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  #1  
Old 03-02-2004, 05:38 AM
GSS GSS is offline
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Getting ready for IDPA questions?




Found a local match 30 min from the house, looking forward to giving it a try.

I have been looking at forums trying to get info with few relults.

I am going into this with the intentions of just having fun and getting more hands on with my carry gun.

I will be using my Kimber Ultra CDP II in a M Sparks VM-II holster. I also have a M Sparks single IWB mag pouch, which is giving me fits trying to get a reliable grip on the mag.

Now for the questions:

What type/brand mag pouch is commonly used? OWB or IWB?
What type/brand cover shirt is most commonly used?
With a 7+1 gun and single mag pouch w/7rd mag, can I complete all CoF's?(I can get a 3rd mag, but will I need to have a pouch for it and it on me?)

This reload with retention buisness is a thrill to do reliably. It rained here all day yesterday so started doing some practice. I figured this is where all my time will be lost in a match so I started with it. Only took a few minutes to figure out that something must change.

My practice went something like this; draw, dryfire COM, tac reload, then get back on target and simulate a dryfire with a good site pic, over and over again.

I tried this with a T-shirt for a cover shirt, and with a flanel shirt as a cover. The T-shirt was more consistant for me, but what do you do with your retained mag? I tried craming it in every pocket I had with no consistancy!

If you guys can shead some light on these questions and/or guide me to a link or something where I can read up on these type subjects it would be very much appreciated!

Thanks to all,
Later..
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  #2  
Old 03-02-2004, 06:07 AM
BillD BillD is online now
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If you want to compete, OWB holsters are faster. Fobus makes a dandy OWB cheap double mag pouch. Whatever cover garment you use (try a photo vest with some keys in the pocket) you should be able to hold your arms out straight and your gun and holster be completely covered.

I always put my mag in my front pocket. The vest pockets tend to not be there when you need them. Or you can wear cargo pants and put the mag in the leg pocket.

You will need two mags on your belt, one in the gun and a charging mag in your pocket. Your gun has to be at top capacity 7 + 1 if you are going with 7 round mags.
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Last edited by BillD; 03-02-2004 at 06:33 AM.
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  #3  
Old 03-02-2004, 06:27 AM
FlyinGN FlyinGN is offline
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Later this month I too am going to try a IDPA match for the first time and want to know same questions..

Frank
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  #4  
Old 03-02-2004, 08:53 AM
Bullitt Bullitt is offline
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GSS

Are you going to Gallatin on the 2nd weekend? They are a great bunch of guys to shoot with. They'll tell you all you need to know. The main thing with any match is that you have a fun SAFE day! After one match you'll have a better idea of what's competitive. Your holster and gun are just fine. If you only have one mag carrier don't worry about it. Just shoot and decide if you like it, before you spend money.

As for the reloads, it just takes practice. The best thing to do is to watch other people at matches a try some of there techniques until you figure out what's best for you. In no time you'll start figuring out the tricks and learning how to seek small, LEGAL advantages on stages. Just remember to have fun with it. Your skill will begin to improve with time.
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  #5  
Old 03-02-2004, 11:54 AM
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RickB RickB is offline
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Try the Official Pant of IDPA, the Royal Robbins 5.11. These pants have slash pockets front and rear, and they meet at the side seam; when I do a reload, I lower the mag along my hip until I feel it enter the lip of the (rear) pocket, then I let it go. It drops right in and your hand is then about two inches from your reload. If you're kneeling, or otherwise contorted, it can get a bit trickier. If you are not going to leave your shooting position after the reload, try sticking the mag in the small of your back (IWB); there is usually a small, natural depression there, and the small of your back is always in the same place, regardless of shooting position.
I used to practice the Tac Load exclusively, as the rule book allows the course designer to specify tac loads rather than RWR (better to practice the one that is more difficult, I thought). I was told by an Area Coordinator/SO Instructor that that was no longer the case, and that the two retention loads are absolutely interchangeable. I believed him, and have changed to practicing the RWR, as it is generally faster, from shot to shot. The only time I use the Tac Load any more, is in situations like string two of stage three, of the classifier, where you are shooting from one position, reloading, then moving to a different position before shooting again; I stow the mag while moving between positions, and think that is a little faster than doing the complete RWR before leaving the barricade.
Even when I use an IWB holster, I use an Outside mag pouch. I have a double El Paso Saddlery pouch, and two single Blocker pouches, and just arange them as my attire warrants. You really need four mags. There is no inherent advantage to having 7s or 8s, as individual course designs might favor one over the other, and it will become a wash.
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  #6  
Old 03-02-2004, 01:59 PM
eljay45 eljay45 is offline
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As far as mags go , the more you have the better. Sometimes you might shoot multiple strings of a C.o.F. More mags just makes things go faster. OWB seems to be most popular and faster. I like Blade-Tech. I wear Royal Robbins pants for the reason stated above. My vest is a Domke photo vest. You can go to www.idpa.com and check out some of the most popular gear for the 2003 nationals.

