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  #1  
Old 06-30-2002, 08:36 AM
crougeux crougeux is offline
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Is it safe to carry a 1911 pistol on half cock?




Hey guys, I'm sort of new here, but I have a question that has been bothering me for awhile. I got a used Springfield Armory 1911-A1 Mil Spec in a 9mm back in Nov of 2001 for $350.00. It's in pretty good shape and it has alot of play in it but it shoots great! Anyways I would like to know is it safe to carry the hammer down on the half cock notch with a loaded chamber or will something break in there if I go to do it. I'm not all that familar with 1911 pistols and any answers you give me would be greatly appericated!
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  #2  
Old 06-30-2002, 09:25 AM
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Len S Len S is offline
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Full cock and thumb saftey engaged is the best way to carry the gun for self defense. I do not believe that you can engage the thumb saftey with the hammer in the half cock position. If I have read the previous posts on this issue correctly, the half cock shelf is a "saftey catch" in case the hammer should drop out of the full cock position.


Len S
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  #3  
Old 06-30-2002, 12:58 PM
DaveG DaveG is offline
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Cocked and locked, dude!
The only good way to carry your loaded pistol is fully cocked, with the thumb saftey engaged. This is the way the gun was designed to be carried, and it allows you to present quickly and smoothly.
DaveG
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  #4  
Old 06-30-2002, 02:13 PM
Manevitch Manevitch is offline
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Why exactly WOULD you carry with the hammer at half-cock? Let's forget for a moment that the half-cock notch is there for safety, not convenience. Then let's forget that Condition 2 is the most dangerous condition for a 1911. Now what would carrying at half-cock accomplish that carrying Condition 2 wouldn't?

Condition 1 or 3 works just fine. Keep away from anything else.
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Old 07-01-2002, 06:45 AM
crougeux crougeux is offline
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Thanks Guys, I really appericate your answers. The reason why I asked is because my uncle said he saw alot of other soliders do it when he was in the army and they didn't have no problems. I figure I better ask before I try it. Thanks Again!
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  #6  
Old 07-01-2002, 09:06 AM
Wheel Gun Wheel Gun is offline
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You CAN carry in condition two (hammer down on loaded chamber) safely, since the 1911 has an inertial firing pin. This would be almost the same as what you are describing.

The problem is getting the gun to condition two.

This requires you to squeeze the trigger while holding back the hammer. You then must lower the hammer slowly - keeping the trigger back (which BWT takes any firing pin blocks). You must then EASE the hammer all the way down.

The only difference is, if you go to half cock, you can release the trigger earlier and the firing pin blocks (if you have a Series 80 or later Colt, which you don't) will help. Still, if your thumb slips while doing this, you'll get a 9mm hole where you don't want one.

Bottom line: Cocked and locked is MUCH safer. Even if the thumb safety were to be snapped off (which is why I don't like Ambi safetys - seems more likely this could happen) you still have a grip safety. And if THAT fails, as long as you don't pull the trigger, the gun won't fire (that's one purpose in the half cock notch - in case of a sear notch failure). One bit of advice Glock shooters get and should also apply here is, if you carry that gun, use a holster that covers the trigger guard.
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  #7  
Old 07-01-2002, 01:48 PM
swampgator swampgator is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by crougeux
The reason why I asked is because my uncle said he saw alot of other soliders do it when he was in the army and they didn't have no problems.
Remember that most soldiers carry full mag and empty chamber except when in actual combat. That is if local regs actually allow them carry mag in gun.
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  #8  
Old 07-01-2002, 09:50 PM
MulsanneArnage MulsanneArnage is offline
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Yeah, what they said goes......Contition one (cocked, with thumb safety engaged) is only way to go for carry use. Welcome aboard Crougeux!!
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  #9  
Old 07-03-2002, 01:55 PM
crougeux crougeux is offline
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Thanks for welcome me abord! I sure came to the right place to ask questions about my pistol. Thanks again for helping me out!
Right now I carry it in condition 3, but I'll start to carry it in condition 1 so I can get use to it.
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  #10  
Old 07-03-2002, 02:49 PM
Manevitch Manevitch is offline
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If you're concerned about how "safe" condition 1 is, carry your Mil-Spec unloaded and in condition 1 for a week or so around the house. Make sure to mow the lawn and do all those other fun things that require motion, bending, stretching, etcetera. I can guarantee you that if you have a properly fitted holster, at the end of the day the thinb safety will still be on and the hammer will still be cocked.

It only looks scary to the guy at the other end of the muzzle.
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  #11  
Old 07-03-2002, 03:35 PM
JamesP JamesP is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Manevitch
Why exactly WOULD you carry with the hammer at half-cock? Let's forget for a moment that the half-cock notch is there for safety, not convenience. Then let's forget that Condition 2 is the most dangerous condition for a 1911. Now what would carrying at half-cock accomplish that carrying Condition 2 wouldn't?

Condition 1 or 3 works just fine. Keep away from anything else.
What is condition 2, isn't that only for belt fed machine guns???

Condidtion 1 - Mag loaded, chamber loaded, saftey on
Condidtion 3 - Mag loaded, chamber empty, saftey on
Condidtion 4 - Mag empty, chamber empty, saftey on

Just curios,

JimP
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  #12  
Old 07-03-2002, 03:46 PM
Manevitch Manevitch is offline
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Condition 2 is chambered round, hammer down. It's not that it's inherently unsafe, it's just the journey you have to go through to get there. Lowering the hammer on a loaded chamber can lead to accidental discharges. You can imagine what happens to your thumb when the slide cycles. See Wheel Gun's post for more details.
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  #13  
Old 07-03-2002, 05:37 PM
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Condition 1: Loaded, cocked, locked
Condition 2: Loaded, uncocked, unlocked (safety can't be engaged when hammer is uncocked)
Condition 3: Empty chamber, loaded mag, uncocked.
Condition 4: Empty chamber, empty magwell, uncocked.
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  #14  
Old 07-03-2002, 07:41 PM
Dave S Dave S is offline
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Half-cocked is for lever-actions and people that wish to damaged main springs (till one day they have a full-auto 1911).

Dave S

Last edited by Dave S; 07-07-2002 at 03:43 PM.
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  #15  
Old 07-07-2002, 10:21 AM
Dial911inVegas Dial911inVegas is offline
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Hmmm, I can remember this same question being ask in gun magazines way back in the 50's. Even back then the answer was "cocked & locked." I carry mine that way, sometimes with a thumb break holster, sometimes without. But, as Wheel Gun said, always wear a holster that covers the trigger.
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