texas Ranger thing and was carried without a holster. I believe the owner died of natural causes , not from removing the trigger guard.

http://www.sightm1911.com/1911pix/hi...anger_1911.jpg

Your gun, your choice. as far as being a "clean, unique look",

[Emanon]

Originally Posted by johna

It was a Texas Ranger thing and was carried without a holster. I believe the owner died of natural causes , not from removing the trigger guard.

http://www.sightm1911.com/1911pix/hi...anger_1911.jpg

That thing looks like it doesn't have any front teeth or something.

[BoulderTroll]

Originally Posted by Stormin'N

Your gun, your choice. as far as being a "clean, unique look",

AMEN! That pistol has to be the ugliest gun I've ever had the misfortune of laying eyes on. I think the pink M16 was better looking than that.

[Randall M]

Many in the Disabled community consider the term 'Retard" very offensive
and inconsiderate. A poor choice of words IMHO for a first impression/post.


Randall

[MedicBob]

Originally Posted by Randall M

Many in the Disabled community consider the term 'Retard" very offensive
and inconsiderate. A poor choice of words IMHO for a first impression/post.


Randall

Not too get into a pissing match too early here.

Retard is valid medical terminology. It is also a very accurate description.


Now in the context used is is not the best or even a good description.


BTW,

I like the "look" of the pictured weapon without the trigger guard. I wouldn't want or own one, but I think it looks fine.

[Mark Milton]

Lone Wolf Gonzales who was a texas ranger had his 1911s modified that way.

In all honesty, its a stupid thing to do, unless you have sausage size fingers or plan on shooting with thick gloves on.


I think Lone Wolf and the other Rangers who sometimes did that didn't do it for any actual need, per se. I think they did it because the Fitz Special revolvers of that era also had their trigger guards cut off and they thought it looked what we would call today "Tacti-Cool".

LOL...

Modern gun writers claims to the contrary, back in the 20s, 30s and 40s, most 1911 fanceirs did not carry cocked and locked. They thumb cocked their guns for the first shot.
Most DA revolver shooters thumb cocked their guns back then too.

Thats why the 1911 was popular with the new crowd. Becuase after the first shot, IT COCKED ITSELF! Notice the TINY thumb safeties on the originals?
It was felt to be an advantage over the DA wheelguns, which had to be fired with a long double action trigger pull for fast work.
Ask people who were around then and they will explain that to you.

[Pat-inCO]

Originally Posted by warrior1st

I understand that most would rather not do it, but I equate it to a derringer in terms of safety (not very safe, but acceptable if not carried). Since I don't plan on ever holstering it or storing it loaded/chambered (or even cocked), I think it could be fun.

Keep "thinking". What do you find, built into the derringer, that you do NOT find in a 1911? A HEAVY TRIGGER.

Light triggers in a derringer are 8 or 9 pounds pull, while many run to about twelve.

That's called a "built in" safety.

A good 1911 (let's not even go into the mess you would be making of a good gun) will run in the four to five pound pull.

If you can find a gunsmith that would even consider doing that (DON'T EVEN THINK of using a hack saw) he is not longed for this (legal) business world.

[USMM guy]

Then depending on circumstances and the political climate where you are. Having the trigger guard removed from the gun might be something that the D.A. might succesfully use against you.

My two cents.

[AzDave]

Not my taste. However, if you want it go ahead. I just think you would be ruining a perfectly good 1911.

As said, unless you have sausage fingers or heavy gloves, it serves no real purpose that I can see. Heck, a lot of folks have trouble keeping their finger OFF the trigger WITH a trigger guard.

Also, it seems that no trigger guard would make it pretty difficult, if not impossible, to get a proper two handed grip.

[Operator2]

what's this 'assault rifle' you speak of?