Your reloads are something that you can definately lose or gain time on. They are simple to master though, it just takes practice. I like to practice at home in the evenings. You can get in a few hundred reloads a night just by doing them during Tv commercials.
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Old 03-02-2004, 02:20 PM
PX9109L PX9109L is offline
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For a practical defensive pistol association, there sure are a lot of "somewhat competition style" gear that people use - special pants, special vests, etc...

I want to compete, just for the fun of it. I would love to see a specific box stock class that only allows select pistols, factory loads only and a maximum of 7 rounds per mag. Something that can really test your skills, rather than your budget. I am always looking for an excuse to buy a new pistol, why not have something like a Springfield GI .45 class (7 rd. mags, OTC factory ammo, no modifications of any kind) or maybe a Glock 17 class (10 rd mags., OTC factory ammo, no modifications of any kind), and only a Fobus paddle holster and double mag pouch to keep costs down? It would be a great entry level class to get more people into the sport and would help build skill. The initial equipment expense should be relatively inexpensive at $500-600 and the gun and equipment could easily be sold if someone decided they didn't want to compete or wanted to move to a different class and get new equipment.

I didn't mean to be partial to 2 specific makes of pistols, the pistols could be anything, but it would be easiest if only 1 DA only, 1 SA only and 1 revolver were chosen, rather than a range of guns like the standard classes offer currently. This would need to be a straight forward, no frills entry level division that gets more people interested in the shooting sports. Guns alone are intimidating enough to keep a good majority of people away from IDPA, let alone the thought of competition and actually having to perform under pressure. In general, I have found many shooters to be fairly friendly and accomodating to new faces, but I have also found a lot of shooters tend to be very clicky like high school kids and hot rodders. If it isn't the haves vs. the have nots, its Ford vs. Chevy, or 1911 vs. Glock.
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  #8  
Old 03-02-2004, 02:38 PM
MarkP MarkP is offline
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Px - you just described GSSF and the Single Stack classic.

Mag pouch= outside ,get 2 singles vs. a double for more flexibility.

Shirt/over garment => anything with a heavy fabric.
Quote:
what do you do with your retained mag?
you should have some primary and secondary choices.
Pockets - pants or vest..can't put it in the shirt pocket.
Waistband - front or back .
Pouch - you can always put it back to the pouch - but it may not be the fastest method,especially with a skinny mag.

www.idpa.com and read over the rules to get a handle on things.
Welcome to the sport
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  #9  
Old 03-02-2004, 02:41 PM
BillD BillD is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PX9109L
For a practical defensive pistol association, there sure are a lot of "somewhat competition style" gear that people use - special pants, special vests, etc...

I want to compete, just for the fun of it. I would love to see a specific box stock class that only allows select pistols, factory loads only and a maximum of 7 rounds per mag. Something that can really test your skills, rather than your budget. I am always looking for an excuse to buy a new pistol, why not have something like a Springfield GI .45 class (7 rd. mags, OTC factory ammo, no modifications of any kind) or maybe a Glock 17 class (10 rd mags., OTC factory ammo, no modifications of any kind), and only a Fobus paddle holster and double mag pouch to keep costs down? It would be a great entry level class to get more people into the sport and would help build skill. The initial equipment expense should be relatively inexpensive at $500-600 and the gun and equipment could easily be sold if someone decided they didn't want to compete or wanted to move to a different class and get new equipment.

I didn't mean to be partial to 2 specific makes of pistols, the pistols could be anything, but it would be easiest if only 1 DA only, 1 SA only and 1 revolver were chosen, rather than a range of guns like the standard classes offer currently. This would need to be a straight forward, no frills entry level division that gets more people interested in the shooting sports. Guns alone are intimidating enough to keep a good majority of people away from IDPA, let alone the thought of competition and actually having to perform under pressure. In general, I have found many shooters to be fairly friendly and accomodating to new faces, but I have also found a lot of shooters tend to be very clicky like high school kids and hot rodders. If it isn't the haves vs. the have nots, its Ford vs. Chevy, or 1911 vs. Glock.
No one gets any trophies in IDPA. If you want to compete for the fun of it as you say, come out and do it. Bring 4 mags, your pistol, holster and put your spare mags in your back pocket. Use an old flannel shirt as a cover garment. Opening 3 extra classes for one specific type of pistol seems like a major step back. You would already be in Novice class. What more do you want? You don't have to buy special vests or pants to shoot. I shoot in jeans or shorts and tennis shoes. I wear a vest because it is extremely lightweight and it can get hot on the range. It cost me $15.
We have a class for you and whatever pistol you bring. No sense making up more classes.
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  #10  
Old 03-03-2004, 04:22 PM
bigg_jon bigg_jon is offline
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Just do it - you'll love it

I just started shooting IDPA last year. I now have a whopping two matches under my belt.

I too was concerned about showing up and looking like an idiot because I didn't know anyone there or what to expect. So the first match I attended I didn't shoot and just watched. Boy I was kicking myself afterwards for not taking a gun. It looked like a lot of fun! Everyone was really helpful and explained anything I had questions about. I also found out that they are very lenient with new shooters about what equipment they need. If you don't have a concealment garment - no problem. Just try out the sport and if you enjoy it and want to keep competing, then you can get the other items. Of course this was the attitude of the range I attended; others may be different, but I would hope this type of politeness and encouragement is commonplace.

So anyway, a month later, I went out again and this time I brought my Kimber in it's IWB holster and two mag pouches. I told the lady at the registration desk I was new and she introduced me to some SOs and put me in a squad with only three other people so no one would get upset with my stupid questions. I had a blast and plan on attending most of the local matches this year.

One thing I learned...shoot your own game. Don't worry about the skill levels of the other members of your squad. My first stage had a bunch swingers and sliders and spinners triggered by a pull rope. I had just finished watching an extremely fast shooter blow through the stage and thought I would mimic him. I shoot a couple of targets, reload, pull the rope and wait for some sliding targets to appear. Here they come. I pull up, fire a shot, and watch as my mag falls out of my pistol. In my attempt to be super fast, I didn't get the mag seated fully and there I stood with an empty gun while targets were flipping and flopping and spinning all over the place. Luckily, the SO was a good guy and let me reshoot the stage because it was my first ever IDPA experience. I took it slow and shot to my ability and had a much more successful (and enjoyable) time.

Sorry this got so long, but the moral is just get out there, let them know you are new and have a good time and meet some great people. I'm sure you'll be coming back for more.

Shoot well,
jon
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  #11  
Old 03-03-2004, 05:49 PM
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RickB RickB is offline
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There is no inherent advantage to having 7+1 or 8+1 in your .45. At our club, we try to have stages that require no reload (6 rounds or less), or require everyone to reload (12 rounds or more), so that everyone gets a similar challenge. Some stages might favor 7+1 and some will favor 8+1; by the end of the match, it will be a wash. If you have a 4-target array, having 7+1 might give you an advantage, as you can do a slidelock reload, when the 8+1 crowd will have to do a retention load. On another stage, having the "extra" round might be beneficial.
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  #12  
Old 03-04-2004, 05:31 AM
GSS GSS is offline
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RickB, thanks for your coments, I couldn't for the life of me figure out how 7+1 could be an advantage over 8+1. That makes perfect sence...

Thank you for clearing that up.
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  #13  
Old 03-04-2004, 10:11 AM
K1500 K1500 is offline
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The other way 7+1 could be at a tiny advantage over 8+1 is due to the fact that you have an even number of rounds in your gun with 7+1. Why is this important? Well, if you are shooting at paper only (no steel) and are required to make two shots per target, you get the shoot your last two shots into the 4th target, slide lock load, and resume with the 5th target. The 8+1 guy gets to shoot the 4th target and 1 shot at the 5th, slide lock reload, give the 5th one more shot, and then move on. So the 8+1 guy has an extra transition and has to remember not to move on to the next target. FWIW, the ESP and SSP guys are forced to start with 10+1 (if the gun holds that much) for this reason.

This really is a very small advantage, since most courses have some steel in the mix, which could mess up the above scenario. It's also into the realm of splitting hairs.

There is no problem with shooting 7 round mags. What you shouldn't do is shoot with a mix of 7 and 8 round mags, choosing which one you want to start with based on an analysis of the COF. That should earn you a FTDR (same as a SSP guy downloading their mags to time their reloads). Of course, that's an advanced gamer tactic that you have no reason to worry about when you are just starting out in the sport.

Go forth and shoot IDPA, it's lots of fun!
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  #14  
Old 03-04-2004, 10:26 AM
snokid snokid is offline
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At your first match don't try to keep up with people that have shooting it for awhile, just try to make all your hit's in the center (0 down) part of the target and be safe, watching your muzzle direction (downrange), when moving and reloading make sure your finger is out of the trigger guard. If you do those things you will have a great time. All the gaming things will come later.


Just let the match directer know you are new and you will be made to feel at home and helped along nicely.

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